MHLRG(MIN)14
MENTAL HEALTH LEGISLATION REFERENCE GROUP
MEETING OF 3 SEPTEMBER 2003, 10AM
CONFERENCE ROOM 3, VICTORIA QUAY, EDINBURGH
Present:
Fiona Tyrrell, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive (Chair)
Jenni Connaughton, The State Hospital
Madeline Osborn, Mental Welfare Commission
Ian Pullen, Mental Health and Wellbeing Support Group
George Kappler, Social Work Services Inspectorate, Scottish Executive
David Hall, Royal College of Psychiatrists (Scottish Division)
Shona Barcus, Scottish Association of Mental Health
Adrienne Sinclair Chalmers, Advocacy Safeguards Agency
Christina Naismith, Association of Directors of Social Work
Mark Ramm, British Psychological Society
Andrew Buist, Scottish General Practitioners Committee
Peter Clarke, British Association of Social Workers
Mary Weir, NSF Scotland
Sheriff Robert Dickson, Sheriffs’ Association
Rod Nisbet, Royal College of Nursing
Jan Kileen, Alzheimer's Scotland
Kenny McLeod, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Ryan Stewart, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Linda Campbell, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Karen Nelson, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Pamela Beer, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Rebecca Robinson, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Colin Faulkner, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
David Herd, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Apologies:
David Bolger, Mental Health Division, Scottish Executive
Hilary Patrick, Law Society of Scotland
Bill Reith, Royal College of General Practitioners
Alan Jacques, Alzheimer's Scotland
Welcome and Introductions
1.
Fiona Tyrrell welcomed everyone to the meeting. Fiona informed that she has taken
over as Head of Branch for the Act Implementation Team from Alan Johnston, who has
moved on promotion to the Education Department.
Implementation Update and Discussion of Current Work - MHLRG-48
2.
Fiona introduced the paper which details the work the Implementation Team are
currently concentrating on, as well as a general update on related issues.
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3.
Dr Ian Pullen will take over from Dr John Loudon, who recently retired, as psychiatric
adviser to the Health Department from 1 October.
4.
The 1st edition of the ‘Renewing Mental Health Law’ newsletter invited comments on
the coming into effect date of the Act. Of the few responses received to date, the date of
5 April 2005 was the preferred option, this date has yet to be agreed by Ministers.
However, Named Person and Advance Statements are likely to be brought into effect at
an earlier date.
5.
Following discussion it became apparent that the circulation of the newsletter hadn’t
been as comprehensive as had been hoped with a number of group members having not
received a copy. Dr Ian Pullen suggested that it would be of benefit to distribute the
next edition in an electronic format as well as in hard copy. The availability of an
electronic version from the Executives website was highlighted.
6.
A series of service user/carer consultation events, organised in conjunction with SAMH,
will take place in November. The proposed programme, when finalised, will be
circulated to the group for information and their attendance at a local event to them.
7.
The Implementation Team have been invited to contribute to the following events:
4 September – ‘Changing Homelessness in Practice’
22 September – ‘MHO Services: Structures and Supports Conference’
2 October – ‘IMHiP’
9 and 10 October – ‘Scottish Housing and Support Conference’
12 November , 18 November, 25 November – MWC Roadshow
20 November – MRO Seminar at MWC
8.
The MHO conference on 22 September at Heriot Watt University will also act as a
launch for the research on MHO services. George Kappler indicated to the group the
intention to publish his report in late September.
I. Guidance Training and Information Sub-Group - MHLRG(GTI)(MIN)2
The minutes from this sub group were distributed for information.
9.
Dr Andrew Buist raised the point of the mock Tribunal hearing mentioned at the last
GTI group. He suggested that future mocks be video recorded for the purpose of
awareness of the process for others. Dr Madeline Osborn mentioned that such video
material may exist already in England and Wales. Colin Faulkner mentioned that the
seconded MHO, due to be with the team in 6 weeks, will be involved with the next
mock Tribunal, and is hoped to be arranged in the near future.
