#nzdata Workshop Two
Summary Report
20August 2010
Version 1.0
Prepared by Julian Carver, Seradigm Limited
This document is distributed under the Creative Commons
NZ Attribution-ShareAlike licence. For more information
see http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/nz/
Table of Contents
1
2
3
Introduction.......................................................................................................................3
1.1
Context......................................................................................................................3
1.2
Outputs and Outcomes ..............................................................................................3
1.3
Process ......................................................................................................................3
1.4
Participants ...............................................................................................................4
Workshop Outputs ............................................................................................................5
2.1
Real World Problems ................................................................................................5
2.2
Suggested Data to Open............................................................................................6
Analysis ............................................................................................................................7
3.1
The Open Government Context ................................................................................7
3.2
Data to Open .............................................................................................................9
3.3
Emerging Themes and Ideas ...................................................................................11
4
Suggestions .....................................................................................................................13
5
Recommendations...........................................................................................................14
6
Appendix.........................................................................................................................15
6.1
Workshop Two Raw Notes .....................................................................................15
6.2
Workshop Two Tweet Stream ................................................................................17
#nzdata Workshop Two – Summary Report
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1 Introduction
1.1
Context
The Department of Conservation agreed to conduct a piece of work for the Open Data Stream of
the whole of government Data and Information Re-Use Work Programme. One three-hour
workshop with targeted members of the public was proposed, in order to determine exactly what
datasets participants wanted government to release and what real world problems having access
to those datasets would help address. This was to be followed by a workshop with appropriate
public sector representatives to determine how best to achieve the release of those datasets.
The first workshop involved 19 people from the ‘open-data community’ (primarily open data
enthusiasts from the private sector), plus 23 others who participated via Twitter.
At that workshop it was identified that non-governmental organisations (NGOs) and community
sector organisations could make a useful contribution to understanding the real world problems
that opening government data might help solve. A second workshop was therefore convened
with NGOs and community groups.
1.2
Outputs and Outcomes
The intended outputs of the overall #nzdata process are:

A small identified set of priority government datasets to be made open1

A clear pathway and process for relevant agencies, resulting in those datasets being
opened

A set of learnings from the whole process that can be used and further enhanced within
the Data and Information Re-Use WorkProgramme, and by individual agencies
The anticipated outcomes of this include:
1.3

Useful solutions developed by the open data community/private sector, using those data,
to help address real world needs/problems

Closer engagement and strengthened relationships between government and the open
data community/private sector

Greater awareness within government, the private sector, and NGOs and community
organisations, about the benefits of opening government data
Process
The #nzdata process is based on a particular hypothesis, namely:
Providing open and machine readable access to government datasets will result in
improved economic, social and/or environmental outcomes, through interested people
outside government building new tools and services using those data
There are many government datasets that are not yet open, and there is a cost to opening
datasets. This includes initial costs such as getting the data ready for opening, developing
systems to provide external access to the data, as well as ongoing costs including support of
those systems, ensuring data is updated, and responding to queries.
1
In this context ‘open’ means available over the web, in a machine readable form via APIs
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Because of this there is a need to prioritise which datasets to open. This could be done based on
lowest cost, or on perceived need/highest value. The first approach would involve simply
opening the datasets for which it was easy and relatively cheap to do so, and waiting to see what
use they could be put to. The second approach involves focusing on real world problems,
outcomes and potential solutions in order to determine which datasets, if opened, could create
the most value. This second approach is the one being taken in the #nzdata piece of work.
The process is as follows:
1. Workshop one – open-dataadvocates familiar with the technical demands of making data
available to the public, brainstorming real world problems and datasets to open (held on
29 July)
2. Workshop two –NGOs and community groups, brainstorming real world problems,
questions they can’t currently answer, and datasets to open (held on 10 August)
3. Workshop three – selected public servants, to agree the top two or three datasets which
could provide the most value if released (proposed for 9 September)
4. Identification of the tasks necessary to get the agreed datasets released or if that is not
possible, a draft action plan to begin the process of identifying tasks / highlighting
barriers
5. Preparation of a high level report including proposed action plan and recommendations
for next steps, to the Data and Information Re-Use Chief Executive's Governance Group
1.4
Participants
The participants in workshop two were:

Chris Fawdray, Walking Access Commission (www.walkingaccess.org.nz)

Parker Jones, Mainland Island Restoration Operation of Eastbourne (www.miro.org.nz)

Greg Coyle, Salvation Army (www.salvationarmy.org.nz)

David Laing, Hikurangi Foundation (http://www.hikurangi.org.nz/)

Mike Brown, Webstock (www.webstock.org.nz)

John Roberts (Archives)

Trudy Rankin (DOC)

Isabel Regenaermel (DOC)

Joanna McLeod (contractor) on Twitter
The workshop was facilitated by Julian Carver of Seradigm Ltd. 16 additional people
contributed via Twitter.
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2 Workshop Outputs
The workshop was organised at relatively short notice, and this resulted in a small number of
participants. The discussion however was lively and some useful insights were reached.
2.1
Real World Problems
The real world problems faced by the organisations present included:

A cycle of deprivation in some groups in society caused by crime, unemployment, low
education levels, and poverty

Climate change

Lack of adequate walking access information about the outdoors in New Zealand

Declining indigenous biodiversity
Questions that the organisations present currently find it hard to answer include:

The number and location of state houses that are available right now

The availability of appointments/places for healthcare and social services such as drug
and alcohol rehabilitation

The precise location of places in the outdoors where the public can walk, and the
location of access points to those places

The precise location of pest animal traps in or near native bush restoration projects (due
to lack of accuracy in topo maps)

How to determine the impact of action to prevent climate change
Participants also discussed more general questions of interest to them they believed open
government data could help answer. These included:

What are the social economics of a particular area?

