Hyman
Mark
Josh'Ua
Brother
October 3, 1973
Jr.
Skrine
'
C.
By
Taped
&
LOve'
A.
Edgar
FounderBiS~op
Henry
,
Brother
.
Inc,
Fratemjty,
Phi
Psi
Omega
of
FoUIider
A
with
An Intervie~
~y
Transcribcd
Conducted,
,
father
his
knO\V
wcrc
parents
there?
was
-
I
. .
in
Fraternity
another
basis
the
on
organized
191
we
so
them
questioned
ever
has
nobody
and
years
fifty
or
forty
maybe
for
started
"'e
think
I
nothin&
change~
would
have
to
Jot
pay
to
had
you
had
we
California,
in
out
way
world
the
and a new ritual
though
was
we
and
nobody
with
founding
dIe
in
spent
we
and
committee
revision
on
ability
intel1ecntal
high
of
men
and
schools
of
Presidents
and
know
I
there
on
lawyers
four
or
three
had
we
that
on
Fraternity
sixteen
with
constitution
new
a
draft
to
years
two
for
Committee
Constitutional
a
existence
in
had
we
through
it
see
you
till
by
stand
Fraternity
the
outside
it
do
you
difficult
and
less
the
and
poor
the
help
to
want
you
anything
do
and
out
go
can
you
Uplift
in
principles
Omega
in
man
every
\vhole
the
change
to
them
called
we
turks
young
of
group
a
with
carne
turned
bad
name
his
recall
don't
1
man
this
when
Conclave.
Charlotte
the
to
came
we
until
Omega
in
pressures
real
no
had
we
concerned
I'm
as
far
as
next,
the
but
it
believe
wouldn't
you
affairs
risk
the
ran
overcome,
to
had
we
obstacle
big
the
was
that
comse
Of
Love:
A.
Ed2Br
Founder
attempting to establish Omega other than obtaining administration
whose
-
time
there-
said
I
ideals
high
tampered
w1)ole
States
four..
think
I
three
had
we
the
south
.'.
that
-,~
the
at
around
be
to
of
men
organization
our
of
a
United
constiturional
that
on
pro~
that
is an activist but
Jacksonville,
from
from
know
latter
e,astenceat the time but it was a caste,.youhad to be fair or you had to havemon-eyto .get
in there.
-.
6
McPenlin
the
ought
were
wasn't
us
cost
it
and
$30.000 dollars making that new constitution
OF
1
,
boys
of
much
we
you
Jimmy
is
Fraternity-
wowd
three
wasn't
too
Nothing
founding
1
There
a
that
LoIe:
entire Omega
or
Two
principles
A.
expenses
theIr
sca.ttered au over the
and
This
and
start
four
constitution
Ed~r
Founder
of the best minds in the
month
a
what
that's.
the
a
with
off
fortlmate than yourself
19
A.LovG:
Hvrnan:
dollars
50
...
Lov£a
Hvman:
good
a
questioned
that time, I-hope
PAGE
Founder~r
and
to
off
got
.fi1"endSlilp
A.
Mark
Ed~ar
Founder
Mark
them
sending
in
overcome
to
had
you
that
obstacle
difficult
most
single
the
was
What
Hyman:
M;t-rk
acceptance at Howard?
there of being suspendedor even expelledftom the schoo1for breaking tIJe)a\vsand foni1ing
an organization without the consent of the university bodJ' committee on student
program of the Fraternity to retransfonn the Fraternity into a social action committee or
organization when the Fraternity is not m.eant for that, and I said and so many people since
organization is not an activist
organization~...~I said "you can do anything you want to do under dtree of the four cardinal
and Perseverance means when you want to start on something hard
two years and nearly
because all tile men were
Malic Hvman: Bishop another question, if you had it all to do over again what aspect of the
change?
has ever questioned the preamble except at d1e Conclave in Charlotte and nobody has ever
of
'.
.
6
OF
off.
