EUROPEAN COMMISSION
DIRECTORATE-GENERAL FOR EDUCATION AND CULTURE
Education and vocational training
Vocational training and adult education; Erasmus+
Brussels,
EAC.B.2/AB/fa Ares (2014)
File code: 2008/DGVT DGFP/002
MEETING OF THE DIRECTORS GENERAL FOR VOCATIONAL TRAINING
ROME, ITALY, 13-14 OCTOBER 2014
DRAFT MINUTES OF THE MEETING
I. Welcome by the Italian Presidency and the Commission
The Italian Presidency (Mr Salvatore Pirrone, Director General for Active Labour Policies,
services for employment and training, Italian Ministry of Labour) welcomed the participants
and informed the meeting about the High Level Summit in Milan on employment few days
earlier, with the Chiefs of Governments. The conclusions called for reforms in the labour
market (to link education with employment, progress towards dual education and strengthen
the role of the public employment services) and acknowledged investments in education and
human capital were indispensable for the future, as mentioned by Commissioner Andor at the
event.
Mr Antonio Silva Mendes, Director for Education and Training: Erasmus+, on behalf of the
Commission, underlined that several strategies are under revision (Europe 2020, ET2020 and
the Bruges Communiqué) and it was necessary to deliver a coherent package, including VET
and Adult education, to establish where best to focus European cooperation to fight
unemployment and the risks faced by the 70 million low skilled people. He reminded the need
for action-based steps, like the Call on apprenticeships, the Youth guarantee and the European
Alliance for Apprenticeships, backed by 200 companies offering more than 100.000
placements.
He explained that the new Juncker Commission, with its 10 objectives, outlines the need to
reinforce the employment component of EU policies; this will imply that the VET and Adult
Learning policies will be transferred to DG EMPL, due to changes of portfolios. The
agencies, Cedefop and ETF will also be transferred. He reminded that the cooperation with
DGEMPL is already long standing based on joint initiatives, while the change will create
more opportunities, for example with the European Social Fund.
Continuity and good coordination needed to be ensured among the 2 DGs and he introduced
Mr Detlef Eckert as Director of DG EMPL, who will be the Director in charge of VET and
AL, in the new configuration. Mr Eckert explained his competences, Europe 2020,
Employment policies, and emphasised that the Juncker Commission is making an attempt to
work differently, with the set up of Vice Presidents, whose role will be to coordinate the work
of other Commissioners, to allow a much more integrated approach in European policies, in
the future.
Commission européenne/Europese Commissie, 1049 Bruxelles/Brussel, BELGIQUE/BELGIË - Tel. +32 22991111http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/education_culture
D:\106745702.doc
The Italian Presidency welcomed the re-organisation and stressed the need for cooperation
between the educational policies and the labour market. In Italy, VET policy is in the service
dealing also with PES, YG, apprenticeships. He thanked the Commission for the information
clarifying the changes and underlined that, under their Presidency in December the EYCS and
EPSCO Councils will be organized back to back to strengthen the synergies of the two policy
fields (education and labour market).
Participants expressed concerns about the future links of VET and AL with the other
educational paths as one of the pillars for Lifelong learning strategy and the Erasmus+
programme. Several feared the parity of esteem and permeability of VET, higher VET and
cooperation with school sector with other fields would be lower (UEAPME, DE, FI). The
Belgian Delegation was worried about the transfer of EQF to DG EMPL.
ETUC expressed concerns in terms of coordination between education and training sectors
and specific position of VET in Erasmus+. The delegate asked if the structured Social
dialogue started with Commissioner Vassiliou since one year would be valid also after the reorganisation.
The German Delegate noted that the move might have negative implications at national level
since in the majority of countries VET falls under responsibility of Education ministries. This
might have also implications in terms of Council composition for VET and AL related affairs.
Mr Silva Mendes recognized the need to ensure VET is an integral part of the Lifelong
learning strategy and part of Erasmus+ (establishing a minimum budget allocation for VET).
He underlined that the proposal was still under discussion but that a close coordination on
education and employment matters was specifically requested by Mr Juncker. On Social
dialogue, he confirmed that this was a priority also in the new Commission.
He stressed the fact that the changes at European level should not be replicated in the National
organization. Interactions between Education and Labour Ministries will be fostered anyway,
in the framework of integrating all educational sectors under the ET2020 Joint report.
II. ET2020 and European Alliance for Apprenticeships
The Commission (Mr Youri Devuyst, Unit for Education and training in Europe 2020
governance) explained the state of play of the mid-term stocktaking of the ET 2020 strategic
framework for European cooperation in education and training in preparation of the ET 2020
Joint Report (identifying the ET 2020 work plan and optimising the working methods of the
framework). He underlined that the Copenhagen process is an important aspect under ET
2020 (see Powerpoint presentation).