What are the hotspots for crime?

What type of information would facilitate the development of green buildings?

What is the exact address and location of a particular property?

Has someone spread pesticides close to my house/field and made my crops die or my
kids sick?

Where are the areas of outbreak of swine flu? (or any other pandemic)

Where do tourists go? Where are they from?

I need a place to stay for the rugby world cup, is it dodgy? Is it windy? Can I walk to the
stadium from there? Is it safe? How far is it?

Which farming areas are the most productive? How does this correlate with organic
farming methods?
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6
Suggested Data to Open
Suggestions from workshop participants (both those in person, and on Twitter) for data to be
made open included:

Real time information on availability of Social Services and Programmes (e.g. Alcohol
Rehabilitation etc)

State Housing data (What is occupied/available and where?)

Flu outbreak data

Crime data (geo-tagged)

Water and river flow data

Wind drift data

Real time weather data

Biodiversity and soils data

DOC andWalking Access Commission data combined and released so it can be used
offline in handheld GPS units

Walking Access Commission gathered data on access points and walking
locations/tracks

DOC historic sites data
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3 Analysis
This section takes the input from the first two workshops and provides analysisof data to open,
and emerging themes and ideas.
3.1
The Open Government Context
To set context at the workshop the place of open data in the broader open government space was
discussed.
There are a number of aspects to open government, as shown in the following diagram 2:
Open Government
Transparency
eGovernment
(citizen centric
services)
Open Data
Participatory &
Collaborative
Democracy
A commitment to transparency and accountability by government is essential in building the
trust and engagement that a health democracy requires.
eGovernment provides citizen centric services, that is, government services such as filing tax
returns, applying for a passport, via the Internet, in such a way as to make citizens interaction
with government simpler and make more efficient. It relieves citizens from having to navigate
the complexity of government structures and instead provides a tailored and personalised service
to them directly.
Open data involves making data collected by government publicly available in a useful, open
format, unless there is a demonstrable reason not to. This results in useful services developed by
people outside of government, often combining multiple government and non-governmental
2
This diagram was created as part of the #nzdata process but draws heavily from Australian Senator Kate Lundy’s
Three Pillars of Open Government. See http://www.katelundy.com.au/2010/05/26/keynote-address-gov2-0-expo2010/
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datasets to create new tools. This can, in addition, enable citizens to enhance government data
by correcting inaccuracies and contributing new data. Open data can also improve efficiencies
within government by providing agencies with better access to data and tools for evidence based
policy and decision making.
Participatory and collaborative democracyinvolves engaging citizens collaboratively in the
development, design and implementation of government policy. This is facilitated by the web
and social networking services. It enables individual citizens and interest groups to participate in
a more open and deliberative process than traditional ‘hub and spoke’ policy development. It
does this through aggregating input in many different ways, and allowing participants to see,
learn from, and consider each other’s perspectives.
3.1.1 Why Open Data?
Data is not useful in and of itself. It is only useful when it enables people to gain new knowledge
and make better decisions. A comparison between the traditional method and the open
government method of use of government held data is shown as follows3:
Open Data
Actions in the real world
Used by citizens to make decisions
Interpreted by citizens, in context
Information
(in documents, on web sites, and in the
media)
Individual and Shared
Knowledge
Open Government Model
Traditional Model
Knowledge
Used by citizens to make decisions
Interpreted by citizens, in context
Mashups, Tools and Services
(on the web and on mobile devices)
Automated aggregation &
distribution through APIS
Analysis within government
Citizen
contributed
data
Data
3
This diagram was created as part of the #nzdata process. It can be used under the same CC-BY-SA terms as the
rest of this document. For the original source files, contact julian.carver@seradigm.co.nz.
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9
Data to Open
Given the uneven distribution of workshop participants’ knowledge about different sectors,
types of data, and types of real world problem, suggestions ranged from quite general to quite
specific.
The following is a summarised list of the datasets or types of data to open, and what it could be
used to achieve.
Dataset or type of data
Problem that could be solved/solution that could be
built
Real time information on
availability of Social Services
and Programmes (e.g. Alcohol
Rehabilitation etc)
NGOs try to get people into services, but its’ very time
consuming to find out if places are available.
Aggregation tools could be built to so NGOs have this
information at hand, and can smooth people’s entry into
programmes.
State Housing data (What is
occupied/available and where?)
NGOs try to get homeless people into housing, but it’s
hard to know when new properties become available.
Build a mapping and alerts portal.
Crime data (geo-tagged)
Crime impacts on economic and social good. Geospatial
visualisations/mashups of crime data with economic and
social data could raise public awareness and assist public
engagement in initiatives to reduce crime and create
safer communities.
Vehicle Crash and WoF
inspection data
(in aggregate, and for individual
cars)
Lack of awareness about danger spots and times. Build
geospatial visualisation of crash data over time to raise
awareness and enable people to plan safer routes or safer
driving behaviour. Mashup with data from variable
message signs on state highways. Integrate as a service
to GPS navigation systems and smartphones.Help
consumers avoid buying unsafe (individual) cars, paying
more than what they are worth and paying for high repair
costs.
Real time transport data
