Health and Wellbeing Policy Group (HWPG)
Minutes of meeting held on 25th March 2015
RSSB Offices, Angel Square
Attendees
Dame Carol Black (Expert Adviser on Health and Wellbeing to the DoH) - Chair
Steve Hails (Crossrail)
Susan Murray (Unite)
Peter Fisher (Costain)
Chris Jones (Network Rail)
Stephanie Fitzgerald (RSSB)
Graham Candy (Atkins)
Claire Dickinson (ORR)
Paul Clyndes (RMT)
Dave Bennet (ASLEF)
Mary Sithole (TSSA)
Darryl Hopper (RSSB)
Shamit Gaiger (RSSB)
Apologies
Claire Burles (EMT)
Michelle Smart (Abellio GA)
Andrew Edwards (EMT)
Jonathon Wilcock (Alstom)
1.
Olivia Carlton (TFL)
Welcome from the Chair
The members were welcomed and the agenda items and matters for discussion were outlined.
2.
Minutes and actions from last meeting
The minutes were approved. All action points from the previous meeting were discussed and items were
either closed or are listed below as ongoing.
3.
Action
By
Deadline
A summary of the John Hopkins and RAND papers to be produced
highlighting what worked and what didn’t with regards to health and
wellbeing interventions.
Health and
Wellbeing Team
(HWT)
Next
meeting
HWT to continue to inform the HWPG on the RTS portfolio mapping
work.
HWT
Ongoing
HWT to report on outcome of Lawrence Waterman meeting.
HWT
Next
meeting
SH and OC to meet (previously postponed due to illness).
SH/OC
31st March
2015
CD to be the champion involved with the work on integrating health
work and standards. PC shall be kept aware of the progress as a
TOMSC representative.
CD
Ongoing
Decisions
a) Ways of working
There was overall agreement to the stage gate approach suggested within the paper. An additional stage gate for
monitoring of implementation was suggested and agreed.
Action
By
Include another stage gate for monitoring of implementation.
HWT
The delivery plan for 2015/16 was discussed and it was highlighted that baseline measures would be needed for the
success measures identified. There was further discussion around the linkages between work to identify baselines
and key indicator work that falls under the remit of the HEG. Emphasis on ill-health prevention as well as
management:
Action
By
Review success measures and consider baselines to be able track progress. Review in
line with HEG and seek input from CJ.
HWT/ CJ
Health Steering group members to consider championing specific projects from plan.
Members of
group
Look at ill health and management of health with a focus on prevention rather than just
on management and cure.
HWT/ HWPG
Consideration of gender was also raised. Agreed it is good to widen the scope for all diversity not just gender. SG
mentioned a project with NSARE which is in its infancy but will raise with the group when more fully developed.
b) User requirements for health data
The project was outlined; aiming to identify user requirements, common health definitions and the classification of
system outputs.
Group discussed the output of the project from the perspective of risks and opportunities and the level of detail
required as well as the purpose of such system. Key pints were:

Purpose of data collection: benchmarking within the industry and outside the industry, monitoring trends
and targeting investment to improve health and wellbeing

There is a need to look at what needs to be added to existing data collection to make it more accessible and
useful for wider industry

Emphasis on minimal, easy to collect, and useful data. Aim to initially provide a higher-level view of data;
otherwise will be too complex at a system level

Need to consider and address the risk of data protection act

Group can capitalise on learning from NR implementation of data system
Peter Fisher agreed to be the champion for this project.
DECISION - HWPG agreed on the progression of the project to SG2 and return to the group once this phase is
completed.
c) Standards scoping project
Project outlined which would scope existing standards and provide a baseline of current and best practice
Discussion: key points:

Level of detail considered; recognition that there are many different standards out there. With many
companies having their own

Recognition that there is benefit in having a consistent approach to standards across the industry

NR and TFL are in the process of having both companies standards accepted at their controlled
infrastructure

NR is moving away from standards into rules supported by guidance. This approach should be considered

This project should provide the baseline and a higher level overview with a mechanism for pulling out
greater detail post project if the Policy group felt it needed

This work should highlight how big this problem is and identify weak area that need addressing

Focus should be given to prevention
DECISION - HWPG agreed on the progression of the project to SG2 and return when completed to discuss
recommendations and next steps if appropriate.
Action
By
Change the wording of 2.1 so that it is clearer. Intention to scope out what the issues are,
not enforce mandatory standards.
HWT
Meet with CJ- re NR approach to standards as input to this work.
HWT/ CJ
4. Discussion
a) MD Information (4 pager)
Key points:

Overall agreement with structure suggested in paper

Advised that it needs to be within 4 pages or MD’s won’t read

Should be part of a wider engagement. Perhaps a repeat similar to the ISM meeting

Context of what is the overall picture of health and wellbeing within industry

Give people the opportunity to see what good looks like

Highlight progress made through franchising

Promote the responsibility deal
Action
By
Create a draft of the document- run it past the group, get the design looking right, and put
it out for comment.
HWT
Considerations for MD information: links and follow up with the Industry safety meeting.
Successes to date (e.g. Franchising), info on responsibility deal. Use of rail case studies
(Costain, Crossrail, Southern).
HWT
Consider use of maturity models already in use for Thames Water, Olympics. PF can assist
and support this.
HWT
b) Training project
Background to project so far outlined including qualitative interviews and literature review. The idea for a
competency framework to provide guidance for managers on what is expected of them arose from this background
work. Working closely with NSARE who want to use this in the development of their own training, which is our route
to the market and will be helpful in terms of a consistent message. Seen as a good idea to be discussed with the
HWPG once a draft has been designed.
It was suggested that the competency matrix should be generic as what a line manager needs to know is common to
many industries.
Identified champion for this project is Graham Candy.
DECISION - HWPG agreed on the progression of the project to SG2 and return when matrix completed (phase 1) to
discuss recommendations and next steps if appropriate.
Updates from industry:
RSSB
RSSB is developing a H&S strategy for industry which John Abbott is leading on – it has been agreed that the HWPG
will be leading on the health element of that strategy.
The Rail Technical Strategy is responsible for enabling innovation within industry. RSSB has linked with the RTS
portfolio mapping and one of the maps is looking at H&WB. HWPG will own the health and wellbeing portfolio map
and will provide input in due course.
HWB – franchisingHealth and Wellbeing elements within TPE and Northern ITTs is stronger. A workshop will be planned to improve
health and wellbeing information. A wider group of people should be present for the discussion outside of TOCS to
utilise their expertise.
ORR
Baseline position paper is going through ORR consultation and in front of Board May 19th 2015 and then should be
published beginning of June.
Draft evidence matrix developed. It will provide information as to what inspectors would look for if in a
station/depot with regards to management of diesel fume.
Employee Health Training plans. ORR have had various discussions with NEBOSH and Construction College and
various TOCS. TOCS have a keen interest to run level 3 occ health training course. ORR are piloting the course to try
and build the business case so when NEBOSH want to look at their training they have the course and the business
case made. Hopeful NEBOSH will accredit course.
AOB
Monday 28 April is the TUC's International Worker's Memorial Day.