On the preliminary indications on the substance of the stocktaking, he provided an initial
summary of inputs, which was also sent in writing after the meeting to all DGVT members.
Following the presentation, ETUC asked for the European social partners to be informed on
the content of the National Reports. The Commission replied that some information would be
made available, for the meeting with the European Social Partners on 13 November. ETUC
also inquired whether the ET 2020 stocktaking would now be handled in cooperation with
EMPL, which the Commission confirmed.
Ms Dana Bachmann, Head of Unit Vocational training and Adult education, Erasmus+,
presented the latest developments of the European Alliance for apprenticeships: pledges
received and the work of the ET2020 working group in VET (whose main topic is focusing on
apprenticeships). (See PP presentation)
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The Belgian Delegation asked a clear definition of what was being promoted under the
Alliance (apprenticeships in a narrow sense or work-based learning in a broader sense) and
expressed concerns about additional monitoring and mapping.
UEAPME asked for more visibility of the European Alliance for apprenticeship, in the 2015
VET Review. They observed SMEs and in particular micro companies have specific needs if
being engaged in apprenticeships, for which the role of intermediary bodies is crucial.
Together with ETUC they reminded their common project on cost effectiveness of
apprenticeships financed by DG EMPL, on the role of Social partners, boosting attractiveness,
assisting in setting up Alliances, improve quality of the training provided. They would like to
involve Member States in their project and foreseen conference.
The French Delegation informed the meeting that they would provide a commitment in the
framework of the Alliance before the end of the year. Also the Italian Presidency remarked
that they will present before the end of the year their commitment towards the types of
apprenticeships which correspond to the EAfA. They also highlighted the benefits of the
Alliance in terms of mutual learning, national commitments and removing barriers for
cooperation at national level (with social partners).
Germany reiterated the support to the European Alliance for Apprenticeships and thanked
Cedefop and the Commission for the organisation of concrete outputs in the recent months
(for instance the Cedefop conference 'Steering partnerships for growth' or the Erasmus+ call).
They however expressed concerns of widening the scope of the Alliance in terms of moving
from a narrow understanding of apprenticeships and dual systems to more broader sense of
work-based learning. Similarly, the idea of VET excellence award might be too complex in
view of the definition of quality criteria and standards.
Mr Eckert recalled the different possible forms of work-based learning and asked suggestions
on how to proceed in the future, in order to reply to the needs of SMEs about intermediary
structures and to take account of the skills needs of businesses in order to encourage them to
take on more apprentices.
The Commission (Ms Dana Bachmann and Mr Silva Mendes) clarified the need for more
reliable data on apprenticeships to be made available for each country with the help of
Cedefop. They underlined the apprenticeships definition in the EAfA is flexible enough to
include several types of work based learning. Structural reforms were also sought under the
EAfA and it was important that permeability to other educational paths and recognition of
learning outcomes would be possible. Contributions and suggestions by DGVT members are
very important for the Commission to ensure progress. It could be explored if VET providers
should be more involved in apprenticeships to ensure a strengthened educational component.
III. Reinforcing links between Adult Learning and VET
The Commission (Mr Paul Holdsworth, Head of Sector, Adult Learning and Continuing
Vocational Education and Training) gave a short overview of the work of ET2020 WG on
Adult learning (AL). It will shortly organise a workshop on factors for success in policies to
motivate Adults to come back to learning, and then a seminar on promoting cohesion between
AL policies (as it is a fragmented field). He then presented the note on strengthening the links
between C-VET and AL with its proposals for possible policy activity in the future.
Lore Schmid (Cedefop) introduced the C-VET ‘Policy handbook’ Access to and participation
in continuous vocational education and training in Europe which had just been published by
Cedefop. It contains guidance for policy makers, social partners and enterprises and presents
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concrete examples of effective practices, highlighting in particular the use of validation for
recruitment, personnel development and career progression and andguidance and counselling.
It also discusses the role of quality assurance and the need for professional development
opportunities for trainers. Work-organisation and learning at the work-place can encourage
learning. The involvement of social partners and shared commitment of the different actors
are key to success (see Powerpoint presentation).
ETUC recalled the active engagement of social partners in the field. They welcomed the work
of Cedefop and particularly references to work-place learning which is of key importance for
adult working population. They hoped to be involved with public authorities on the work to
be done at national level. They already had projects ongoing or to be started on workplace
learning and would welcome cooperation with Cedefop.
