L.C. Smith - Syracuse Guns
1886-1888
By J. David Williamson
There are no existing records for the shotguns produced by L.C. Smith
in Syracuse. The serial number range is thought to be between 15,00022,500.
What is known is that they were made in 10 gauge and 12 gauge with
30” and 32” barrels. All barrels were Damascus, and the Grades ranged
from Quality 2 through Quality 7. Price was Quality 2- $80.00 and
Quality 7- $450.00,
In doing this research, I have come to the conclusion that guns with
serial numbers in the 16xxx, 18xxx, 19xxx, 20xxx, and up to 22500 are
hammerless shotguns and 15xxx, 17xxx, 21xxx, 24,xxx and 25xxx and
26xxx range are hammer guns.
From an old 3” x 6” notepad that Lyman Cornelius Smith handed down
upon selling the gun works, the Syracuse L.C. Smith records for the first
year of hammerless shotguns show that 281 were produced. Fifteen were
returned for credit leaving 266 guns sold the first year. (from Brophy’s
L.C. Smith Shotguns, 1977).
The hammerless shotgun went into production in August, 1886.
Production totals by month were:
August
14
September 96
October 73
November 82
December 66
Total 281
Returns - 15
266 Total sold August to December, 1886
Production stopped sometime in 1888 when Lyman C. Smith, Maker,
sold the company to John Hunter. Also records for 1888 include no
production figures. During the period of 1888 to 1890, machinery and
equipment was being moved from Syracuse to Fulton (about 30 miles).
Once in Fulton, changes were made in the design. Shotguns from
Syracuse finished in Fulton have the Fulton address, but serial numbers
reflect Syracuse origin. (from Brophy’s book page 193). There are recorded
instances where Syracuse shotguns were sent to Fulton for re-barreling,
and there are recorded serial numbers that overlap Syracuse shotguns
with Fulton shotguns.
This can be seen on a few of the serial numbers listed *, too low for
Fulton but have the shape and the convex lumps of the Syracuse
shotgun. Very early Fulton guns also have this feature.** It has been
noted that some have been seen with the squared lug, and we now have
pictures of a few in the 30-31xxx serial number range.
The records for serial numbers 22501-27765 are lost, and are Fulton
shotguns.
This would have to be after 22501 because 22631 has its original hang
tag from Syracuse. See L.C. Smith “The Legend Lives” page 488.
Patent numbers and dates:
First patent #274,435
March 20, 1883, Breech-loading mechanism, joint and ejector
system.
Some guns are have a patent date of March 29,’83
Second patent #345,362
July 13, 1886, lock mechanism for concealed hammer guns
(L.C. Smith Hammerless shotgun)
Third patent #350,109
October 5, 1886 Safety catch for gun locks, (Automatic and
Independent safety-3 position)
1884-1886 L.C. Smith hammer guns
10020
Quality E
10 ga.
32” barrels stub twist
10046
Quality F
10 ga.
30” barrels stub twist
10203
Quality E
12 ga.
Cut barrels
10362 Quality E
12 ga.
19 ¼” (cut), L.C. Smith Maker,
Syracuse, N.Y.
10385
Quality D
10 ga.
30” barrels, 8 lb.10 oz.
Syracuse butt plate
10501
Quality E
12 ga.
109xx
Quality E
12 ga.
11233 Quality F
10 ga.
30” barrels
32” barrels, original butt plate
(Gunbroker 11-10 pictures)
11569
Quality E
10 ga.
28” barrels cut
11946
Quality E
10 ga.
30” barrels
12024
Quality D
12 ga.
-44-40 Combo gun with 30”
barrels
12094
Quality E
10 ga.
30” barrels
12231
Quality F
10 ga.
30” barrels
12858
Quality F
10 ga?
12952
Quality F
10 ga.
32” barrels, 10 lb. 8 oz.
13229
Quality E
10 ga.
32” barrels, 11 lb. 8 oz., 3”
chambers
13326
Quality F
10 ga.
28 ¼” barrels Stub Twist (cut)
13483
Quality F
12 ga.
(dog with foot on rock)
135xx
Quality F
12 ga.
30” Stub Twist barrels (pictures)
14438
Quality F
12 ga.
30” barrels Stub Twist
14497
Quality C
10 ga.
14629
Quality F
12 ga.
