AREMA Committee 30 Fall Meeting
October 25-26, 2012 Tampa Marriott Waterside Hotel
October 25th, 2012
1305: Meeting called to order by Greg Grissom.
1310: Safety Briefing by Riley Edwards.
1315: Attendee Introductions.
1320: AREMA State of the Union.
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AREMA Business 2012 Overview.
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
Call for papers for 2013 AREMA Convention Indianapolis, IN. Due by December 14th.
November 13th Committee chairs meeting. Jacksonville, FL
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Ballots must be submitted by November 1st.
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COM 30 Scholarship must be funded by March 30, 2012. Minimum $1,000.
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103 COM 30 members. 10 New.
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Participation not met on 2 ballots.
1330: Sub Committee Agendas.
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Sub 4, presentations from K-State and UIUC. Concrete tie improvements.
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Sub 2, Wood tie standards re-write.
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Sub 5, Fasteners- will break up into other committees. Formation of testing and
qualification committee.
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Composite Tie Subcommittee will not meet at this session
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Formation of Steel Tie Committee?
1338: UIUC Research update presentation Chris Rapp.
1354: Presentation on Technologies for verifying pre-stressing wire bond by Dr. Terry Beck, K-State.
1410: Subcommittee meeting locations.
1415: Adjourn to Subcommittees.
October 26th, 2012
1105: Meeting called to order.
1108: Safety Briefing
1110: Introductions
1115: Walk through the voting process on the AREMA site, presented by Greg Grissom.
1124: Subcommittee Reports.
1142: Discussion about Spring 2013 meeting. Looking into TTCI.
1150: Voted on location for Fall 2013 meeting. Lake Tahoe, NV in conjunction with RTA conference.
Spring 2014 meeting voted/approved and will be hosted by UIUC.
1152: New Business.

None
1155: Meeting adjourned.
AREMA COMMITTEE 30
SUBCOMMITTEE 2 – WOOD TIES & PRESERVATION
MINUTES FOR FALL 2012 MEETING
Subcommittee 2 met during the afternoon of October 25, 2012 and the morning of October 26,
2012 at the Marriott Waterview Hotel in Tampa, Florida. There were 11 members and 1 guest
present for meeting. There were 2 items of business which were accomplished during the
meeting.
1. A previously balloted proposal concerning the introduction in the AREMA Manual of
some brief language concerning borate/creosote dual treated ties received one negative
vote. The committee agreed on some adjusted wording which we believe would satisfy
the negative voter with the issues he raised. The revised paragraph has been forwarded to
the Committee 30 chairman to be considered for addition to the Manual as it now reads.
2. During the past several Subcommittee 2 meetings members were assigned the task of
reviewing all of the content of Part 3 Solid Sawn Timber Ties to check for accuracy and
clarity. This work has been completed. There were numerous out of date references and
findings of unclear language. We are recommending over 80 changes which we believe
to be editorial in nature. They were forwarded to the Committee 30 chairman with the
recommendation that they be reviewed and included in the 2013 Manual.
3. In addition the committee has recommended a number of changes which were substantive
in nature and which we believe would require balloting before they could be added to the
Manual. It is too late for the balloting process to take place in time for inclusion in the
2013 Manual, but they should be balloted in time for inclusion in the 2014 edition if
approved. There are over 20 items which fall into this substantive change category. Jeff
Broadfoot, Tim Carey and Gary Ambrose are to be recognized for their effort in
preparing the text and computer work necessary for the work to be completed at the
Tampa meeting. Subcommittee chair, Stan Thomas, will coordinate with the Committee
30 chairman Greg Grissom to get the balloted items prepared for that process.
The above actions were reported to the full Committee 30 during the meeting which reconvened at
11:00 A.M. on October 26, 2012.
Subcommittee 4 – Concrete Ties
Meeting October 25, 2012
34 attendees
1.
2.
Presentations from University of Illinois
a. Brandon van Dyke- “Concrete Tie And Fastening Systems – Characteristics Of Loading
Environment”.
i. Review of Wheel Impact Load Detectors (WILD) sites UP and Amtrak.
b. Justin Grasse – “Field Instrumentation Of Concrete Crossties And Fastening Systems”
i. Instrumented test ties placed at TTCI. Results from a small % of total data collected.
c. George Zhe Chen “Crosstie and Fastener Finite Element Modeling”
i. 2D and 3D modeling compared to field and lab data.
ii. Future work load over multiple ties
d. Ryan Kerns- “Analysis Of Mechanics Of Abrasion Of Concrete Tie Rail Seat Abrasion
/Deterioration.”
i. Proposed improvements to AREMA section 30.4.1.6
e.
Amogh Shurpali and Emily Van Dam - “Concrete Material Im,provements To Mitigate the Adverse
Effects Of Abrasion Mechanism on Rail Seat Deterioration.”
i. Proposed Methods of mitigating critical failures in concrete ties.
ii. Add metallic aggregates. Siilca Fune Flash Ash, Anvil top
iii. Mix designs
1. Air entrainment 6% is too much! 3% may be appropriate.
2. Epoxy surface treatment
3. 15% fly ash is better than 30% fly ash.
Committee business was reconvened 8AM Friday Oct 26, 2012.
a. Discussion about two objections 4.9.1 ballot to current fatigue testing at 1.5 x design load.