10. Fiona Tyrrell mentioned that the Implementation Team are meeting with people who
are responsible for training. The purpose of the meeting will be to focus on the training
of the main professional groups who can and will formally discharge functions under
the Act. An additional small group may be set up to further discuss the issue.
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11. Jenni Connaughton suggested that a representative with specific training expertise
should be involved with the Reference Group and the GTI Sub Group.
12. Dr Madeline Osborn stressed that GP’s should be considered as a central group. Mary
Weir continued that people who do not have a statutory function will also need
training. Broad based material will be important. Christina Naismith suggested
looking at the AWI Training as a model in order to keep things consistent. Dr Ian
Pullen stated that the timing for the introduction of training is crucial. Would six
months before full implementation be long enough? Shona Barcus argued that if
training is given six or nine months beforehand, it would be difficult to retain the new
information while still working with the old act daily.
13. A training representative to be invited to join the sub-group, ?? to take forward.
II. Tribunal sub-group – MHLRG(T)(MIN)2
Fiona Tyrrell introduced the draft minutes and asked the group for their comments.
14. Jenni Connaughton expressed concern over the location for hearings. If a hearing took
place outwith the patients hospital, there would be staffing implications for escorting
patients elsewhere. Dr Mark Ramm stated that not all hospitals and clinics have rooms
available for this purpose. Christina Naismith suggested that some sort of standard
should be set for accommodation. David Herd replied that service level agreements
would be in place and that an accommodation minimum standard would be part of this.
Dr Madeline Osborn mentioned that Tribunal Systems in England and Wales were
extremely flexible in terms of accommodation.
15. Peter Clarke expressed concern over the function of the third panel member. He
thought that the third person should be able to comment authoritatively on individuals
care plans, knowledge of care management would be of benefit. Mary Weir suggested
that core competencies should be used when recruiting members. Dr Mark Ramm
suggested that thought should be given on how psychological expertise is brought into
the Tribunal as Dr Madeline Osborn stated, logistics mean it will not be possible to
match specific members to hearings.
16. Jenni Connaughton enquired with regard to the estimated case load the tribunal system
will handle. Fiona informed the group that a paper was to be issued in the very near
future inviting comments on this.
17. The criteria for the third member to be clarified for next meeting of sub-group.
Estimated case number paper to be issued.
18. Paper on estimated Tribunal caseload to be issued.
III. Mentally Disordered Offenders working group – MDOWG(MIN)1
The minutes from the first meeting of this group were distributed for information.
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Implementation Launch and ‘What you need to Know’ - MHLRG-49
19. Fiona Tyrrell introduced the draft ‘What you need to Know’ paper. She invited the
group to give their views on whether this document would be useful to people.
Primarily the paper is aimed at professionals.
20. Rod Nisbet thought the document was pitched quite well. Shona Barcus suggested that
the document should be accessible to everybody and that a Question and Answer
section may be of benefit. Dr Ian Pullen found the content pretty clear, and found it a
very good introduction to the new Act.
21. The group felt that a clarification of the differences between leave of absence and
suspension of detention would be of benefit. Along with a double sided aid memoir
sheet aimed at GP’s.
22. Jenni Connaughton and Dr Mark Ramm to forward examples of their flowcharts to the
team for information.
23. Fiona Tyrrell asked for any additional comments in writing, please see page 37 for
further details.
24. Q & A section to be worked into document
Any Other Business
25. Angela Hallam provided a short update paper on the MH Law Research programme, a
copy of the report on the conference recently held in Dundee was also circulated. The
Research team are in the process of recruiting a secondee to assist on the MH
programme.
26. Date of next meetings:
Guidance Training and Information Sub-Group: Wednesday 5 November 2003, 2pm,
Conference Room A, St Andrew’s House, Edinburgh
Tribunal Sub-Group: late November, final arrangements to be confirmed with group.
Mentally Disordered Offenders Working Group: Wednesday 9 September 2003, 2pm,
Conference Rooms C & D, St Andrew’s House, Edinburgh
Monitoring, Assessment and Research Sub-Group: late November, to be confirmed
Full Reference Group: Wednesday 21 January 2004, 2pm, location to be confirmed
Mental Health Division
September 2003
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