Barrels cut to 18 ½” WF & Co.
Ex stamped on receiver (Wells Fargo and Com.), Gun Broker
1886-1888 Hammer and Hammerless L.C. Smiths
Italics, hammer guns
32” barrels
^15060
Quality E 10 ga.
151xx
Quality F 10 ga.
^15624
Quality E 12 ga.
30” barrels
15279
Quality F 12 ga.
30” barrels, Sub Twist
^15750
Quality E 10 ga.
30” barrels
^15754
Quality E 10 ga.
32” barrel, 10 lb. 8 oz., 3” chambers
^15996
Quality E 10 ga.
32” barrels
16036
Quality 3 10 ga.
(pictures)
32” barrels, (no patent dates),
16200
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels, 1 1/8 c/c firing pins
^16211
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
16272
Quality
10 ga.
Pat’ date of only Mar.20 ,’83, so gun
has to be early production of 1886 when the hammerless first
came out (from “L.C. Smith Shotguns )
162xx
Quality 2 10 ga.
28” barrels (catalog states 30” or 32”
barrels)
16294
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
16xxx
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels, (possibly heavy frame)
16342
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels, 1886
16344
Quality 2 10 ga.
29 ½” barrels (cut, probably 32” once),
pictures, not original butt plate (.013 in one choke)
16362
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels
16397
Quality 2 12 ga.
(one patent date-Mar.29,’83)
16425
Quality 2 10 ga.
oz.
29.8” barrels (one patent date), 8 lb. 4
^16447
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
^16453
Quality 4 12 ga.
30” barrels
^16464
Quality 5 10 ga.
32” barrels
16510
Quality 2 10 ga.
*16566
Quality 2 12 ga.
^16576
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
(barrels cut to 26 1/8”), (all three patent
dates), Dogs head escutcheon on forend, rounded lug-Fulton shaped
side plates
30” barrels (on Gun Broker being sold 6-5-2011
original s/n number from Russ Ruppel’s research)
16656
Quality 4 12 ga.
30“ barrels (all three patent dates.) ,
Date: Oct-Dec, 1886, (pictures) pistol grip- capped, wrong
re-case & blue
*16750
Quality 4 12 ga.
30” barrels
^16764
Quality 3 10 ga.
32” barrels
16765
Quality 3 12 ga.
29 13/16” barrels (could be 30”)
16769
Quality 3 10 ga.
30” barrels m/f (listed as 90% condition)
full capped pistol grip, Trap Gun butt plate, (pictures)
^16775
Quality 3 10 ga.
30” barrels
^16776
Quality 3 10 ga.
date), 2.76 rec.
32” barrels (only Mar.20,’83 patent
16804
Quality 2 10 ga.
date)
30” barrels (only Mar.20,’83 patent
16864
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels (dog and duck Trap Gun butt
plate)
*16905
(Catalog 1888, testimonial from customer dated April 16,
1887 that he received gun one week ago today), 1st Qtr. 1887
made
16936
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
16992
Quality 3 10 ga.
32” barrels
17106
Quality F 12 ga.
32” barrels (Guns America)
17308
Quality F 10 ga.
32” barrels
^17609
Quality D 12 ga.
30” barrel, scroll 28 lpi checkering
^17675
Quality F 12 ga.
32” barrels, trap gun-line engraving
17739
Quality F 12 ga.
30” barrels
17843
Quality F 10 ga.
30” barrels
17862
Quality F 10 ga.
30” barrel, good condition
^17870
Quality F 10 ga.
? barrels
17883
Quality F 10 ga.
30” barrels
17905
Quality E 10 ga.
17912
Quality E 12 ga.
30” barrels
17914
Quality F 12 ga.
32” barrels
17961
Quality F 10 ga.
N.Y.)
Stub twist barrels (marked Syracuse
18055
Quality 2 10 ga.
31” barrels-cut
18082 Quality 4
gun is parted out, Grouse with young and
weasel, other side woodcock
*18123
18154
Quality 2 12 ga.
26” & 30” barrels
10 ga.
from an early 1889 L.C. Smith catalog.
Testimonial from customer dated July 31, 1887 saying he
patterned gun and results were better than hang tag. Arrived at
10 ga from powder used in tests.
^18168
Quality 2 10 ga.
order)
28” barrels (possibly cut or special
18173
Quality 2 10 ga.