French
the
from
some
told
began
we
and
the
to
constitution,
the
Fmtemity:and
we
group
we
Gamma
into
written
had
and
that
thing
anotllcr
and
born
was
Fraternity
the
your
and
yourself
with
minded
like
they're
because
friends
but
tight
will
sisters
figh~
will
brothers
friends
and
brothers
of
Fraternity
a
as
born
were
we
because
Friendship
saying
freely
it
translate
we
and
Soul
the
to
Essential
is
Friendship
Psukis
Philia
Ophelema
greek
in
motto
our
cboose
to
us
helped
who
one
the
was
he
and
incorporated
already
was
which"
name
a
take
wouldn't
we
so
America
in
ftatemities
incorporated
known
the
aU
1isted
was
there
which
in
book
a
got
bc-
and
greek
knew
be
because
motto
and
name
otlr
get
to
really
us
helped
he
and
did
we
then
Fraternity's
about
more
knew
all
we
say.
to
difficult
its
say.
to
difficult
its
say,
to
difficult
Its
Love:
A.
Ed2'Br
Founder
shield
our
on
Fraternity
and
Friendship
have
we
why
d1ars
and
there
on
it
put
we
Friendship
inseparable
were
we
hill
the
on
were
we
years
four
all
through
and
friends
became
we
met
three
we
time
first
me
met
we
time
first
the
Class
Freshman
the
of
president
for
Coleman
Frank
nominated
!
Friendship
our
wanted
we
club
social
a
and that's what it was
those
among
tl1at
University
chapter
year
next
1936~Frank Coleman had written it
Frances
among
local
a
be
the
and
chapter
a "national
Se
the
Howard
from
to
since
them
how
because
the c]osest affinity
campus
came
nine
the
of
expel
would
on
take out of our constitution
of
President
the
debaters
they
Beta
them
choose
is
it
and
Life
to
Essential
is
to join because its a social club but call it a Fraternity
the
on
Organizations
had
we
six
&om
that's
and
relationships
blood
closer...that
earth
is
tlIem
Student
that
compromised
usual1y
you
and
friends
your
and Friendship
2
throw
Club
Georgia
PAGE
the
word
Lincoln
in Atlanta
nine,
of
a
in
that"we
would
of
believe
aspirations
your
and
ideals
other
tlley
three
we
demanded
Gemlan
heard
well
Fratemity
local
Which
that
School of Liberal
the
and
chapter
a
Basileus
didn't
haven't
up
set
we
year
too;;;...they
each
Presidents
of
we
we
on
moving
Jove
the
friends,
our
of
Grand
averages
"B"
had
all
Mark Hyman:
believe
president
the
had
never
had
we
Club
always
didn't
we
men
want
we.-don't
said
we
campus
the
on
already
Fraternity
the
join
you
don't
Why
us
hear
\vouldn't
you
heard
be
to
men
be
to
risk
that
run
to
willing
were
we
that
know
we
sir
went
we
chapeL...so
after
directly
office
my
in
get
appears
name
whose
nere
\vbo's
everyone
want
J
anyhow
man
nervous
very
a
on
those
into his office after
chapel and he stressed Gentlemen do you don't you know that you have made yourself liable
to expulsion £rom the University
suspension maybe e.xpulsion from the University
yes
to
placards
T]1irkieJd
President
chapel
at
day
that
born
were
we
when
and
born
be
would
we
fact
the
naming
that
placards and tacked them up all up on the trees on the hill around Howard Universi'ty aiid all
it was only
founder gave Omega its name, its motto and its color?
discussed it and Earnest Just, Professor Just he was, gave us a lot of gecd help, because be
that people can have on
you got to take your relatives wbether or not tlley're wished on you.. ...but you choose
pur-ih-a
but the very next
Arts, College of Liberal Arts and the Teachers College, fourteen men who
on
and
flyers
on
names
their
put
and
men
other
fourteen
initiated
and
on
went
just
we
so
affairs
smdent
on
committee
faculty
the
before
hearing
a
to
went
we
organized
we
when
and
flat
down
it
tumed
because
join
to
went
though
never
we
organization
the
for
approached
wCr'e'
us
of
two
and
home
from
years
four
for
dollMS
50
got
1
month.
a
dollacs
50
him
sciIt
tlle
are
play
own
our
as
. : ~~ . ;' its
tbree
in
my
on
their
of
life
the
out
were
tl1ey
their
after
on
CarT)'
they'd
and
an
establishing
on
go
give
could
we
guarantee
-'an
have
to
going
were
you
States..~:.
