CITY OF SHAWNEE
PUBLIC WORKS AND SAFETY COMMITTEE MEETING
MINUTES
AUGUST 18, 2009
7:00 P.M.
Chairperson Sandifer called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m.
Committee Members Present
Councilmember Pflumm
Councilmember Sawyer
Councilmember Straub
Councilmember Sandifer
Other
Councilmembers Present
Councilmember Goode
Staff Present
City Manager Gonzales
Assistant City Manager Charlesworth
City Clerk Powell
City Attorney Rainey
Assistant City Attorney Rainey
Public Works Director Freyermuth
City Engineer Wesselschmidt
Fire Chief Hudson
Police Chief Morgan
Parks and Recreation Director Holman
Planning Director Chaffee
Finance Director Kidney
Deputy Planning Director Allmon
Information Systems Director Doherty
Members of the public who spoke: (Item 1) GRAHM SMITH, Gould Evans/Zimmer;
DAN MUSSER, Gould Evans/Zimmer; (Item 3) JANET GARMS, Kutak Rock.
1.
PRESENTATION OF FINAL DRAFT OF THE I-435 CORRIDOR STUDY.
Chairperson Sandifer stated that in January, the City entered into an agreement
with Gould Evans/Zimmer to draft the I-435 Corridor Land Use Analysis and
Market Study.
GRAHM SMITH, Gould Evans/Zimmer, thanked the Committee to present the I435 corridor study. He introduced Dan Musser of Gould Evans/Zimmer
Companies who will focus on the market assessment piece. He stated he
wanted to first go over a couple preliminary pieces with the Committee about the
process. He stated they will begin by getting into the components of the plan and
spend most of the presentation on that focus.
GRAHM SMITH stated the Committee also received copies of tonight’s
presentation. He stated they will first go through the process where they are at,
as they are right at the end and talk about the actual draft plan.
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GRAHM SMITH stated the intent of this plan when they were hired, was really to
provide the Council, as elected officials, with a policy document. He stated this
policy document will help them guide future development in the I-435 corridor.
GRAHM SMITH stated their study area is primarily from the river south to about
87th Street, but they are really focusing in on the area at Johnson Drive and
Shawnee Mission Parkway, along the I-435 corridor and is where they will see a
lot of detail and explanation. He stated there were two primary components of
this plan, a land use study component and a market analysis. He stated all
along, they are really trying to get towards an implementation, including
strategies and actions the Council can undertake to help guide development
within the corridor.
GRAHM SMITH stated this is a policy document to help the Council frame
decisions as development occurs.
GRAHM SMITH stated they basically laid out a four step process and identified
implementation after the planning process was complete. He stated they are
currently in the plan/development phase. He stated what the Council has seen
and what is posted on the website, is the full draft of the plan document itself. He
stated based on the existing conditions assessment, which they will talk about in
more detail later, and the project charrett, which was a series of open houses
back in May that helped them provide the direction for the plan and the elements
they will see tonight.
GRAHM SMITH stated he thinks a lot of them may have stopped by the Justice
Center at one or more of the open houses held during that week. He stated one
of the first things they worked on was the existing conditions assessment. He
stated it really had two primary components, one looking at the physical
environment and the other piece was the development market and economics
within the area and region.
GRAHM SMITH stated Dan will touch on the market piece a little later on, but he
wanted to talk quickly about the physical environment piece and let the Council in
on some of some of the things they found. He stated they may not be very
surprising.
GRAHM SMITH stated as they looked at the area and started looking at some of
the physical characteristics, physical opportunities, and constraints in the area,
they identified several things. He stated the primary thing that really shapes the
character out there, as might be expected, is typography, the woodlands, and
water courses that run through the primary site and follow along the I-435
corridor to shape the physical features of the properties.
GRAHM SMITH stated when they looked at the land uses, they might expect as
they move north from Shawnee Mission Parkway that they really start to look at
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more undeveloped land. He stated he would not even call it vacant, but
undeveloped, in that development has not happened yet. He stated there have
been some rezoning in the area to help spur development a long time ago and
those have yet to come to fruition, so this plan addresses some of those things
as they move into some of the strategies and recommendations.
GRAHM SMITH stated the commercial zoning was for the mall some 20+ years
ago. He stated they also found the area has good utility service. He stated it is a
matter of extending the utilities to the development sites themselves, but utilities
are in the area – water, sewer, electric, cable, and gas. He stated those services
are definitely there.
GRAHM SMITH stated there is good connectivity with the interstate system. He
stated the arterial road system serves the road very well, is very accessible and
easy to move about, and is something they would like to carry forward.
GRAHM SMITH stated also with the good connectivity from the roadway system,
there is also great visibility for the area. He stated there is great visibility afforded
by I-435 and Shawnee Mission Parkway, but also back to the access with the two
interchanges, the on and off at Johnson Drive, which give the area tremendous
accessibility within the region.
GRAHM SMITH stated they noticed there is currently a lack of parks in the area
and a lack of trails, which is tied to the lack of development. He stated there are
planned trails in the area and great surrounding parkland to tie into, so those are
things they believe will come as development comes.
GRAHM SMITH stated with regard to the physical environment for development,
a few of the opportunities they found, was first, the undeveloped land. He stated
they are not redeveloping things and there is infrastructure present, so it is really
about encouraging development to happen in that area.
GRAHM SMITH stated with regard to the large parcels that exist out there today,
there are some larger parcels in portions of the corridor area that could really be
taken advantage of for a more cohesive larger development along I-435.