BusinessEurope thanked Cedefop for their work and suggested not to focus policies only on
low skilled people, but rather an integrated approach which caters for needs of both highly
and low-skilled. Universities and HEI have a role to play in C-VET (targeting people with
VET background). As regards the sharing of the costs of C-VET, all stakeholders should
participate (for instance employees by investing their time). Public employment services
should improve their training measures by focusing on needs for specific available jobs.
Further interventions welcomed the evidence of Cedefop work, which could be exploited at
national level and asked for C-VET to be more visible in the work of the ET2020 WG on
Adult learning, highlighted the importance of a clear link between IVET and C-VET, the role
of collective bargaining and social partners (DK), incentives or the use of tripartite funds
(CY) the difficulty of engaging SMEs (particularly micro-companies) and validation of nonformal and information learning (UEAPME), also in C-VET, and the advantages of targeting
groups who would not commit otherwise.
The Commission clarified that the ET2020 WG AL includes C-VET in its remit and will be
kept informed of the discussions of DGVT and took note of all the suggestions made.
Ms Serban from the ETF noted that the experience of DG EMPL would be valuable on CVET and asked to consider the lessons learned from investments made in this field by the ESF
and also include the question of integration of migrants, as a specific target group.
IV. VET monitoring report
Mr James Calleja, Director of Cedefop, gave an overview of the Cedefop’s VET policy
monitoring report which reviews progress in achieving the short-term deliverables of the
Bruges Communiqué established for the period 2011-2014.
In 2010/11, countries did not start from scratch, but from very different positions. This has to
be taken into account when assessing progress. The Bruges Communiqué has inspired
national policies in a range of countries focusing mainly on overall system reforms,
particularly on quality assurance, WBL and attractiveness. Systems reforms have, in several
cases, been triggered by the work on national qualifications frameworks. There is also a trend
towards higher VET. Areas where progress appears slower were feedback of labour market
outcomes into VET, systematic approach to promoting the European tools and systematic
opportunities for VET teacher and trainer developments. The conference end of September,
which discussed the findings of the report, identified the need for approaches that balance
quality provision and individualised learning in programmes that allow learners catch up on
basic skills and key competences. Wider partnerships are needed to promote innovation in and
through VET (see presentation for more details)
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Ms Madlen Serban from the ETF provided a short overview of the progress in candidate
countries, where advancements concerned mainly VET attractiveness and structured
cooperation mechanisms between VET sector and employment services. This corresponded to
the traditionally high VET enrolments in the Western Balkan countries and to the current
demand in all candidate countries to make VET delivery relevant to the economy and the
labour market needs.
The Delegate from Montenegro explained the work they are doing with ETF in their country
to review their VET system. As a result, all stakeholders had a better view of the VET policy
and embraced the different policy options which became their guidelines for the future
strategic approach to VET.
Mr Calleja thanked the countries which sent the comments to their report and invited the
others to send their comments until the end of the week.
The Italian Presidency remarked that the STDs are very relevant, but need to be
complemented at National level with decisions on how to better reach certain targets.
V. Workshops – VI. Plenary presentation of the discussions within the Workshops
Discussions in parallel groups were carried out on key challenges under the Copenhagen
process and CSRs with the aim to highlight the barriers and possible solutions for areas of the
Bruges Communiqué which saw less progress, sharing challenges and good examples by
several countries.
On Workshop 1, work-based learning (WBL) and VET in the Youth Guarantee,
Mr Jean Marc Huart, French Delegate, explained that WBL should be based on a demand
driven approach with strong involvement of companies. The Youth Guarantee, as a systemic
tool to qualify young people, should be a quick fix to immediate problems, but also serving to
create links between all the actors of VET.
Ms Micheline Scheys, the Belgian Delegate, about Workshop 2 on Early leaving and Vet,
asserted that multi-dimensional responses and complementary policies were needed. The
definitions of drop outs and early leaving still needed to be made clearer. Possible solutions
proposed by the workshop were flexible VET, short-track programmes, I-VET/C-VET
combinations and validation of prior learning.
Mr Phil O'Flaherty the Irish Delegate, underlined, for workshop 3 on sustainable institutional
partnerships, that the common element in all VET policy areas is 'the need for coordinated
cooperation and shared responsibility of stakeholders at all levels', i.e. the crucial importance
of partnerships, building on employers' interest (otherwise not sustainable) and engaging
social partners early in the reform process (all stakeholders should commit from the start).
About Workshop 4, Mr Peter Van Ijsselmuiden, the Dutch Delegate, remarked that also for
the professional development of teachers and trainers, partnerships are indispensable,
provided the appropriate conditions and clear roles are stated for all partners involved.