1. Objection by Jim Beyerl was withdrawn after being shown the balloon edits.
2. Objection by Muhammad Alktar was accepted as an editorial improvement. Steve
Mattson will contact Muhammad for concurrence.
b. Ryan Kearns presented changes to RSA.
i. Subcommittee ballot was tabled to a small working group.
c. Presentation by Kansas State University Dr Terry Beck “Quantifying the Effect Of Prestressing Steel
And Concrete Variable On The Transfer Length In Pretensioned Concrete Crossties.”
i. Std wires, different indent patterns (dots, 2 dots, 4 dots, smooth crisp, smooth etc.), 3 wire
strand, 7 wire strand,
ii. Measure the patterns
iii. Determine transfer length
1. Pull out testing against mortar (180 prisms 69” long), prestressed (to .69P),
independent strain sensors, surecure system, brass inserts and laser speckle imaging
to measure transfer, average max strain set at 95% of
d. 4.2.2 Concrete changes proposed by CXT and UPRR were tabled. They will forward redline version
prior to the next meeting.
e. CXT and Applied Testing Thomas Smith reviewed AREMA chapter for recommended changes were
they see saw items that are missing. AREMA, ASTM, ACI 318, PCI MNL-116
i. Apparent missing subjects that we should consider.
1. Permeability – Should be investigated.
2. Tensile Strength
f. VAE Nortrak Steve Mattson brought up:
i. flex test loading diagram
ii. Table comparing all the different products (wood, steel, plastic, concrete). Ultimate strength
and design strength are mixed in the table incorrectly.
g. Chapter 30 Section 2.7 Test 6: Tie and Fastener System Wear/Deterioration Test
i. Marcus Dersch recommended that L/V ratio be increased to 0.60 (current recommendation is
0.52)
Subcommittee 5, Fasteners, Fall 2012 Meeting Minutes
Attendees:
Scott Tripple (Pandrol), Marcus Dersch (UIUC), Thai Nguyen (Amsted RPS), Dillon Benrόs
(Pandrol), Chris Kenyon (Vossloh), Sara Rzewnicki (Vossloh), Bernie Schulze (CTL), Chip
Batoletti (Pandrol).
New Business:
A. Dersch: Review Test 6 and revise from experience of running test.
a. Dersch to provide review and comments to Test 6
B. Measuring toe-load in service
a. Measure and document toe-load prior to attenuation test – review necessity
Discussion:
A. Pad attenuation testing/requirements: (See Action Item Below)
a. Does this test need to be run assembled or non-assembled or both
i. Assembled test needed to compare pad in system to base case
ii. Non-assembled test needed to compare pads to one another
b. Should this test be run with a ballast/uniformly gradated granular material or a
material that produces behavior similar to that seen in track (rubber, polyurethane,
etc. that produces representative deflections)
i. Scott and Winfried both believe that the granular support is best and most
representative
c. Should an aluminum shim be used as is currently used in EN 13146-3 be adopted
in the AREMA recommendations
i. Scott will speak with David Rhodes to understand why this was originally
chosen
ii. Winfried and Marcus believe that using a shim should be looked into.
That is, instead of following, “The fastening system and rail are
assembled with a 5 mm thick plain reference pad of HDPE or EVA with a
stiffness not less than 500 MN/m measured in accordance with EN 31464. If the fastening assembly is designed for a thicker pad (thickness = dt)
an aluminium plate (thickness = da ) shall be inserted between the rail
and padwhere (da = dt - 5) mm.” we should look into using a reference
pad with the same thickness as the designed assembly while also defining
the material (EVA with defined hardness and other engineering
characteristics).
d. Action Item: Dillon to re-write EN standard for AREMA – due February 2013
e. Action Item: Group to review rewrite prior to meeting in Pueblo
A. Ballot 30-11-05 “failed”(RESOLVED)
a. Appears to already be in manual
b. Investigate 1.7.4.1 (What are Cap Screws?)
i. Chris Kenyon to investigate
ii. Send request of section 4.2.7.1 to Greg Grissom to get previous versions
for clarity (Scott)
c. Integrate 4.15 into 1.7.3
i. Chris Kenyon to do
B. Toe-load Measurements: (Discussed) – Closed no action needed
a. Hank Lees mentioned and the sub-committee recognized that it is important to
measure the toe-load in service. Hank also would like to measure and document
the toe-load prior to the load attenuation test. (See comments a and b below)
i. There would need to be a device for each type of fastener
ii. Not AREMA’s place to make this recommendation
b. Question was raised to whether or not there should be verbiage in the manual
recommending the toe-load should be checked
PAST ITEMS (Pre 2011) – Will return to un-balloted items at Pueblo meeting
i. Ballot A: Move 4.2.7 and 4.2.7.1
1. Insert 4.2.7 into 1.7.3
2. Remove 4.2.7.1 and insert into 1.7.3.7
i. previous versions to help
ii. Ballot B: Moving 4.2.6 and 4.2.6.1
1. Move paragraph A and B of 4.2.6 to 1.7.3.2
2. Adding 3 additional req’s to 4.2.6.1
a. Heat deflection
b. Resistance to ozone
c. Resistance to fluids such as water, acids, alkali, petroleum
oils, and synthetic lubricants (ASTM D 471)
3. Also added statement “For plastic materials belonging to the
polyamide (Nylon) family these tests are recommended to be
executed on specimens dry as molded and conditioned (ASTM D
618)
iii. No changes to 1.7.3.3
iv. Ballot C: Moving 4.2.5 and 1.7.3.4
Subcommittee 6 – Engineered Composite Ties – Subcommittee did not meet, but scheduled to meet via
conference call organized by Rich Lampo.