GRAHM SMITH stated he mentioned accessibility and visibility within the area;
these are key components to commercial office and future development. He
stated they believe the natural areas are really an opportunity within the corridor
to build upon and use those as a development amenity. He stated there are
drainageways, wooded areas, and some steep slopes, and they will determine
how to take those to their advantage to create a unique development
environment.
GRAHM SMITH stated he mentioned the proximity to infrastructure and the
surrounding uses that are current in the area with housing surrounding it, the
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retail offices obviously along Shawnee Mission Parkway, and some offices in the
Shawnee Mission Parkway and Johnson Drive areas as well.
GRAHM SMITH stated the number one challenge they discussed during the
process was the typography and the challenges of making development happen
on that property, but again, they think it is an opportunity and a challenge. He
stated the other one identified during the process, primarily through the research
on the demographics is the low amount of population in the area. He stated the
primary study area of I-435, Johnson Drive, and Shawnee Mission Parkway has
a very low population; he believes there are less than 200 people in that entire
area.
GRAHM SMITH stated even as they start to move out from that area, there are
the less dense nature of the development and the low population that is there to
frequent future uses and the current uses that are existing.
GRAHM SMITH stated another challenge is the competition, not only locally but
within the region. He stated they have facilities such as the raceway to the north,
large commercial development to the south in Johnson County, so the
competition for not only retail services, but jobs, houses, and all types of uses is
something that will have to be overcome.
GRAHM SMITH moved to property ownership. He stated there are some large
tracts, but is quite a bit, especially on the east side when the property gets
somewhat fragmented, so as they move forward and want to establish a more
cohesive development pattern, they will determine how they want to encourage
that collaboration among different property owners.
GRAHM SMITH turned the podium over to Dan Musser to talk about the Market
Study.
DAN MUSSER, Gould Evans/Zimmer, stated he is going to try to present a
summary of a lot of the work they did to study the demographics, office, and retail
markets as it relates to this site. He stated just to put the land area in
perspective from a quantitative standpoint, because he is going to show the
Committee some numbers, the buildable area on the two sides of the Johnson
Drive and I-435 interchange, which is the primary study area, has about 553
acres. He stated the overall acreage is significantly more than that, but is the
buildable area they will see in the plan.
DAN MUSSER stated that is probably a little higher than normal suburban
densities can accommodate, probably close to 3.5 million square feet of retail
and office uses and over 3,000 homes. He stated they are talking about a really
big area for potential for future growth for many years here in Shawnee. He
stated putting a dollar sign on it, it would represent about $1,300,000,000 in new
development over a 20 year timeframe into the future.
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DAN MUSSER stated what they are really doing is trying to set a direction for this
area, but it is going to be a long process because of the capacity of the property.
Councilmember Goode asked Mr. Musser about when he says ‘capacity’ and
what he is actually referring to; does the City not have the capacity to do it
because the ground is so rough in that area.
DAN MUSSER replied what he is saying is if the ground were more flat they
would have more capacity, but out of the 800 to 1,200 acres, after they take out
the streamways and open space they want to leave, as well as the roadways and
right-of-ways for infrastructure, that leaves about 550 developable acres. He
stated if they would use a little above normal suburban densities, they could build
that much space over time.
DAN MUSSER stated they looked at the demographics. He stated they did not
study residential from a market perspective, because they know there is a
significant market for residential development in Shawnee and part of what they
looked at from a planning perspective, were the different types of residential,
other than single family, potentially single family attached, and multi-family. He
stated they really did not study the market, because they know there is a market.
DAN MUSSER stated they did study the commercial market, office, and retail, in
addition to demographics with income and education. He stated they did it based
on a radius of one, three, and five miles around the center of the site at Johnson
Drive and I-435. He stated this is a pretty typical way that retailers or office
building developers will study the market, so it will be good information in the
detailed report for hopefully those interested in development.
Councilmember Goode asked if in the City’s situation, are they looking for
attached and multi-family, because they do not have 10,000 acres there and just
have a number of acres that was just mentioned; they are just trying to do the
best they can as far as inhabitation is concerned; as far as residents are
concerned.
DAN MUSSER stated from one perspective, the property has been zoned for
commercial so there are higher expectations of its value. He stated if they do
higher density residential, they have a better chance of meeting the needs of the
owners who would sell the property.
DAN MUSSER stated as they get into the plan, they see a mixed use proposed
development that mixes residential and commercial together on the site.
Councilmember Goode stated the word ‘attached’ is what he thinks is going to be
the wave of the future in designated areas like that.
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DAN MUSSER stated he thinks Councilmember Goode is correct. He stated
they see this as an opportunity and is also a little easier to accommodate with the
typography and building on some things that have already happened.
DAN MUSSER stated in looking at the population area, they compared the study
area, which is the one, three, and five mile radiuses with pier cities, Overland
Park and Lenexa, with the greater Kansas City metropolitan statistical area
(MSA) and with the United States. He stated they found in population and
density and in numbers of households that the area is growing about two times
the national average and at not quite two times the greater Kansas City area. He
stated it is medium density when compared to a city like Overland Park, but is
similar to Lenexa.
DAN MUSSER stated they looked at income compared to Overland Park,
Lenexa, Kanas City, and the United States. He stated there is strong projected
growth income and slightly lower income than southern Johnson County where a
lot of the commercial development is currently happening, the south I-435
corridor, but higher income levels than greater Kansas City or the United States
as a whole.