Lack of awareness of delayed services causes frustration
and economic loss. Create real time tools to show actual
locations of public transport vehicles (buses and trains)
It is hard for the public to find out about all the events
that are happening in their area, so their enjoyment of
life and engagement in their community is lower. Open
event data from Ministry for Culture and Heritage (i.e.
no exclusive content license), so different web sites can
republish data and data can be integrated into services on
mobile devices.
Data on public events
Government employer data
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Choosing the wrong job and workplace can damage
individuals careers and the productivity of the public
service. Publish personal grievance and other employer
performance data for government to enable prospective
employees to make informed choices about where to
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work.
Satellite imagery
Available topographical map data is not accurate enough
to enable conservation groups to adequately plan
initiatives.
River flow data
Kayakers and rafters die because rivers are too high, or
are disappointed because they get to a river and find it is
too low. Canoe association wants to incorporate real time
flow data into their web site to enable better trip
planning.
Water usage data
Water is becoming a finite resource, and there is lack of
understanding about equity of consumption. Build
visualisations of water data and mashup with property
values, land use types to better understand utilisation.
Pest distribution and control data Invasive pests cost NZ $719m a year, and cause primary
sector output loses of $1.15 billion (est) however public
awareness is relatively low. Build visualisations to
engage the community in managing existing and new
threats, and tools to help them do that better.
DOC Track data
Data has inaccuracies. Enhancements could be
crowsourced, entrepreneurs could create eco-tourism
focused applications, including biodiversity data could
increase community engagement in conservation
Walking Access Commission
Data
People do not know the precise location of places in the
outdoors where they can walk, and the location of access
points to those places. Crowd sourced data submitted by
the public should be licenced for reuse and made
available through APIs so interested people can combine
it with DOC data, create walking tours, and download it
to GPSs.
Local Government data on
Finances, Rates, Land, Consents,
permitted activities, land quality,
cultural and heritage data,
biodiversity, biosecurity, water
quality, pollution
Local government processes can be time consuming and
difficult for citizens to engage with, and local
government budgets to deliver citizen centric services
can be limited. Enable the creation of mashups and tools
to increase local government transparency, and improve
citizen engagement in improving social and
environmental outcomes.
Safety Ratings for Restaurant
and Eateries
People (incl tourists) get food poisoning and/or are
disappointed by the quality of an establishment. Enable
entrepreneurs to build food safety ratings into augmented
reality guides to restaurants. Mashup with crowdsourced
ratings/reviews.
Government financials
Lack of detailed tax/revenue/economic data and models
hinders NZ economy. Build business intelligence tools to
help the private sector, and the public analyse proposed
policies.
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By going through the process of deliberating on data sets to open it became apparent that
individuals’ knowledge varied widely on what datasets existed, whether they were already open
or not, what could usefully be built on top of them (and whether that already existed or not), and
the real world problems they could help solve.
To expedite future prioritisation processes a registry of government datasets that have not yet
been opened could be provided, and the Suggest a dataset’ system on data.govt.nz could be
enhanced to enabling voting and discussion.
3.3
Emerging Themes and Ideas
A number of themes and ideas were deliberated on at the workshops and in subsequent
discussions. These are as follows.
Engagement:

The interest from the few NGOs who could participate in the process was strong, and
there is likely to be considerable value in further engagement with this sector on the open
data topic

The private sector has a strong desire to use open government data to create both
commercial tools and services, and social good solutions

There is some tension between the open data community’s desire to make things happen
quickly, and the time required for government to deliver. There is also tension around
those two groups having quite different expectations of timeframes for response and
engagement through social media services.

Most participants (in both workshops, and online) were not aware that the Data and
Information Re-Use Programme existed and subsequently requested that this Programme
be made more “open”.
Data required:

The need for a repository to tell the public what data government holds has been clearly
articulated by the open-data community as well at the NGO/community representatives
(I don’t know what I don’t know)

There is a desire for both Central Government and Local Government data to be open

There is a desire for data from Crown Research Institutes, District Health Boards, and
State Owned Enterprises to be made more open

There is a distinction between ‘administrative data’ and ‘real time data’

There is a desire for more real time data to be made available (e.g. weather reports, river
or traffic flows)

Much of the data required is data with positioning information (GPS) attached

There is a concern about government agencies and groups such as the Walking Access
Commission creating (expensive) mapping sites to provide access to information, and
crowdsource data gathering and data accuracy, but not providing the actual data in an
open licenced form, through APIs

When looking at prioritising which real-time data to make open the following three
criteria could be used: 1- Number of users 2: Frequency of use 3: Importance of decision
made using the data
Data quality and standards:
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
It is acknowledged that no datasets are 100% accurate. It is more important to make the
data available and allow for it to be corrected over time and with the participation of the
public, than to get it to perfection it and keep it closed. Crowd sourcing of data will help
to improve accuracy.