30”
18185
Quality 3 10 ga.
32” barrels 10 lb. 2 oz., Trap butt plate
18192
Quality 3 12 ga.
30” barrels
18239
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels, 11 lb. 2 oz.
18255
Quality 4 16 ga.
now 26” barrels (barrels made in
Fulton to 16 ga., have Hunter Arms, Fulton on ext. rib.)
18291
Quality 2 10 ga.
28” barrels (cut?), original butt plate
18324
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels 10 lb., bores: .801/798
(thought to be 8 ga.)
18325
Quality 2 10 ga.
very worn
18337
Quality 2 10 ga
28” barrels (cut) butt plate original but
18358
Quality 3 10 ga. 30” barrels, original butt plate, dog on
trigger guard
18397
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels, original butt plate
18414
Quality 4 12 ga.
28” barrels (not s/n to gun, barrels and
forend s/n 19335), forend dogs head escutcheon missing (not a
Syracuse trait)
^18415
Quality 4 12 ga.
balls.)
30” barrels,(birds and sculptured
18465
Quality 3 10 ga.
30” barrels
^18510
Quality 6 10 ga.
32” barrels (gold dog on trigger guard)
18512
Quality 3 10 ga.
gun)
32” barrels (2 barrel set, only #2 with
^18557
Quality 2 12 ga.
order)
28” barrels (possibly cut or special
18560
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels (Dogs head butt plate) 8 lb. 6
oz.
18587
Quality 5 10 ga.
30” (Brophy’s book) Jacob Glahn
engraved & signed, Pictures. (stock has added piece on pistol grip,
might have originally been straight stock), 8 lb. 14 oz.
18617
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels
18640
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
^18660
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels (2.76” wide frame)
^18732
Quality 2 12 ga.
dovetailed in)
18756
30” barrels (1 inch stock extension
receiver parts put up for sale on Gun
Broker
^18759
Quality 6 12 ga.
30” barrels, 6 gold inlays
18769
Quality 6 12 ga.
30“ barrels, “The Legend Lives” photo
18785
Quality 3 10 ga.
(John Houchins)
32“ barrels, “The Legend Lives” photo
18815
Quality 2 10 ga.
receiver only
^18843
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels, 10 lb. 5.8 oz., uncheckered?
^18928
Quality 3 12 ga.
32” barrels
18962
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
18967
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” fluid steel barrels, (re-barreled ?) ,
pictures
18974
Quality 2
(Serial number from receiver and lock plates
Brophy’s book pg. 46)
19008
Quality 2 10 ga.
19038
Quality 3 10 ga.
30” full/full
^19109
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
19208
Quality 5 12 ga.
32” barrels, (returned to Fulton in 1901 for
a set of A1 barrels)
19212
30” barrels, dogs head butt plate
19283
Quality 2 10 ga.
(owned by Terry Nix)
19311
Quality 2 10 ga.
19312
Quality 2 10 ga.
Has patent date of Mar. 29?,’83
19320
Quality 2 10 ga.
Barrels cut and honed out.
19335
Quality 4 12 ga.
28” barrels only (#4 on water table) on
gun 18414 Qlty 4
^19377
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
^19398
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels
19429
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels, Trap Grade butt plate
19478
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
^19491
Quality 2 10 ga.
barrels (re-barreled in steel)
19494
Quality 2 10 ga
30” barrels, L.C. Smith butt plate
19498
Quality 2 10 ga.
proofed
re-barreled in Italy to steel in 1960,
19500
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
19513
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels original butt plate
19517
Quality 2 10 ga.
10.8 oz.
30” barrels, 24 lpi checkering, 9 lb.
19593
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
^19732
Quality 2 12 ga.
26” & 30” barrels, w/ 2 forends
^19746
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels, (barrels s/n 19475)
19767
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
19773
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
^19778
Quality 3 12 ga.
30” barrels
19932
Quality 4 10 ga.
barrels have Fulton address (Fulton
re-barrel), (From Russ’s info “birds marked “Hunter” on barrels,
have pictures)
^19955
Quality 4 12 ga.
19966
Quality 2 12 ga.
19974
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels, (small frame)
30” barrels, 1 1/8” c/c firing pin, original
butt plate
20112
Quality 2 10 ga
30” barrels fitted with hammer barrels
s/n 10827, also has original set
20149
Quality 2 12 ga.