Development of VET teachers and trainers should be seen as a shared interest, for the benefit
of both companies and VET providers.
More detailed reports from the workshops will be sent separately.
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VII. Copenhagen process and the 2015 VET review
The Commission (Ms Dana Bachmann) reminded the context of the VET review according to
the roadmap agreed by the ACVT in December 2013. She underlined that the monitoring
report of Cedefop showed the existence of very different VET Systems, with their
specificities, which cannot be neglected.
She invited concrete proposals, constructive suggestions from DGVT members, following the
first discussions which had taken place in the ACVT Bureau in September.
Mr Jan Varchola, (European Commission, EAC - Unit Vocational training and Adult
education, Erasmus+) overviewed the content of the proposed 8 short-term deliverables
(STDs) in a line of continuity with the Bruges Communiqué and the work already undertaken
in the different countries, also referring to the conclusions of the workshops held the day
before (see Powerpoint presentation).
Mr Jasper van Loo from Cedefop underlined the need for the current discussions on the STDs
to consider the need for structured monitoring from the outset for the next cycle of STDs. He
presented a possible approach that would be based on a set of conditions and measures
(fundamentals and multipliers) needing to be in place in any country and others that help
advance progress towards the STDs further (See Powerpoint presentation).
The Italian Presidency welcomed the work undertaken by the Commission and the thorough
reflection on the new STDs based on the previous discussions in ACVT and DGVT. In their
view, the proposal went in the right direction towards simplification. On the details of the
STDs, they considered the first one should be spelled out as 'efficiency' where WBL could be
one of the tools; same for funding, which in their views was not an objective in itself. On
monitoring and feedback loop, they stressed the importance that VET providers should not be
the only target for the information. They agreed in principle with policy options, but had
concerns about fundamentals and multipliers as they considered it an additional multiplication
of the STDs.
The Romanian Delegation welcomed the 8 deliverables but expressed concerns about the
functioning of the policy options and the distinctions between fundamentals and multipliers,
which might increase the gap between the countries.
The Finnish Delegate welcomed the reduction of STDs but was concerned by the policy
options (incl. fundamentals and multipliers). They asked for more details on country reviews,
called for a broader understanding of work-based learning and less indicators with more in
depth qualitative analysis on country reforms.
The German Delegate proposed quality could be embedded in the other STDs reducing the
number. He stressed the importance of making distinction between ad-hoc short-term
measures and structural/systemic reforms and expressed concerns about policy options which
might not be relevant in all cases and could increase the complexity in the overall process.
They reminded that the Copenhagen process was a dynamic process led by MS which
committed themselves for enhanced cooperation in the VET field and recalled the importance
of Ministerial meetings.
The Belgian Delegate highlighted the need for the VET Review process to focus on a clear
strategic direction to provide solutions for citizens, with technical implementation details to
be addressed later on. They raised concerns on the ownership of the process which was
perceived to have been more Member State driven in the past. She regretted the ET2020
priorities were not available yet.
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The Chair reminded that the proposal on the table was the result of several discussions with
Member States in different fora (DGVT, ACVT and enlarged Bureau) and policy options
were a similar approach to what had been done in the Bruges Communiqué.
The Danish Delegate welcomed the simplification and made suggestions to add the Youth
Guarantee under access to training and to further integrate the STDs (n°3, 5 and7). They were
not convinced by the proposal on fundamentals and multipliers.
EU Social partners provided suggestions for more reduction and some fine tuning of policy
options, clearer link to Europe 2020 and country specific recommendations, underline better
labour market relevance, apprenticeships explicitly as one form of work-based learning, cost
effectiveness of funding, the workplace learning dimension for C-VET and partnerships,
including the role of Social partners and need to involve them in the reforms.
The Austrian Delegate considered the proposal went towards comprehensive reforms and that
STDs were more as a mix of long-term goals and actions. He called for an approach in which
every country defines its own short-term deliverables, which would be monitored.
The Italian Delegation urged to continue the reflection without waiting for the results of the
ET2020 stocktaking. On the proposals, in order to reduce the STDs, they suggested to have
thematic objectives and transversal objectives as not all the deliverables have the same
relevance.
The French Delegation agreed on the number of deliverables but had doubts about the
multipliers. They called for reduction of the monitoring burden.
The Chair reminded participants had a collective responsibility to achieve concrete results and
that indicators and monitoring systems allowed to understand if real progress was booked or
not.