DAN MUSSER stated from an education perspective, there are high levels of
college and graduate education.
Councilmember Straub asked if the study area is all of Shawnee.
DAN MUSSER replied it is just within the five mile radius he pointed out earlier.
Councilmember Straub asked what parts they were looking at within Overland
Park and Lenexa, or are they within that five mile radius. He stated there are not
a lot of residents in that particular area.
DAN MUSSER stated they are comparing the five mile radius to the entire City of
Overland Park and the entire City of Lenexa. He stated they are really looking at
the trade area. He stated it is how the industry looks at things and is a little
arbitrary and is more like how the crow files and how a person drives.
DAN MUSSER stated another thing they studied is the demographic breakdown
called tapestry. He stated it divides the population into income, age, and
residential and puts them in groupings. He stated they really look at the existing
makeup now.
DAN MUSSER presented a breakdown and noted their cute names such as Milk
and Cookies, Bloombergs, and Sophisticated Squires, but it tells them what this
population’s attributes are from income and, perhaps, a discretionary standpoint;
it gives an idea to the retailers about what types of customers they would have,
but also supports the idea that while there is a diversity of education and income
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in the area, it is primarily an affluent, educated, young, suburban population. He
stated that may not surprise the Council, but it helps them with what they are
really talking about based on the last census.
Councilmember Pflumm stated he does not know if they do this kind of thing on a
regular basis, in comparing this site with other sites, i.e. a site in Minneapolis or
Illinois. He asked how those sites compare in these categories for a developer,
so if they are looking at 10 sites across the country, how does Shawnee stack
up, possibly in the top 10%, the middle, or where.
DAN MUSSER replied he is not sure they did that comparison, but could for site
locations. He thinks they can tell the Committee that it is the kind of site that
would attract the types of retail development they would like. He stated there is a
work force that could support office development and a population that will buy
the homes. He stated whether or not they are in the top 5, 10, or 18 percent,
because he does not know, but could certainly do an investigation to make that
determination.
DAN MUSSER noted the top three categories are at the higher level of income,
education, and age of the categories that exist and the ones that are most
represented in the areas.
Councilmember Straub stated he does not know if this is just the U.S., but
Shawnee almost doubled everything in the U.S. He asked if there were
categories that were lower, because obviously there were categories that were
not listed.
DAN MUSSER stated there were 60+ categories and some of them can not be
compared here because they deal with urban areas and industrial areas and
rural areas. He stated Shawnee has the best from the category of income,
education, and age – the best and significantly a higher percentage than the
United States.
Councilmember Pflumm stated they are obviously interested in this site for the
City and community. He asked if a potential developer is going to be interested
as well or are they going to loiter.
DAN MUSSER stated he thinks this is the kind of thing that gets developers
interested.
Councilmember Straub stated of the numbers he saw and if he were a developer
and had a choice, he would go look at Overland Park or Lenexa, rather than this
study area.
DAN MUSSER stated they have an area that has 1,200 vacant acres that they
are trying to fill in with something.
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Councilmember Straub asked if they are looking at primarily office.
DAN MUSSER replied they are looking at office and retail.
Councilmember Straub stated Renner and K-10 is going crazy. He stated every
time he drives up there, there is a new building either under construction or
completed and that is pretty flat ground which is tough about this particular spot
they are talking about here tonight.
DAN MUSSER stated when they assessed the site, from their perspective, it is
sort of a quantitative analysis, but also as developers themselves, what is the
development community going to look at. He stated from a residential
standpoint, the typography is a challenge and the land prices are a challenge
because of the existing zoning for commercial development. He stated they see
there is a market for multi-family.
DAN MUSSER stated there are amenities adjacent already with the retail along
Shawnee Mission Parkway.
He stated there are significant residential
opportunities farther to the west and potentially on the site. He stated the
typography, while it is also a challenge, can also be an opportunity, so if the site
is developed with its natural amenities and as a natural setting, it could be a good
place for residential development.
DAN MUSSER stated there is certainly the capacity for residential development
and they will see in the plan areas that have been suggested to be more suited to
residential development to be buffers from the existing neighborhoods and that
sort of thing. He stated there is a good link to I-435 and to the rest of the
community with this being the interchange which is somewhat midway between
southern Johnson County, the speedway, and the Village West development, so
it is a good location for residential and commercial.
DAN MUSSER stated they looked at the office market somewhat differently. He
stated in the greater Kansas City area, this site is in the northern Johnson County
market and there is a little over 8 million square feet of existing square footage
that has 9.4% vacancy, $1767 average rental rates and almost 80,000 square
feet was absorbed in 2008. He stated there is some amount of space under
$250,000 that is under construction.
DAN MUSSER stated this is inclusive of all types of space. He stated they
actually have the lowest vacancy rate based on this in the metropolitan area,
which usually means there is demand and capacity for office space. He stated
they found in this market that the existing supply is typically smaller, 10,000 to
20,000 square foot buildings, owner-occupied buildings or the second floor above
a bank, so there is no traditional market in this area and in this part of Shawnee
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for multi-tenant speculative buildings or corporate headquarter-type buildings.
They see potential for those on the site, but at this point there is no precedence.
Councilmember Straub asked what they are building at 95th Street and I-435.
DAN MUSSER stated those are mostly single tenant buildings.
Councilmember Straub stated those are huge buildings, four, five, and six story
buildings.
DAN MUSSER stated those are the types of buildings – they have to have a site
to be able to compete for those in the marketplace, so as part of this project, as
they will see on the site plan with corporate office sites, there is no reason that
those could not be located on this site in Shawnee.