will
it
think
there
in
brotlJers
they'd
only
a
cultivate
shou1d
Fraternit}'~
smdents
once
of
ideals
and
United
I
.. ,-""" .
the
improve
life
tile
have
to
'\V~e
just
of
plaques
members
that
the
years,
humble
wouJd
the
said
!
know
to
need
Fraternity
change.
got
I
higq
chosen
it
we
in
more
- future
three
its
same
have
wanted
we
Action
or
the
fecI
for
improve
the
to
founded
would
we
areas
Black
little
that
I
they
life
of
would
three
we
college
the
SO
1
Cor
think
thought
we
it
pledged
but
Social
any
its
very
today.
happy
bow
quality
the
black
the
in
that
Tole
to
be
can
yes
become
of
one
and
find
we
know
HoWard or other co11cgcs?
make
prediction
your
I
who
how
us
every
6
change,
to
have
as
that
men
the
days
life
little
very
bow
men
men
the
has
OF
expresses.
it
as
ob
with
it
3
participate
essential
the
you
consider
don't
yes,
lifestyle,
consider
as
our
of
should
with
reside
proud
Founder Ed~nr.4..
commwuties in which they might separately go because they had been inspired by the
idealism of the Fmre~ty that they would inBuence the life of dIeir communities and that dle}'
would enjoin to make: themselves relevant to the community and not to be an exclusive club
and lose contact with.:;pe:opIeof the community.
Dh
those
part
in
think
You
off.
asked
m
what
in
about tbc next 601"
you
they
the
after
University
Howard
influential
PAGE
consider
I
I'm
that
patterned
organization
as
they
no"'
stood
has
start
guarantee
the
is
you
every
America?
change
you
and
organization
really
think
you
mid
lAve:
Did
Hyman:
Mark
Ed~r
Founder
it
as
large
as
being
it
of
dreamed
never
we
it
expected
never
We
A- ,~v~=
important
I
structure
an
what
would
Founde:T 'Ed~3TA.
Love::
improve.
would
Omega
from
which
in
them
of
ISO
wall
on into
lAJve:
done 61"ycars
do
little
communities
the
graduation
~~.t"
Mar{(Hvin!h:
in
is
in social
A.
Edf!ar
Founder
people
Love:
Constitution
American
and
life
very
with
remain
tbrou8b
A.
What
Hyman:
Marlt
become
our
Ed2"ar
Founder
young
of
end
social
has
group
of
the kind of leadership that men like the founders had been or were and the President of
\\'e
had
finjtum.
Did you have anything in mind about how
of college?
Mark Hvman: You already answered part of the next question
But how does it feel to have
spawned an organization that now has 378 chapters and 10,000 active men?
different fields, one in physics, one in medicine and one in the ministry, would get together
and fonn an organization that would be as large and as influential in the life of America and
.
it?
organized
you
of
four
the
when
fill
would
Omega
think
y'ou
did
void
What
Hvman:
Mark
6
OF
4
PAGE
and
on one night's entertainmcnt
organization?
don't
I
school
spend
life
a
as
much
if
them
ask
and
letter
personal
a
them
write
active
not
were
who
prominence
of
men
the
all
of
Moulttie
to
wrote
!
back
them
get
we
how
question,
hard
work?
active
for
Omega
to
you
do
How
fields,
there
in
outstanding
are
they
but
Fraternity
the
with
not
are
who
men
outstanding
some
have
we
that
mentioned
just
You
Hyman:
~f.arl<
man
a
us
for
enough
big
not
they're
be.
may
name
their
big
bow
or
be
may
they
popular
how
care
don't
we
them
want
don't
we
character.
no
with
life
school
of
phase
some
in
outstanding
they're
becallSc
or
character
any
without
athletes
great
they're
because
just
men
want
don't
we
careful
VCIY
be
to
got
we
mistakes.
made
we
sornetimes
often
so
that
say
don't
I
out
put
be
to
once
who
men
get
you
mistakes.