Data needs to be made available in an open format that can be developed upon by
citizens, NGOs and entrepreneurs. In a lot of cases Government doesn’t have to provide
the tools and online services, just the data.
Degrees of openness:

Opening government data is not a binary, ‘completely open’ or ‘totally closed’ situation.
There is a continuum of government data from completely secret, to commercially
sensitive data, to data containing personal information, to crown copyright data, to
different forms of Creative Commons licencing allowing different kinds of reuse.
Different levels of ‘openness’ may be required for different types of data, in order to
preserve privacy and commercial sensitivity.

Open data can help link-organisations be more effective (NGOs as intermediary between
citizens and government). Selected government data could be made available to them
(but not the general public) to allow them to improve their services.
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4 Suggestions
Through the #nzdata workshop process and the online engagement (via Twitter and the
open.org.nz email group), a number of suggestions have been made:

Make the Data and Information Re-Use Programme more ‘open’ by creating some
information on a government web site about the programme, and publishing minutes of
the Chief Executives Steering Group meeting

Create a registry of government datasets that have not yet been opened

Create an enhanced ‘Suggest a dataset’ system to enabling voting and facilitate online
discussion about the uses and benefits of opening particular datasets

Create a repository of NZ and international open data success stories

Run one or more Open Data ‘hackfests’, similar to those done by DigitalNZ

Run a ‘FullCodePress’ style competition to engage enthusiasts from the private sector to
develop web application and mobile application solutions for NGOs using open
government data
The ‘FullCodePress’ style competition generated particular interest at the second workshop.
Across the Tasman the MashupAustralia contest was run in 2009. This was a Government 2.0
Taskforce initiative that invited people to show why open access to government information is
good for the economy and society. Some new datasets were released for the purpose, and 82
mashups were created across a broad range of categories. The winners4 included ‘Suburban
Trends’ (a mashup of different types of crime and census data that allows you to compare and
contrast suburbs by a range of economic, education, safety and socio-economic indicators), and
‘Firemash’ a service that analyses notices from the state of New South Wales’ Rural Fire
Service, sends people a tweet if they are at risk, and allows citizens to submit fire information).
The state of Victoria also ran a competition earlier in 2010 called AppMyState5, to similar ends.
The winner of that competition was an iPhone application that scanned barcodes of product
containers and then displayed information on which recycle bin to put it in, based on which city
you were currently in. Prizes in these competitions ranged from $1,000 to $35,000.
While these competitions were over an extended time period, Mike Brown from Webstock came
up with the idea of holding a time pressured event like FullCodePress to engage the public’s
attention. FullCodePress runs over a 24 hour period, and teams are given a web site/system to
build for a charity. Some mixture of the two approaches could be used to generate many ideas,
entries and prototype tools, then picking a small number of participants for a time pressured
event. Web tools and mobile tools could be held as separate categories.
4
For more information see http://mashupaustralia.org/winners/
5
http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/app-my-state.html
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5 Recommendations
Recommendations made to the Data and Information Reuse Chief Executive’s Governance
Group following the workshop were that they:

Note the type of data, problems and solutions, and key ideas identified during the two
workshops

Note that a third workshop with representatives from identified agencies and a subset of
the Data and Information Reuse Officials group will be held in early September to
identify an action plan.

Note that a full report will be delivered subsequent to that workshop

Note that the idea of a tool-development competition for NGOs was proposed and that a
competition of this type would be moved forward and run by the private sector and either
take place mid-October or alternatively early 2011

Note that government agencies could volunteer some key datasets as basis for the
competition

Note the involvement of government in this competition could involve Ministers
awarding the prizes.

Agree in principle to support a competition of this type and advise on the feasibility of
involving particular Ministers in this event
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6 Appendix
6.1
Workshop Two Raw Notes
6.1.1 Group 1
Salvation Army
Real World Problems:

Low education

Crime

Societal context

Unemployment
Organisation:

Reactive organisation

Collects data for government

Asks for data where necessary
Suggestions:

Govt should say “we are open, this data is yours, access it”

NZ Housing: could give info about available housing etc

Better links between agencies

How many houses are available right now? NZ people should know

Availability of healthcare appointments (real time), drug and alcohol services etc

Knowledge of existing services needs to be at hand (real time info on availability),
smooth out processes and make it easier for the applicant

Open data could be partially open – only to pre approved parties, eg partnership between
govt and NGS

3 levels of data – policy, best practice advice (eg what is going on in other countries, new
approaches to tackle issues), operational

NZTA – crash statistics
Hikorangi Trust
Real World Problems:

Climate Change
Organisation:

Enabler – funds the “how” not the doing

8 groups around the country, each with unique knowledge
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
Any time a group tries to do work they come up against barriers – how do they share
knowledge?