Councilmember Straub stated that ground is probably a lot flatter and easier to
work with. He stated if Mr. Musser said there is no real market for it in this area,
but yet there is a market for it two or three miles away . . .
DAN MUSSER stated this is looking backwards as to what is there now and not
forward as to what they can attract. He thinks they will see with the plan that
there is a place for those.
DAN MUSSER presented a slide showing the rents over the past eight years.
He stated the message here and the line they are right below is $20.00. He
stated to build a new building in today’s market, if this were a normal market with
today’s construction costs, the rents would be in the $23.00 to $28.00 range with
$25.00 as the average. He noted the $16.00-17.00 line. He stated they are
looking backwards, but this is saying that this is more of a traditional market with
these smaller buildings that are wood framed and one or two stories and 10,000
to 20,000 feet.
DAN MUSSER stated to create the framework for these new larger buildings to
be developed, they need a plan and a place for those to happen. He stated they
are looking backwards with this study to give them the information to look forward
with. He stated from an office standpoint when they compare their intersection to
95th Street and I-435, they have the same educated work force, strong
demographics, the adjacent retail amenities that office users look for. He stated
there is not a lot of new Class A space, Class A is a term he has heard in
commercial real estate that means a larger 150,000 to 250,000 foot multi-tenant
building with a 25,000-30,000 foot floor plate, which in the plan there will be
space that will accommodate buildings like that.
DAN MUSSER stated there is high visibility of portions of the site from I-435 with
90,000+ cars a day going by. He stated there is good transportation connections
to both the north and south and while there is some difficulty in the typography,
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there are some parcels available, as they will see, that can be developed for
commercial.
DAN MUSSER stated when they start talking about some of the design ideas
and themes, they think it is important to keep the natural typography and natural
drainage and maybe create some water features, but do something different than
just grading it all off and making it flat.
Councilmember Pflumm stated when they were out there on Johnson Drive at
the Justice Center, he really did not see anywhere on the northwest corner of
Shawnee Mission Parkway and I-435 when they had the gun powder facility in
there and when I-435 was put in there, they put in that big berm. He agrees with
Mr. Musser’s comments, in that they can use that typography, probably except
for that hill because it takes away around 80% visibility. He asked if that has
been addressed.
GRAHM SMITH responded that the berm was not specifically called out in there,
but agreed that is a good point.
DAN MUSSER stated there are certainly some things they could do to make
things more visible and better than what is there and will take note of that. He
stated some of the challenges again are with the typography and the adjacent
landfill. He stated there is a power line that somewhat goes diagonally across
the site. He stated it is not something they would necessarily have to move, but
it sort of affects how things might lay out and the plan is.
DAN MUSSER stated there are strong competing markets and Shawnee is in the
north Johnson County market. He stated the strongest commercial market in
greater Kansas City where 65-70% of the office space is in the metropolitan area
is south Johnson County, so it is good that Shawnee is near it and perhaps can
start to be thought of as part of it with this site, but there is definitely an east/west
I-435 sort of mentality among developers and businesses that locate there with
retail going farther south all the time.
DAN MUSSER stated there is somewhat of a challenge with the bypassed parcel
and how they make the market think it is a good place to develop and that is
really what they are trying to do.
DAN MUSSER stated they looked at 12 categories of retail and by using the
demographic data available, they can figure out what there is a market for in the
trade area. He stated if they have a one mile area without very many residents,
so other than the highway access if they think they are going to put in a lot of
food service, pad site development, and retail development to support the one
mile radius, there is only about 100-200 people within that radius, but developing
it as part of a more comprehensive development with a longer term view, there is
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a capacity to build enough retail and residential to tie It all together and support
the retail development that occurs.
DAN MUSSER stated the slide shows there is some capacity that is not being
satisfied within the five mile radius, so there are people leaving the five mile
radius to go somewhere else and buy something. He stated there is $16.8
million in the three mile radius going somewhere outside the five mile radius to
buy things.
DAN MUSSER stated the chart tells a retail developer, or tenant, that there is a
market for certain things, without having to take it from someone. He stated they
can always try to fight it out and take it from someone else, which is where they
get in the battles for incentives between places like Wal-Mart moving from one
place to the other.
DAN MUSSER stated this chart tells them at a high level that there is some
unserved market within the area.
Councilmember Straub stated from this chart it looks as if they do not want to
build another Home Depot or Lowe’s out there.
DAN MUSSER stated that is correct.
Councilmember Straub stated motor vehicles would be tough right now since
they are closing a lot of dealerships.
DAN MUSSER stated that is correct as well. He stated it is fair to say that this
whole market right now, with the economy the way it is, does not tell him
anything other than they are delaying what might happen by a year or two. He
stated they have seen rents and values of buildings go down and retailers are not
leasing space. He stated it will come back and get back to normal and hopefully
the same people will be doing the same things.
Councilmember Straub asked if this chart includes the speedway area, because
Shawnee is not that far from them.
DAN MUSSER replied that particular area is just outside the five mile radius.
DAN MUSSER continued with some of the same things for retail. He stated
there are some underserved segments and some potential large parcels, but this
is a huge development. He stated the speedway is 400 acres and this is two to
three times that big, so there is a lot of future potential for different types of uses
and hopefully they have a framework for the flexibility necessary for a lot of these
things to happen.
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DAN MUSSER stated they have good regional demographics and it is a central
location and access to the highway which is really what all the retailers are
looking for.