some
Founder Ed~arA. Love: Not
made a mistake he only chose twelve disciples and among them a traitor. you can't expect
Omega to have 30,000 in there without mak~g
in a
while who don't belong in there but are in there and stay in there unless he does somet\ung
master
the
say
to
sony
rm
are,
them
of
all
not
th~
of
all
Men
Omega
think
you
Do
but.
here
situation
duplicate
a
may
This
Hvman:
Mark
living
are
day.
my
in
envisioning
were
we
through jts four cardinal principals
an
as
and
through
get
them
of
some
know
I
to
going
names
a
back
men
these
active
particularly
.
brother
today
penny
one
to
him
help
to
scholarship
a
as:
one
weakness
Fraternity
the
to
back
given
because
was
I
the
That's
Love:
A.
reclaim
we
suggest
by way of the four cardinal principles?
that
question
identifiable
an
weakness
a
him
they would take out a life membership
membership would cost on one night's en1ertainment
a
hard.
have
never
gave
it,
me
send
to
ago
years
some
the, honor of the Fraternity
just
was
that
have
to
of
kind
we
he's
we
received
never
f
members
inception
have
That's
and
name
his
call
won't
I
man
sustaining and upholding
don't
we
think
millionaire
a
he's
now
FolJ(1der F-.,d~3r
you
Do
Hvman:
Mark
up to your initial
Love:
A.
Ed!!ar
Founder
requires
Alright
Hvman;
Marl<
in
strong
as
just
are
think
I
who
ar1d
outspoken
are
who
Fraternity
the
in
men
outstanding
some
find
I
yet
i~
to
closer
growing
it
see
do
I
that
s~
can't
I
No.
Inve:
A-
Ed~ar
Founder
Marlt Hvrnan: Social Action. lets get into dlat. Is tl1e Fraternity as you see it today growing
closer to the ideals of the Fraternity envisioned by you and the other founders at the
inception ?
as
whose mind is not capableof making at least the averagethat the Fraternity
d1ere'sa place for mediocre men but not in Omega.
andone
believe he's even financjaJ with the Fraternity.
level.
decent
a
on
Jife
social
our
keep
must
we
but
talk
just
Man
..we're
names.
Trent,
around
their
in
them
Oxley for that
looked
bring
didn't
1
No
said
heblamed
there~
Miami.
from
Evans
James
Leonard..
Not
name.
first
his
forget
I
Evans,
one,
But
person
~
the
was
Washington,
and
man
good
a
wanted
they
OxIey
and
in
in
Evans,
Bethune
underStalld
r
cabinet,
Black
the
in
know
you
did
men
the
of
many
How
as
far
as
since
ever
it
had
He
but,
Yeah
.t)~£!
J
A.
Edgar
Founder
Administration?
Roosevelt
the
during
was
This
HvrtJan:
Mark
~
and
of
thought
well
so
was
he
subcabinct
cabinct
the
of
out
came
he
then
and
Labor
of
Assistant
the
was
be
House,
White
the
to
wire
diTect.
a
had
be
that
know
people
few
very
in
OxlC)1
La~7ence
the
to
color
of
man
a
name
to
time
that
at
enough
guts
had
had
President
the
if
Bench
Supreme
CoUrt~
that's
a HastieBi1lHastie,
wehave
a man
many.
their
so
remember
remember
Omega
an
be
to
when
forth
Men
was
All
Ms.
in
don~
r
man.
you
6
time~
bad
a
do
OF
we'l1
housing
men7
S
at
me
those
PAGE
happened
so
their
"",
alrighL
of
the
Some
just
he
,
caught
he's
He
Lnve:
that's
Yau
..ove:
Oh.
Hyman:
Marl<
Suprenle
the
on
been
have
should
and
Man
Omega
an
was
who
Judge
Federal
first
the
had
we
places
higl1
in
Men
Omega
many
so
have
we
have
we
Oh
A. '-.nve~
no,
Omega
-
no
him
Ed~arA-
think
Leonard
when
them
of
all
that
for
1
Hyman:
T
Men?
Omega
done so much
a
all
A.
Ed!!ar
Founder
Edl!ar
{.()ve:
Mari<
Db
Hvman:
Mark
the privilege
character
brought
you
and
Washington
Horn
their
training
Founder
picked
they
him
for
Founder
A.