How to aggregate outcomes?
Suggestions:

NIWA data

Need to show effectiveness

Work with Landcare, access their data on soil, wetlands etc, want to get their info better,
so much focus on journal articles instead of raw data and release as maps etc. Don’t see
their role as information
6.1.2 Group 2
Group name?
Issues with data:

Accuracy of data – 1:50,000 accuracy topp, traps not correctly mapped, OSH issue

Need satellite imagery – different groups supply it

Getting data formats they can use on their systems from other entities – no standardised
set of data formats

Timeliness of data – eg subdivisions info takes six months to get into LINZ

National Address Register type info not available, no street network in NZ – affects
police, fire, RMA situations, milk tankers (best, fastes way to get them to a farm and
pick up milk – nzta, local govt

Mixture of entities holding complimentary data – eg ‘legal’ roads

Google data not consistent re quality, date, coverage

Crowd sourcing of data will help with accuracy
Suggestions

Social economics of an area

Hot spots of crime

Narrative landcapes – click to see/read history of a place overtime

Catchment boards – water data (tourism, kayakers, water quality)

MET service – 24 hours of data, then goes to NIWA

Architecture/building world, what type of info would facilitate green buildings (sunshine
hours, aspect, energy efficiency, past history, closeness to streams or infrastructure.
Where the gas lines are (and other services), earthquake proofed? Is it insulated? Ability
to calculate potential for improved efficiencies

“Where am I” – Terralink – peple register address, public vs private good – want to sell
to police
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What questions can’t we answer:

Has someone spread pesticides close to my house/field and made my crops die or my
kids sick – need wind drift from NIWA – (MAF used with Foot & Mouth)

Show me the spread of swine flu (or any other pandemic info)

Where is the best place to go in NZ on a tourist trip – most sunshine hours, what do you
do etc

Where do tourists go? Where are they from?

I need a place to stay for the rugby world cup – is it dodgy? Is it windy? Can I walk to
the stadium from there? Is it afe? How far is it?

Getting people to the venues, getting rid of rubbish

Whateverputs a strain on services

Specialists seminars for the RWC

Who is coming so we can prepare?How to we coordinate with others, for all event
planning and management, what’s happening after RWC 3-6 months later, nor and
normalise those economies

Archives NZ – long term comparisons, demographics, land use, intergenerational health,
treaty research, changes in measurement scales, changes in language and territorial
boundaries

Problems – different orgs provided data with varying standards, quality, accecss controls,
opportunities around rich longitudinal data, genealogists, treaty of Waitangi, historical
research, opportunity to speed up settlement process

When is my busy going to arrive – google has nearly sorted this out

Productivity of farming, where is the best place to … then compare with organic farming
methods

Info re socioeconomic distributions and issues
Other ideas:
6.2

Share data selectively vs open data

Govt should play role by doing research on emerging issues and waysof doing things