Councilmember Pflumm asked for point of reference.
DAN MUSSER clarified they were looking at Briarcliff.
DAN MUSSER continued with some of the challenges, like the typography. He
stated one thing that is always a challenge when they are looking at multiple
parcels is assembling them. He stated Grahm will talk about that a little later
when he discusses the plan.
DAN MUSSER stated they are assuming that the City of Shawnee does not want
to buy the property or condemn anyone’s property, but set up a framework for the
market to be redirected to occur in a certain way and hopefully set some policies
that will encourage that development to occur. He stated there are no big radical
ideas from a standpoint of land assemblage and condemnations. He stated they
spent a lot of time meeting with the property owners to get to an understanding of
what they want to do and how they can participate in this individually or
collectively. He stated this is to give a direction and framework to the future and
not to set in and intervene.
Chairperson Sandifer asked what kind of plan did they have on the bridge over
Shawnee Mission Parkway.
City Manager Gonzales explained they used the study the City had done before,
and was part of the resource material provided to them, so they did not have to
redo it as they looked at the transportation network.
Councilmember Straub asked being next to the largest dump in the state,
probably one of the largest dumps in the country, will that affect desirability for a
developer to come in.
DAN MUSSER replied they talked to a lot of people about that and got different
viewpoints. He stated there is a perception issue, more than a reality issue. He
stated they talked to the Deffenbaugh people about using some of their off-gas
for the development and what it really is, whether it is a negative or not, is it is a
parcel that will not ever be developed, or at least for many years, so there will not
be any rooftops there. He stated whether it can be used in the future for
recreational or some other use is a potential.
Councilmember Pflumm stated they are not that far away from the eastern
portion.
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GRAHM SMITH stated they had not mentioned the landfill at all yet here 40
minutes into the presentation, but believes they received some mixed reviews.
He stated some people thought it was just a perceived impact, where others
really voiced an opinion that it was odor, traffic, and other things, so it really
depended on who they talked to.
GRAHM SMITH stated after they did their existing conditions and background
research at the three day session at the Justice Center, they presented some
alternatives for addressing development on the site and really the intent of those
sessions, was to draw the best ideas out of those different alternatives and give
the community a direction to move forward on, encouraging and shaping
development in the corridor.
GRAHM SMITH stated they came up with a map which is no longer completely
valid. He stated they went through some iteration on this and they will see the
actual plan in a moment. He stated what they actually came out of the sessions
with some direction from the Council’s participation, from the community, the
property owners and their advisory committee that they worked with throughout
the process. He stated really there are four big ideas they will see going through
the plan components.
GRAHM SMITH stated the first idea is to mix uses. He stated they have talked
about mixed use and mixing of uses, so they asked how they create a
development area that is encouraging to all different types of uses, whether it is
office, retail, residential, or recreation and try to accommodate those things along
the I-435 corridor.
GRAHM SMITH stated the second one is using those natural features as a
development amenity and respecting them; protecting the drainageway so they
can do their job and drain the area well and serve as a green infrastructure for
the area, but also serve as that amenity to development, bring it into the
development, and have that development use that amenity as it can.
GRAHM SMITH stated the third one was economic sustainability. He stated they
will talk about sustainability in general, but the one that came up during this
session was economic sustainability; not only being green and respectful of the
environment, but being profitable – not only for the developers and development,
but for the community. He asked how they ensure there is a tax base or an
addition to the tax base that helps the community do what they need to do to
provide services to the citizens within the community.
GRAHM SMITH stated Dan Musser mentioned collaboration and how they
encourage property owners to work together towards a future vision that is a
broader picture of the entire area and not just piece by piece. He stated they
received good feedback on behalf of the City of the City trying to encourage that
throughout the development of this area. He stated whatever the City has done
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in the past, as far as development, and reviewing those types of things – people
were very complimentary of the City trying to have people act together and
develop this at least in bigger pieces than individual properties.
GRAHM SMITH stated with all of that background material and all that process,
they have come to the plan they see in front of them tonight. He stated the
Council has copies of the presentation and it is online. He stated they have gone
through the existing conditions piece and will focus the rest of the evening on the
four main components of the plan.
GRAHM SMITH stated the first thing they put together was the Future Land Use
Plan. He stated they looked at the future land use designations within the current
comprehensive plan and tried to see where they could fit based on the
development that was desired in the area. He stated they took a lot of the
existing land use categories and added a few new ones that were more specific
to this area.
GRAHM SMITH stated along the east side of I-435 and the north side of Johnson
Drive is an area they are calling mixed density residential. He stated they will
also see they have included the high density residential category from the current
land use plan. He stated they are really trying to hit the idea of increasing the
residential population in the area. He stated they are providing additional
medium-to-high density residential opportunities. He stated those can be in
different formats, whether they are attached, whether they are smaller lot
detached, townhomes, apartments, condominiums, ownership, and rentals. He
stated there is a good mix of residential types to increase the population in the
area.
GRAHM SMITH stated the others are the office flex and the mixed use flex. He
stated the office flex is the landfill. He stated they have identified a lot of that
area as office flex space, so a low intensity office that supports either light
manufacturing or warehousing; something that is not as intense on the land, so
once that landfill is capped, something they can do on there without disturbing
the underneath; the potential to develop that in the future in that manner.
GRAHM SMITH stated the mixed use flex is the same type of development area
or development uses. He presented a slide showing Renner Road and Holliday
Drive to the north. He stated because of its location adjacent to proposed
residential and Lake Quivira residential, with the idea of mixing some small
commercial in there such as a service station, gas station, convenience store –
those types of things mixed in.
