The Final Argument
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Socrates’ replies to Cebes’ by presenting a final
argument for the immortality of the soul
Some forms are inseparable from the things that
have it—they are essential forms. Cold is
essential to snow, heat is essential to fire,
oddness is essential to the number 3
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The soul is that which brings life to the body.
There can be no soul without life, therefore, the
life is essential to the soul
But if life is essential to the soul, then the soul
cannot die.
Therefore the soul is immortal
Criticisms
Argument assumes that to be alive a body must
possess a separate “thing” a soul
 The proper conclusion is not that the soul lives
forever, but that if there is a soul, there must be
life—
Just as fire is hot implies that if there is fire, there
is also heat.
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The main questions of the Republic
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Is it better to be just or unjust?
What is it for a person to be just?
What is an ideal city? What makes the ideal city a
just city.
Plato connects these moral questions with
fundamental issues in metaphysics and
epistemology: what is knowledge? What is the
true nature of reality?
Book II of the Republic
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Glaucon and Socrates distinguish three different
kinds of Good?
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Which kind is justice?
The three kinds of good
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Good in itself (intrinsically good
Good in itself and for its consequences
Good only for its consequences (or only good as
a means)
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Glaucon argues for the view that justice is a
good, but only for its consequences, and is in
fact bad in and of itself
Socrates holds justice is good in itself and for its
consequences
The Ring of Gyges
Suppose you had a ring that would make you invisible
(allowing you commit injustice without being
discovered).
If such a ring were available how would a just person’s
actions differ from an unjust person?
(1) If there would be no difference, that shows we only
think of justice as good as a means.
(2) If the just person remains just even though he can get
away with being unjust, then that shows that people
consider justice to be good.
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Glaucon: Justice is good as a means of avoiding
suffering injustice. We agree to abide by the rules
of morality so that other people don’t harm us,
not because its bad to do harm (injustice) to
other people
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If the Ring of Gyges example is persuasive, it
tells us that we think of morality in terms of
external rewards.
It does not tell us however that justice really is
only good for its rewards.
People could be simply mistaken: they might
think justice is only good for its consequences,
while really its good for its consequences and for
its own sake.
We need to first discover what justice
is
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Socrates: Justice is easier to discover in a city,
then in an individual, so lets discover what
justice is in a city first, then we can better see
how justice applies to individuals.
So they begin to discuss what an ideal city would
be like
How should the work be divided in
the city?
People should perform only one task.
Why?
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People have different natural talents. A well run
city will have each person do what they are by
nature best suited for.
If you work at one task regularly you will get
better at that task
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372a-372c Socrates describes an ideal city.
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But Glaucon objects.
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The first ideal city lacks luxuries, it is a simple
city.
Socrates says while the simple city still strikes
him as ideal, it might be useful to look into a
wealthy, “feverish,” city.
What new thing do we get with a
wealthy, feverish city?
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WAR!
We need warriors.
Following the principle of specialization, these
warriors need to be those who are best suited
for the task, a professional army.
They also need to be trained appropriately.
Warriors need to be trained
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Music and gymnastic
Both liberal arts and physical training train the
soul
Strict censorship of literary works. Only those
works that contribute to the virtues of the
guardians (later called auxilliaries)will be allowed.