Another call for catalogue of big data sets

Full code press - webstock - for a non-profit org

Use uni students to do a three month project
Workshop Two Tweet Stream
JoannaTMcLeod
Tomorrow I will be live-tweeting as @NZData a workshop with NGOs around “Solving real
world problems using NZ government data” #NZDATA
JoannaTMcLeod
It's interesting going into an event which has misunderstandings (http://is.gd/e9pMc) hopefully I can make things clearer tomorrow #NZDATA
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JoannaTMcLeod
From my own perspective, I like that DOC is commited to opening up its own data streams,
so it makes sense for them to take a lead #NZDATA
JoannaTMcLeod
@snapper86 relaying the conversation about #nzdata out on twitter for people who aren't
in the room
NZDATA
Today we have reps from ~ six NGOs to tell us how they could use #nzdata to solve real
world problems - your input is welcome too of course!
JoannaTMcLeod
The DOC conference room is so lovely it make me very optimistic today's about #nzdata
economicsnz
RT @NZDATA: today reps from ~ 6 NGOs say how they could use #nzdata to solve real world
problems - your input is welcome too of course!
NZDATA
But of course, if you can't physically join us, follow along on #nzdata, and tweet us in any
questions or issues you'd like us to raise
NZDATA
.@economicsnz we're in the conference room at DOC on Manners St if any other NGOs want
to join us physically - we're here til 12 #nzdata
NZDATA
We have people here from #webstock (@maupuia), Trudi the CIO at DOC, Walking Access
Comission and the Hikorangi foundation '#nzdata
economicsnz
RT @NZDATA @economicsnz we're in the conference room at DOC on Manners St if other
NGOs want 2 join us physically-we're here til 12 #nzdata
TRankQ
#nzdata. Looking forward to today's workshop with a small part of the NGO community re
real world problems that govt data will help solve.
NZDATA
Assessing the understanding of the concept of Open Govt - most people here today are
somewhat in the middle - a lot of work to do #nzdata
NZDATA
Open Govt is seen as a useful and interesting idea - how can we move from being passive
followers to active users though? #nzdata
normnz
“You can be open or you can govern” Sir Humphrey Appleyby #nzdata
NZDATA
There are a lot of benefits to open data, but not everyone knows what's possible yet #nzdata
NZDATA
@normnz hopefully the work we'll do today and also in the future will help to change Mr
Appleby's mind #nzdata
NZDATA
Getting context from @TRankQ now - DOC uses geospatial data for all it does, so they want
to use byproduct of data to benefit of all #nzdata
osrin
RT @normnz “You can be open or you can govern” Sir Humphrey Appleyby #nzdata - first
episode of Yes, Minister
economicsnz
RT @normnz: “You can be open or you can govern” Sir Humphrey Appleyby #nzdata
NZDATA
Data reuse workprogramme across all govt aims at making as much data released as
possible. This workshop is part of that workstream #nzdata
NZDATA
It's important to remember that this is an experiement, and we're trying to widen the
discussion, hence use of twitter #nzdata
economicsnz
RT @NZDATA: We have people here from #webstock (@maupuia), Trudi the CIO at DOC,
Walking Access Comission & the Hikorangi foundation #nzdata
economicsnz
RT @NZDATA: It's important to remember that this is an experiement, and we're trying to
widen the discussion, hence use of twitter #nzdata
NZDATA
But now hoping that crowdsourcing can help DOC fix its own data - DOC wants to develop
aggregate interface for where bats in NZ are #nzdata
NZDATA
The bat aggregator would help DOC with its work, but also help bat enthusiasts know where
to go. It's a touchable, tangible result. #nzdata
NZDATA
Open data is ideally a two-way conversation between govt and the people - both parties
need to find value in it for it to work #nzdata
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NZDATA
Sometimes people just want data cos it's fun to play with, but also it can help to add value to
what govt is doing as well #nzdata
NZDATA
Thinking about data is not (normally) part of a public servant's role description, so let's focus
on what matters to achieve more #nzdata
NZDATA
The tangible result we want to see from this workshop is getting two or three data sets
released #nzdata
NZDATA
There are tensions between open data enthusiasts saying “give it to us now! engage through
social media and respond in ten minutes!” #nzdata
NZDATA
Meanwhile there are technical and institutional barriers for govt workers in terms of
engaging through social media on open govt #nzdata
Mishon8
this would be interesting: Gov 2.0 Summit http://bit.ly/cnFLIl #nzdata
NZDATA
Hopefully @TRankQ'll link us later to the study she cited stating the value to the NZ
economy of unlocking govt data is $1.2 billion #nzdata
NZDATA
There is a willingness of some ppl in govt to make data available, but there may be tensions
with time and also higher authority #nzdata
NZDATA
Being able to provide clear examples of how data has been opened and what it's achieved is
going to be crucial to open govt success #nzdata
NZDATA
In the past couple of years there has been a shift to govt contacting NGOs and other
organisations to get their help w datagathering #nzdata
NZDATA
We want to know what your problems are, we want to know what data you want. Help us
out of our ivory tower! #nzdata
NZDATA
Our basic premise: if we make govt data more accessible (either as downloads or APIs), then
good things will happen. #nzdata
NZDATA
2 parts to premise: 1. govt pushing out data will aid crowdsourcing of more data 2. Geeks &
entreprenuers will build useful things #nzdata
NZDATA
Problems: opening data can cost, data is collected for purpose not just for the sake of it, so
how do you decide what data to open? #nzdata
NZDATA
Solution: focus on outcomes. What data sets would provide solutions to real world problems
if they were opened? Let's choose those #nzdata
NZDATA
Examples of data sets: DOC's tracks data they're hoping to release, or real time weather
feeds that could be mashed up #nzdata
NZDATA
Our process 1. wrkshp w open data enthusiasts 2. wrkshp w NGOs (today) 3. wrksp w govt