GRAHM SMITH stated the big change that is in the primary study area between
Shawnee Mission Parkway, Johnson Drive, Maurer Road, and Ogg Road is the
idea of mixed use destination. He stated really what they are trying to do with the
whole land use plan, but particularly in regards to this land use designation was
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to give an increased level of flexibility for what is appropriate to do on this land.
He stated with the idea of mixed use destination is looking at office uses, retail
uses, high density residential in appropriate areas and they talk about that a little
in the plan. He stated the areas appropriate for residential in this area are really
on the periphery, so along Ogg Road and Maurer Road.
GRAHM SMITH stated they are really looking at the whole area in what they are
calling mixed use destinations, meaning office users, office campus, retail
destinations, recreational destinations – whatever those uses may be that want
to locate in this area and how they go about accommodating those in this space.
GRAHM SMITH stated the thing they did do on the land use map is leave the
primary drainageways in and call those out at parks and recreation to protect
those and build those in as that development amenity. He stated they are trying
to build in the maximum amount of flexibility with regard to land use they can, so
they can look at different styles, types, and uses for development in the future.
Councilmember Straub asked for a timeframe to start.
GRAHM SMITH replied he thinks one of the things they are doing is trying to
address the issue of when they get started and it involves providing that
flexibility. He stated as someone comes in, the thing they talk about in the plan
with this area and the next piece they get into will be describing some of the
character of what the future should look like and how they are trying to identify
those uses suitable for the area, but also allow the future of the area to develop
as it wants to as well.
GRAHM SMITH stated if someone comes in tomorrow and says they want to do
a Quik Trip and they want to locate within Renner and the greenway that is
probably not the best location, given the grand scheme of the entire area. He
stated they are trying to give flexibility to the Council and will get into other things
later with character, design, and implementation. He stated it will give the
Council some flexibility to make those decisions and deem what is appropriate.
Councilmember Straub stated he appreciates that, because that answered his
time question completely.
Councilmember Pflumm asked about the secondary area.
GRAHM SMITH stated they did have some discussions with the person who is
looking to develop the piece. He stated they actually came to the meeting last
week and are supportive for what they are showing for that area, specifically the
area adjacent to Shawnee Mission Parkway.
GRAHM SMITH stated as he said earlier, the next component they really looked
at was trying to define what they called community character and what it should
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be for the area as development occurs. He stated they have talked about a lot of
these things, but in the plan they wanted to try to package them in a way that the
Council as elected officials, developers, the Planning Commission, and City staff
can go to the plan and say if they are looking at a development proposal, these
are the types of things they should be judging it against to make their decisions
as to whether or not it is appropriate.
GRAHM SMITH stated they lumped these community character pieces into three
primary areas; natural features, sustainability, and design. He stated for each of
those areas, they created a policy statement that is in the plan that guides the
decision-making process of what is appropriate and not appropriate. He stated
they also described some of the objectives within that policy that should be met.
GRAHM SMITH stated the Council will see some language in there and some
flexibility built in. He stated what they want to do, specifically with the natural
features of the sustainability measures and design, is provide people an
opportunity to be creative and do things that address these in different ways so
not to be so rigid to tell them they have to do something in a specific manner, but
also give them direction.
GRAHM SMITH stated the policy statement for natural features is developments
that strive to protect and enhance the natural features of the area while providing
natural development, a natural development amenity for the corridor. He asked
how they do that and answered that they looked at development that will protect
natural resources from the encroachment of development. He stated on the
reverse side, they tried to integrate the natural features into development. He
stated in areas that they can expand those natural features where they provide a
connection or amenity to the development – encourage those things.
GRAHM SMITH stated they do this also through innovative site design, trying to
not limit creativity. He stated one of the things the natural features do, is give
somewhat of a cohesive element to organize development around. He stated as
development occurs, that can be a central theme or organizing feature.
GRAHM SMITH stated when they talk about sustainability; there is an
environmental piece and an economic piece. He stated the policy for the overall
sustainability piece will be development should occur in a coordinated manner to
provide a comprehensive development pattern that is both environmentally and
economically sustainable.
GRAHM SMITH stated they broke that out into two different pieces. He stated
environmental development should be a showcase for sustainable design
solutions that ultimately protect, preserve, and enhance both the local as well as
regional resources and environment. He stated the Council already has a policy
on encouraging additional sustainability efforts within their development and this
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plays on that and how they can really make this area more of a showcase for
those types of developments and those types of initiatives.
GRAHM SMITH continued with how they look at innovative design techniques
and resource efficiency; not taking as much out of the ground or using as many
resources to encourage development to happen. He stated tying into the natural
features is a big piece of the environmental sustainability and how they
encourage comprehensive stormwater and flood plain management; protecting
those drainageways that do their jobs now so they can do them later.
GRAHM SMITH continued with protecting sensitive natural resources again – the
woodlands, steep slopes, drainageways and protecting those. He stated there is
low impact high performance infrastructure and looking into those green
infrastructure opportunities that will last a long time and provide good service and
renewable energy strategies – be them wind, solar, or other things and how they
get those incorporated into development to encourage environmental
sustainability.
GRAHM SMITH stated the second piece, and he would say one that probably got
more discussion during the process than the environmental sustainability, was
economic sustainability. He stated really this is about creating long term value
and development, for not only a developer or property owner, but also the
community in the form of the tax base.