28” cut, (L.C. Smith Trap Gun butt plate
orig.), barrels honed to .743
20187
Quality 2 12 ga.
20194
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” full/full, (recoil pad added)
28 ½” (cut), -9 lb. on bathroom scale
20199
Quality 2 10 ga.
20202
Quality 4 10 ga.
20279
10 ga.
20283
Quality 2 10 ga.
28” barrels (might be cut)
^20300
Quality 7 10 ga.
32” barrels, (gold dog on trigger guard,
Engravings of woodcock on right, 2
partridge on left, Setter on point on trigger guard, (pictures)
stepped side plates.)
20302
Quality 3 12 ga.
30” barrels
20312
Quality 2 12 ga.
26” barrels-cut, originally 32” (Part of
Sherman Bell’s “Finding Out for Myself”, Spring 2007 Double Gun
Journal)
20317
Quality 7 12 ga.
28” & 30” barrels
20330
Quality 5
time)
3 barrel set (probably done at a later
20335
Quality 3 12 ga.
Re-barreled in Fulton with Armor Steel
(lug is still squared to fit Syracuse receiver)
20379
Quality 2 10 ga.
(gun set up for left handed, left barrel fires
first), pictures
20446
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels, (Dogs foot on rock butt plate),
pictures, 9 lb. 2 oz.
20449
Quality 2 10 ga.
20478
Quality 2 10 ga.
? Barrels
20507
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
20519
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
20536
Quality 2 10ga.
frame
32” barrels, 10 lb. 15 oz., heavy weight
20541
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels
^20556
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels, (re-stocked)
^20598
Quality 5 10 ga.
30” barrels, (Gold monogram on trigger
guard-Brophy’s book)
^20604
Quality 2 10 ga.
26” barrels-cut
20615
Quality 2 12 ga.
28 11/16”, (barrels-cut)
20643
Quality 3
(John Houchins)
^20647
Quality 3 12 ga.
20656
Quality 3 12 ga.
20678
Quality 2 12 ga.?
All three patent dates
^20681
Quality 3 10 ga.
28” barrels, (possibly cut or special order,
27” barrels-cut
needs forend)
20690
Quality 5 10 ga.
30” barrels, (stepped side plates)
20700
Quality 4 12 ga.
order)
28” barrels, (possibly cut or special
20761
Quality 2 12 ga.
20780
Quality 2 12 ga.
28” barrels (cyl/cyl., cut), 7 lb. 4 oz.,
(scale in picture)
20802
Quality 2 12 ga.
28” barrels (cut?). diamond metal escutcheon
in for-end
10 ga.
30” barrels, r. 758, l. 762
20840
Quality
208xx
Quality 2 12 ga
26” barrels-cut (pictures)
^20870
Quality 5 12 ga.
30” barrels, (barrels only on ebay)
^20875
Quality 2 12 ga.
Re-barreled with 30”
20944
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
20984
Quality 7 12 ga.
Barrels cut to 25”, some gold
engravings, side plate has Glahn signature
20994
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels
21093
Quality
32” barrels
21141
Quality F 10 ga.
10 ga.
32” Stub Twist, 10 lb. 8 oz., (grafted comb
piece added)
21211
Quality D 10 ga.
32” barrels, hammer gun
22020
Quality 2 10 ga.
oz.
30” barrels, trap gun butt plate, 9 lb. 8
22061
Quality
32” barrels, no engraving (poor condition
12 ga.
Gun Broker 9-2010)
22087
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels, diamond escutcheon
^22145
Quality 7 12 ga.
cap inlay)
30” barrels, (grade marked, has grip
^22216
Quality 7 10 ga.
30” barrels, (not grade marked, re-barreled
to 12 ga. Steel)
^22255
22287
0 Grade
12 ga.
30” barrels, (transition gun-twist steel)
Quality ? 10 ga.
28 ½” barrels (cut), right barrel
marked Stub Twist, left barrel marked L.C. Smith Maker
Syracuse, N.Y. (re-barreled with hammer gun barrels), pictures, no engraving
on side plates.
22338
22378
Quality 2 12 ga.
22452
Quality 2 12 ga.
22519
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels, (all 3 patent dates)
22540
Quality 2 12 ga.