Ms Dana Bachmann underlined the synergies between the Copenhagen process and the
ET2020 strategy, with VET as part of the Lifelong learning process. Continuing on the
tradition of the Copenhagen process, a Ministerial Conference will be organised (as said
already in previous occasions) in June 2015 for the adoption of a new Communiqué. To
support successfully the new STDs, a monitoring strategy will need to be designed in
agreement with all countries and therefore the topic had been included as part of the
discussion. She took good note of all the comments but invited participants to send their
suggestions in writing and liaise with the colleagues attending the next ACVT meeting, where
a revised proposal would be discussed.
Mr Varchola explained that, as it had been foreseen in the Bruges Communiqué, the STDs
were a mixture of quick wins and longer term goals, the latter to be considered like a path of
development where some advancement can be made in the shorter period.
Mr van Loo highlighted that further reflection would be necessary, about the challenges faced
in assessing progress according to the Bruges Communiqué and the lessons learned from the
current period, with the aim of ensuring an effective monitoring of the future STDs.
The Romanian Delegate suggested the Latvian Presidency would be involved in the
preparation of the updated version of the STDs and the Chair agreed to be in contact with
present and future Presidencies for the preparation of the document for the ACVT meeting.
Mr Eckert mentioned that STDs should be a framework under which to achieve concrete
results and welcomed the readiness from participants to work on common endeavours.
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VIII. The functioning of EU Transparency tools and EASQ
The Commission (Mr Youri Devuyst) provided a brief state of play on the European Area of
Skills and Qualifications (EASQ), underlining the main elements emerging from the public
consultation, the Eurobarometer survey and the conference on the subject organized in June.
While various interesting aspects are now on the table, it will be up to the new
Commissioners to decide how the EASQ will be brought further in 2015.
Ms Mara Brugia, Deputy Director of Cedefop, gave an overview of the results of five studies
under a so-called umbrella project to help focus the EU tools better on the needs of the end
users (see Powerpoint presentation). The preliminary results were in line with the findings of
the EASQ consultation. A Conference would be organised in November to discuss some
possible scenarios, options for the future of the tools, moving from a tool by tool approach
into a more comprehensive system. The tools should be 'known' and relevant to help citizens
progress in their learning and working careers (transfer and recognition) throughout their
lives.
The Commission, (Mr Joao Santos, Deputy Head of Unit, Vocational training Adult
education, Erasmus+) provided an update about ECVET, linked to what had been explained
by Cedefop, in order to consult DGVT members on options for a Commission report to be
prepared in the next months.
ECVET allows for VET qualifications to be broken down into units of learning outcomes,
making them more flexible and portable and therefore facilitating mobility. Mobility was also
supported through better preparation of individual experiences. The concept of units of
learning outcomes has strongly promoted LLL and in some countries has inspired VET
reforms. The Commission envisaged to build upon these strengths through coordinated
developments with other European instruments such as Europass. The governance of ECVET
was also in need of a review, as structures launched at European and national level needed to
streamlined and coordinated. (See Powerpoint presentation).
The German Delegation stressed that instruments are there to deliver quality education and
training and provide added value for end-users: workers, businesses and learners.
As little time was left to discuss this topic, participants were told that written comments
would also be welcome.
IX. Closing session
Ms Anita Vahere and Ms Ilze Buligina from the upcoming Latvian Presidency overviewed
the main themes of their Semester: growth, involvement and sustainability and the specific
VET events. The DGVT meeting was planned for 20-21 April; in addition, the Ministerial
conference to be organized in June 2015 on the new Communiqué could also take stock of the
EAfA as 2 years will have passed from the Leipzig launch event.
In his concluding remarks, Mr Silva Mendes, insisted on the considerable importance gained
by VET in the overall growth and competitiveness agenda. The discussions of the workshops
showed that responsibilities and action of all stakeholders are to be reinforced in partnerships,
to translate into concrete results. He invited participants to share with their colleagues at
National level the knowledge gained during the DGVT meeting. He considered the move
from DG EAC to EMPL of VET and Adult learning an opportunity for further progress in the
field and remarked that concrete achievements had already been made in the recent years,.
For the Italian Presidency, Mr Bobba, Undersecretary of State, confirmed that the importance
of VET was central at the recent Milan Summit on employment. The work done during
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DGVT found direct strong relevance at political level in all MS. Development and
maintenance of skills is very important for the labour market, both for youngsters, the low
skilled and for workers. Quality and transferability of competences facilitate insertion on the
labour market but also help competitiveness, like mentioned by the LV Presidency, and the
lack of investments in skills risked damaging the competitiveness of the National systems.
Mr Silva Mendes thanked the Italian Presidency and said farewell to the DGVT members as
the next meeting will be under the responsibility of DG EMPL.
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