GRAHM SMITH stated the policy is that development should strive to build
lasting value in places and promote continued economic growth in the future. He
stated they talk about things such as increasing the residential population so it
can support development through housing choices and increasing the population,
He stated right now, the City has some big bucks out there in pad site retail that
serves a more broad area than just the surrounding, so they need to determine
how to incorporate some of those neighborhood scale uses in there on portions
of the area.
GRAHM SMITH stated they need to determine how to coordinate and integrate
development across the entire site. He stated one that a lot of people do not
think about, but really ties into the longevity aspect, is how they create durable
and adaptable development patterns and buildings so they last a long time and
are reusable, not only at the building level, but at the block level so they set up
an organizing framework that allows development to occur that is sustainable
over time, reusable, and adaptable. He stated this gets to the heart of the mixing
of uses as well, not only vertically but horizontally.
GRAHM SMITH continued with the multi mobile transportation network. He
stated if people can not move throughout the site, not only by automobile, but
probably more important on foot, on wheels, or by hopefully some day transit with
an increase in density in the area, the better for the site because people can
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access more areas. He stated they also encourage minimizing resource input,
so not taking so much out of the ground, not using as much energy, and this gets
back to the environmental piece, but is also a big piece of the economic
sustainability.
GRAHM SMITH stated the final character piece was a design element they
looked at. He stated they came up with seven elements of the design piece. He
stated he will not go through all of them in detail this evening, but would hit on a
few. He stated based on the policy that is development, should be designed to
create individual places that people enjoy and as a comprehensive place that
people recognize and use.
GRAHM SMITH asked how they create that place that people come to time and
time again. He stated if they think about a lot of the places people go to on a
regular basis or they use when they are doing their leisurely shopping, or going
to places they want to go and not necessarily running errands and having to do
things quickly and if they think about those places, they have a lot of things in
common. He stated they think they have identified those here and really what
they have to do with, is the human scale and how they design places for people
and for people to move about.
GRAHM SMITH stated if people can move about by foot and not automobile tires
and not bikes and such the better the place will be and it needs to be at a scale
they are comfortable doing that. He stated all those modes of transportation, not
only the automobile, as it gives people a good framework for access and moving
about – the street network, but how do they encourage pedestrian movement,
bicycle movement, transit movements and service.
GRAHM SMITH stated they are promoting the idea of mixing uses, not only
vertically but horizontally, but how they create those transitions that allow those
different uses to coincide next to one another without harming one another.
Councilmember Straub stated this is a great presentation, but there are a lot of
‘how to’s’. He stated he is not sure if Mr. Smith is asking the Council the
question or if it is hypothetical.
GRAHM SMITH stated he is misspeaking then.
Councilmember Straub stated he is curious about over the last 40 years and how
Overland Park, Olathe, and Lenexa has exploded. He stated Wyandotte County
has exploded over the past five years. He asked why not Shawnee; how do they
bring big developers to Shawnee. He stated this is a great plan, but now is
probably one of the worst times over the past 40 years economically to be having
this plan and he wishes they had it 15 or 20 years ago. He asked how they
motivate and get people to come to Shawnee.
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GRAHM SMITH stated what he should be saying is that in the plan, these things
are defined. He stated the things they should be looking for to make a place
human scale are described in the plan; the mobility aspects of providing multi
mobile opportunities for people are in there.
Councilmember Straub stated the Legends is very mobile, as far as walking is
concerned, in their center.
GRAHM SMITH stated that is a good example of some of the things he has
talked about here. He stated when they get inside the Legends, minus the 40
foot Tyrannosaurus Rex, it is very human scale – basically two story, and people
feel very comfortable moving about in there. He stated the ideas in the plan are
to create those types of spaces.
Councilmember Straub stated Zona Rosa is very nice as well, so he is wondering
how they could get someone to actually look at Shawnee and do something
similar. He stated they have had the property and not necessarily this piece, but
there have been other areas that could have been developed. He stated the
developers have chosen to go to Olathe, Overland Park, or Wyandotte County.
GRAHM SMITH stated the portion he is reviewing now is somewhat of the design
guidance or character guidance of what they should be looking for in
development. He stated he is going to point to Dan on the ‘how’. He stated Dan
will talk more about the ‘how’, when they get to the development policy portion of
the presentation.
GRAHM SMITH stated one thing they did do in the plan, was lay out a
development concept. He stated this is in the plan, but is only one idea. He
stated the likelihood that the area would develop exactly like this is probably not
real good, but there are some pieces in there that they feel are appropriate for
development within this primary study area, again with Shawnee Mission
Parkway, Johnson Drive, Maurer Road, and Ogg Road.
GRAHM SMITH stated what the Council will see incorporated in here, and this is
described in a lot more detail in the plan, are the components within this concept,
but they tried to build on the community character, the land use, and all the
things they have talked about previously to come up with this development
concept – using the natural systems, the mobility ideas, providing some
gateways to announce someone is in Shawnee and on Shawnee Mission
Parkway, Johnson Drive, and I-435.
GRAHM SMITH pointed out the purple areas on the slide and explained those
are the mixed use destination areas. He stated as Dan talked about earlier, they
have identified some larger areas with some internal road networks that could be
an office campus.