32” barrels
22559
Quality 6 10 ga.
30” barrels
22605
Quality 2 10 ga.
forend wood)
30” barrels, (diamond shaped insert in
22631
Quality 2 12 ga.
30” barrels, 7 lb. 4 oz. ,from an
original hang tag of 1887, medium weight frame)
22640
Quality 2 12 ga.
22643
Quality 2
22649
Quality 2 12 ga.
forend)
26” barrels, (cut, diamond inlay on
22733
Quality 2? 10 ga.
32 ½” barrels, (no engraving on side
plates and on trigger guard, only lines with serial #)
22752
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels, Trap butt plate
22757
Quality 4 12 ga.
30” barrels, 7 lb. 10 oz., Trap butt plate
22781
Quality 2 10 ga.
30” barrels
22793
Quality
30” barrels
22796
Quality 2 12 ga.
22803
Quality 2 12 ga.
wrist.
32” barrels, pictures, repair on stock
22840
Quality
30” Twist Steel, pictures, 10 lb+ , ( no
12 ga.
10 ga
engraving on side plates)
22893
Quality 7 12 ga.
25” barrels
22972
Quality 2 10 ga.
breech balls 2 ¾” across
^23055
Quality 3 10 ga.
guard)
32” barrels, (John S. Clark on trigger
23061
Quality 2 10 ga.
32” barrels
23152
Quality 2 10 ga.
Receiver only-Gun Broker
#23339
Quality 2 12 ga.
28 lpi and drop point checkering
23033
23386
23475
12 ga.
30” barrels
Quality 7 12 ga.
? barrels, scalloped side plates,
Unfinished Syracuse Quality 7 finished in Fulton now as an
A2 by Hunter Arms, presented to Lyman C. Smith (some
discrepancies) in 1891-2 by John Hunter (page 326 “The
Legend Lives”) Initials on trigger guard,no ejectors. Tom
Archer notes: “gun is in appearances a Syracuse Quality 7
butwas built by Hunter Arms in Fulton.”
25470
Quality F? 12 ga
26” barrels-cut, L.C. Smith Maker,
Syracuse on barrels, pictures.
2562X
Quality F 10 ga.
259xx
Quality F
25627
Quality F 10 ga.
26117
Quality F
26027
Quality F 10 ga.
30” barrels, square lug
26644
Quality F 12 ga.
Twist barrels
26872
Quality F 12 ga.
Stub twist barrels
30” barrels, picture
30” Twist Steel barrels, Trap Gun butt plate.
30” barrels
^ guns were from Russ Ruppels research
* serial numbers from John? that I didn’t have.
All other serial numbers either from members and/or auction sites.
Shotguns in italics are hammer guns.
27043
Quality 3
(trigger guard only)
*16566
Quality 2 12 ga.
cut barrels, (round lug), has Syracuse
attributes, but has rounded lug
59584
Quality 2-Grade 2
12 ga.,(Ducks & Quail) (square
corners on lug), barrels marked Fulton
30028
Very early Fulton gun, has squared lug no engraving, large
convex ribs, fine checkering, no engraving, stub twist barrels
30099
Very Early Fulton, large convex ribs, 10 ga., 30” barrels,
engraved like early Fulton Qlty 2 squared lug, pictures
30709
Quality 2 12 ga.
31534
Very early Fulton gun with square lug, border engraving,
tapered breech balls and not as large in relationship to
Syracuse guns.
32146
Quality ?
30” barrels, 7 lb. 10 oz., Trap butt plate
30” Twist Steel barrels, Syracuse style
checkering and for-end insert, single line engraved around lock plate,
like early 0 grade.
36992
Quality
*16905
Shotgun has to be early 1887 gun, if only 281 built from
August 1886 starting at 16xxx, serial numbers cannot be
sequential.
23339
Shotgun has Fulton attributes, narrow convex ribs, rounded
lug, early Fulton Quality 2 engraving.
39241
Shotgun has convex lumps and is Fulton gun (1895)
39252
Shotgun has no ribs ( 9 numbers different) (1895)
1047
2E has convex lumps and is dated as being finished Mar.4,
1896
Anyone having information or serial numbers on these early guns, I would
appreciate the information.
Thanks,
J. David Williamson
email jdw110@live.com