ppl to share suggestions 4. report 5. open it #nzdata
TRankQ
#nzdata URL for economic study re benefit of geospatial infrastructure and data to nz is
http://is.gd/eaxtX
NZDATA
RT @TRankQ: #nzdata URL for economic study re benefit of geospatial infrastructure and
data to nz is http://is.gd/eaxtX
rediguana
Just settling in to participate in #NZData - coming from a recreational GPS user perspective
http://bit.ly/bWWxpj :)
rediguana
very keen to see both DOC and WAC data combined and released so it can be used offline in
handheld GPS units #NZData
rediguana
keen to see it mashed up with http://bit.ly/ctPk3E and combined with LINZ topo #NZData
amatix
@rediguana doesn't need to be mashed, needs to be in openstreetmap. Which can output
to GPS. #NZData
rediguana
@amatix - needs of OSM sometimes conflict with the subtleties of creating routeable GPS
maps - OSM is not The One Ring #NZdata
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rediguana
@amatix - OSM produces very shitty Garmin img maps and is years behind NZ Open GPS
maps in terms of GPS map quality #NZData
rediguana
@amatix - best thing is to publish the data, and let multiple sources choose the best means
of integrating #NZData for their specific need
john_roberts
Just arriving (llate) at #nzdata workshop
00k
Hey, thanks to those tweeting from #nzdata. Good to hear what's going on.
rediguana
OSM also needs read-only #NZData, as it shouldn't be possible to edit layers that are a
correct snapshot in time e.g. electoral boundaries
kayakr
Good to see Walking Access Commission at #nzdata. Q: what license will their data be
available under, will they offer API not just portal
rediguana
#NZData downloads are essential, as APIs can't be used when no comms (GPS in field,
comms failed after emergency/disaster etc)
CampRobertsTNT
RT @rediguana: very keen to see both DOC and WAC data combined and released so it can
be used offline in handheld GPS units #NZData
CampRobertsTNT
RT @rediguana: Just settling in to participate in #NZData - coming from a recreational GPS
user perspective http://bit.ly/bWWxpj :)
CampRobertsTNT
RT @rediguana: #NZData downloads are essential, as APIs can't be used when no comms
(GPS in field, comms failed after emergency/disaster etc)
CampRobertsTNT
RT @rediguana: OSM also needs read-only #NZData, as it shouldn't be possible to edit layers
that are a correct snapshot in time e.g. electoral boundaries
CampRobertsTNT
RT @rediguana: keen to see it mashed up with http://bit.ly/ctPk3E and combined with LINZ
topo #NZData
00k
@tjh It's a workshop looking at user community needs for open data in government. See
#nzdata and @nzdata
john_roberts
A lot of our open #nzdata discussions focus on geospatial data. Why?
GOVISNZ
check out #nzdata today until 12 - workshop with NGOs on real world problems that could
be solved by opening up more data
NZDATA
We've been working in groups to talk about our real world problems and how data could
help, but we're breaking for morning tea now #nzdata
NZDATA
@john_roberts I think a lot of talk about geospatial data is 'cos it's amongst the easiest to
collect & mobile phones head that way #nzdata
NZDATA
RT @rediguana #NZData downloads are essential, as APIs can't be used when no comms
(GPS in field, comms failed after emergency/disaster etc)
rediguana
a big +1 :) OSM does need to mature somewhat #NZData - RT @amatix: We should aspire to
have OSM improve
rediguana
+1 #NZData needs a whole-of-government focus RT @amatix: as long as - govtorg>
doesn't go & build yet another mapping site
normnz
RT @normnz: @serenare http://is.gd/eaBnf and http://is.gd/eaBqX #nzdata
rediguana
@NZData @kayakr - I met WAC last year and made suggestion to release #NZData under
#CreativeCommons, get direction from Geospatial Office
NZDATA
Real world problems: accuracy of the data, getting data formats that you can use - there's no
standard, also timeliness #nzdata
john_roberts
Reporting back on #nzdata issues: accuracy, completeness, timeliness, inconsistent data
formats
NZDATA
Real world problems: different local authorities all have different data about mapping and
routes, so does google #nzdata
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NZDATA
Real world problem: Metservice gives its data to NIWA who turns it into a commercial
venture #nzdata
NZDATA
Questions ppl might ask that data can answer: Has someone sprayed weedkiller near my
house? Where is swine flu most prevelant? #nzdata
rediguana
Hardest thing with #NZData is creating feedback loop that works - allow citizens to flag data
issues, submit GPS data, and provide timely
NZDATA
Farming data: pesticides vs organics total productivity could be interesting to see #nzdata
rediguana
Agree, but still room for publishing authoritative #NZData via #SDI RT @amatix: I just don't
want WAC to spend $$$ building a mapping site
danjite
RT @NZDATA: Real world problem: Metservice gives its data to NIWA who turns it into a
commercial venture #nzdata
NZDATA
An issue for the Hikorangi Trust - a lot of Landcare's work is released as journal articles, but
not the raw data it came from #nzdata
john_roberts
Could better #nzdata help with tricky questions about the adequacy and extent of our
national housing stock?
NZDATA
It would help the Salvation Army to have real-time data about the availability of state
houses, doctors, drug & alcohol programmes #nzdata
john_roberts
How can better #nzdata help with timeliness and targetting of interventions?
mattjhaigh
RT @NZDATA: Real world problem: Metservice gives its data to NIWA who turns it into a
commercial venture #nzdata
NZDATA
Open data might not mean “available to all the public” but rather “Dept Housing provides
information to relevant NGOs if needed” #nzdata
john_roberts
Could some ngo's get privileged access to govt #nzdata in their efforts to help effective use
of govt programmes?
NZDATA
Privacy is an ongoing issue - transperancy is needed, but open data doesn't have to mean
disclosure of names etc, just trends #nzdata
rediguana
@NZData - if the #NZData isn't publicly available, then it isn't open data sorry, if it is NGOonly then it is still privileged data
normnz
@NZDATA And surely weather data does not have privacy implications #nzdata