Fmnk
Home
impact
That's
Edp:sr
Founder
some
Hyman:
Mam
bsd
we've
know
I
live,
we
which
in
society
present
the
shape
to
done
has
Omega
think
you
do
what
elaborate.
would
you
maybe
ago,
while
a
something
on
touched
You
H,,-man:
Mark
mem,
of
few
a
have
do
we
name,.,..
baQ
belong in there who carry the name of the Fraternity and like to boast of their Fraternit,y but
at the same time are not living up to the ideals of the Fraternity it 1,Yivestile Fraternity a
on our ~unities'?
who is the onJy negro I know of who has had a direct wire to the White House,
Washington and for Congress through his influence so that they gave him
of calling direct and I don't know of any oth~r negro who has been so honored.
know.
that all the men were
-"
youg6t in there [lIst'
Weaver,
just talking off the top
don't
who
there
in
men
some
having
in
is
it
weal--ness
a
have
we
If
Love:
A.
Ed~3r
Fotmder
question.
a
just
was
that
but
got
we've
that
strcngths
the
of
think
can
1
and
us
to
wrote
have
.
much
too
~';';,i",.-
today
you
questions
Omega
~
to
end
an
trick
little
a
have
you
to try to l1se influence
while
a
after
because
far
too
it
cany
whatever
my
about
but
Bishop
put
;\
Omega,
another
or
how
some
to
got
have
not
its natural in any organization
one trick younger than the other trick
in the F.ratemity
office
~;;.
of
duplications
Omega,.
past
the
were
about
talk
them
about
.
of
just
and
Omega,
some
on
of
and
go
just
twenty
We
mu$t
we
a trick tbere
some
future
the
about
be
to
got
at ,our Grand Conclaves
we've
bere
A.
I.1l!!!!!!~r'Ed~ar
politicking
Love':
that you ~ould'1ik~~to say you~goright ahead.~"
anything
but
about
things,
dIe
bad
of"
say
to
we
some
here,
Jike
would
expired
about
...
to defeat somebody else for
he wanted to be Grand Chancellor so bad that be was ready
we
so
a
wit1J
there
to tile haIldling
was
he
but
report
that
final
Conc],ave
next
my
hjrnself
made
our
1
time
call
be giVC1\
time
that
at
day would
it
we
and the first whole
completed
we
that
when
much
how
saturday
see
on
then
well
motion
a
and
make
to
and
else
Meeting
nothing
and
call
role
a
for
constimtion
the
prompted
with
minUtes
been
had
and Conventional
constitution
the
Conclave
of
five
forty
anywhere
get
took
someone
I
couldn't
and
to dismpt the Fraternity to get himself elected and he defeated the reporting of the
Constitutional Committee by calling for a role call vote on every portion put before tile house
wanted
letter
he
black
way
tile
telegram
word
consriturion
the
hundred
gave
two
a
and
sent
1
the~
but
in
go
delegates
couldn't
I
young
of
time
~e
at
panners
in
was
}
it
delegates
his young turks and tbe
championship football game but you see and they wanted to vote
us down and voted for a constitutional convention to meet within the year and appropriated
15,000 dollars for this committee that the Conclave national organization would pay the way
and expenses of all the undergraduates delegates to this Conclave all the delegates were
invited to come but the graduate chapters would have to pay the expenses of their own
6]
the
over
Omega
within
triumphs
personal
your
of
some
been
have
What
Hvman:
Mark
and I wish J ~ad copy of it to read to you and they say when they read the telcgram the
house got up and cheered they say that took the house they weren't going to change
anything.
,
highlights.
..
the
can
wife
in
I
hea\'Y
my
me
for
and
so
me
held
them
of
to
been
some
given
have
that
..
OF
6
them
good
feel
entenainment
me
made
lovely
entertaiim1ent
me
the
the
given
and
been
have
.'.
we'll Use highlights.
gone
Have
have
men
I
Lf}ve:
the
which
that
to
Edf!:ar
cities
plaques
lift
highlights,
PAGE
hardly
the
and
various
Founde~
A.
Matlc Rvrllan: "Alright
but
triumphs,
them
caJJ
wouJdntt
]
A.
F.d~r
Founder
T~ve:
years?