rediguana
@NZData - the problem with CRI #NZData is that they are not funded to
prepare/publish/maintain datasets. To release requires funding.
economicsnz
RT @NZDATA: #Privacy is ongoing - transperancy is needed, but open data doesn't have to
mean disclosure of names etc, just trends #nzdata
economicsnz
RT @NZDATA: Farming data: pesticides vs organics total productivity could be interesting to
see #nzdata
NZDATA
.@rediguana The view today is that openness of data isn't completely black or white - it's a
continuem of how & who it's used by #nzdata
rediguana
Sometimes #NZData needs cleaning/preparation/conversion b4 rel RT @kayakr: I'm not sure
that releasing costs $
NZDATA
We're now going to be talking next steps are moving on from this meeting - where do we go
from here & who should be involved? #nzdata
NZDATA
“We want to know what data there is to know that the govt doesn't want us to know
about...” #nzdata
kayakr
@rediguana Where the data needs cleaning yes $, but often the data is there already,
shared with others, just not public #nzdata
rediguana
@NZData - the openness of #NZData is viewed from the outside looking in, not from the
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perspective of the publishing organisation
TRankQ
#nzdata. Really crunchy stuff coming out of today's wrkshop on solving real world prblms
with govt data @serenare's rprt will contain detail
john_roberts
Difficult for outiders to think about possibilities without knowing what #nzdata sets exist but
are not open
andrewwardell
RT @NZDATA “We want to know what data there is to know that the govt doesn't want us
to know about...” #nzdata // HEAR HEAR!
NZDATA
Now @maupuia is telling us about #FCP10 - I bet he's going to suggest a FullCodeDataHack,
which would be very awesome #nzdata
normnz
#nzdata I would be interested to know how much NGOs regard “special access” to govt. data
as a right and competitive advantage
rediguana
@NZData @joannatmcleod I can't do stats analysis, but if #NZData is open, I can pay
someone to do the analysis
NZDATA
“as a proof of concept - 3 teams locked in a room, come back with an app that does actually
something concrete” #nzdata #FULLCODEDATA
NZDATA
“Let's take what we already have and see what can be done with it “ - @TRankQ “it would
be promotion for data.govt.nz” @john_roberts #nzdata
NZDATA
Continuing the idea @maupuia emphasises a contest would involve designers and content
writers to make it more accessible to all #nzdata
kayakr
#nzdata I would rather see 1..N hackfests, similar to DigitalNZ rather than a competition
FullCodeData.
rediguana
@NZDATA @joannatmcleod open access to source or #NZData doesn't make things easier or
free, it just gives you more flexibility and control
NZDATA
“just having a bunch of pure data enthusiasts working together wouldn't necessarily
accomplish very much others would find useful” #nzdata
NZDATA
Community organisations would like govt depts to stop saying “this is our data”. It's the
_taxpayer's_ data. #nzdata
kayakr
#nzdata Who made that last quote? How do they know enthusiasts couldn't create
something useful? Seems very condescending to me.
rediguana
@NZDATA I call bullshit. NZ Open GPS enthusiasts have produced better open roading
#NZData than the Government.
john_roberts
How do we bring together enthusiastic technical peope, willing govt agencies holding
#nzdata and ngo partners?
concertm
@john_roberts geospatial is grabbing #nzdata attention partly because of “$500m
opportunity” http://tinyurl.com/nz-geo-500m
kayakr
.@john_roberts Need to expand data.govt.nz Better forums, voting/endorsement of data
requests, pingbacks of usage of data sets, more #nzdata
NZDATA
We're finishing up now, so what next? “Sign up to #nzdata twitter tag”“check out data sets
available”“feed convo back to workmates”
normnz
Agree. we need collaboration RT @kayakr: #nzdata I would rather see 1..N hackfests, similar
to DigitalNZ rather than a competition.
rediguana
@NZData NZ Open GPS filled a gap left by LINZ's inability to respond to the publics desire for
open #NZData
kayakr
.@NZDATA And enthusiasts can do that too, not just code. Need to facilitate enthusiasm,
promote success, encourage collaboration #nzdata
sarabeee
RT @concertm: @john_roberts geospatial is grabbing #nzdata attention partly because of
“$500m opportunity” http://tinyurl.com/nz-geo-500m
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wiselark
Looks like there's been some interesting discussion at the #nzdata workshop this morning on
open data. Thanks for the tweets!
NZDATA
What next: “publish findings from meeting”“work on data competition”“create contact
lists”“tell my managers”“blog about it” #nzdata
rediguana
+1 need collaboration and coordination, not competition RT @normnz: we need
collaboration RT @kayakr: #nzdata would rather see N hackfests
rediguana
@NZData I'd be keen to do something like a #CrisisCamp and mix it up with #NZData to see
what data we need for an emergency/disaster
JoannaTMcLeod
I have finished tweeting as @nzdata for #nzdata and can now become more cynical
accordingly!
andrewwardell
RT @NZDATA: Community organisations would like govt depts to stop saying “this is our
data”. It's the _taxpayer's_ data. #nzdata
JoannaTMcLeod
@kayakr absolutely we need to encourage collaboration, which is why more than just data
enthusiasts are needed. #nzdata
JoannaTMcLeod
@rediguana have you seen the results from #FCP10 though? The winners were the charities
involved, not the teams themselves! #nzdata
rediguana
You'll have to forgive my ignorance Joanna, whats FCP? :) RT @JoannaTMcLeod: have you
seen the results from #FCP10 though? #nzdata
JoannaTMcLeod
@rediguana yeah, so when @maupuia was suggesting a competition it wasn't like a death
match, it was a “let's all do good things w #nzdata”
rediguana
@JoannaTMcLeod my biggest lesson from a few of these style events is how to turn short
term efforts into something sustainable ;) #nzdata
NZDATA
Today's #NZDATA Workshop Twitter Stream can be found here: http://ow.ly/2nmId - Thanks
to @serenare for showing us how to extract this
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