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GRAHM SMITH stated they could also look at the area as a whole area, to
attract one large destination if someone was interested in this site. He stated it is
really about the flexibility of the area. He stated they did show some higher
intensity residential on the periphery along Ogg Road and tried to maximize the
highway visibility and access along Johnson Drive and I-435 with smaller lots to
encourage some of that higher intensity development and some neighborhood
development to serve some of the surrounding residential. He pointed out the
existing commercial area on the slide and expansion over to Renner Road –
those are some of the big pieces and the idea that this would develop exactly like
this is probably not likely, but they wanted to give people a picture if they took all
the pieces in the plan and tried to implement it, this is something that could come
about.
GRAHM SMITH turned the mic over to Dan Musser to review the policies.
DAN MUSSER stated he will talk now about next steps and how they begin to
implement this vision. He stated the two examples that have come up are Village
West and Zona Rosa. He stated Village West was 400 acres that was bought by
the Unified Government, so they used their general funds to purchase the
property. He stated they condemned a bunch of property owners and really took
an aggressive stance. He stated they also went to Topeka and adapted some
legislation that is really a super TIF STAR bond legislation for destination use
that gives all the taxes, other than property taxes, with all 7 1/2 %, or whatever,
of sales tax back to the development. That is one end of the spectrum.
DAN MUSSER stated Zona Rosa was built in an area that was one property
owner and one property owner had enough property to build the whole
development so the developer could come in and acquire the property, work with
the city to put whatever incentives and infrastructure were needed, but not have
to spend a lot of time and money putting property together. He stated that
somewhat frames a couple of the issues about what it maybe takes to develop
and why this site has been more difficult to develop.
DAN MUSSER stated one is the question as to where the City of Shawnee wants
to be in intervening in the development process. He stated they are sort of
intervening in the development process by doing this plan and trying to set a
direction and start talking about incentives and things they want in the vision, but
on the other hand, there is a property that has 55-60 different property owners,
so it becomes more difficult to do the cohesive development when they are really
trying to encourage people to work together.
DAN MUSSER stated what they are trying to present to the Council this evening,
in addition to a vision and framework for the future, are some of the mechanisms
they can use to encourage the development, without directly intervening in the
development themselves with the City’s money in a speculative way.
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DAN MUSSER stated he will talk a little about the City’s strategies which start
with a plan, some of the incentives, and tools they should consider and whether
the elected officials and City staff like incentives or not, they are a necessary part
of considering development. He stated they want to encourage the Council to be
stingy with their incentives, except when they are incentivizing the behavior they
want in the development.
DAN MUSSER stated they will only give the incentives and increase incentives to
encourage the kinds of things they want to do within the context of this plan. He
stated next is what they can do to encourage collaboration among the property
owners and whether or not that can be incentivized and again, that started with
some of the meetings they have had with the property owners. He stated not
everyone is on the same page and everyone thinks their property is worth more
than it may or may not be, but there could be and should be a way to encourage
at least chunks of development to occur as part of the project.
DAN MUSSER stated hopefully this plan will give the Council some sort of
framework to make decisions about what the right kind of development is, based
on a plan and how they evaluate them to make decisions.
DAN MUSSER continued with some of the City strategies. He stated starting
with preparing the plan, considering the idea of giving development bonuses,
whether it is density, more square footage, or other things, fiscal incentives,
which they will talk about with TIFs, TDDs, and tax abatements or other types of
things. He stated they will consider revising the zoning. He stated it is a big step
because it starts to affect people’s property values, but what they can do to set a
direction that is different from the current zoning mandates or requirements.
DAN MUSSER continued by stating it includes reducing city fees, coming up with
funding for infrastructure, or building the infrastructure and then getting
reimbursed by the project. He stated these are tools that some communities use.
He stated the big challenge that a private developer will have is assembling the
property, paying probably more for it than what it is really worth to be able to put
it together, and then having to front the infrastructure costs to make the site
developable, especially if they are talking about a big development area.
DAN MUSSER stated those are things that the Council might want to consider
and then there is potentially cost sharing of some of the soft costs. He stated
they will have to determine if the City can pay for perhaps the development of the
public open space.
Councilmember Straub stated he knows there were some people a couple years
ago on the east side that were working to accumulate all the land under some
options and tried to get a TIF approved for it. He stated their idea, at least from
what he understood, was once they had the TIF approved they would then sell
those options to a guy with bigger pockets to actually fulfill those, but the
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impression he had was that the City really did not want to give them a TIF without
a plan.
Councilmember Straub stated big developers come in and buy 500 acres and
develop it all and sell 5,000 acres. He stated they do not want to go through the
process, from what he understands, to spend all that time and money into
something and may not end up getting the TIF, but are willing to pay the extra
dollars for the land if it is already approved. He asked Mr. Musser if that would
help the City. He stated they already passed the TIF on the west side and the
school district shot the City down.
Councilmember Straub stated on the east side with the Shawnee Mission School
District they may not have that same type of problem if the Council approves
them on a TIF. He stated he is not sure if those people are even still considering
that option, but they may be able to get that property approved. He asked if that
makes sense, because he was told that was not what the City wanted to do and
they wanted to make sure who was going to develop it before they gave them a
TIF, because they were not sure who was going to develop it. He stated once
the City approves a TIF, whoever owns the property can sell it the next day.
DAN MUSSER stated one of the bullets he skipped over earlier, was the idea of
a master developer. He stated in his company’s experience, some of the public
sector initiated TIFs, and in some ways Village West was like that, in that it was
really led by the government and they hired consultants or developer consultants,
in the case of Village West, Zimmer, among others, to be the master developer
within the redevelopment plan established by the STAR bonds. He stated the
City of Kansas City has done that in redevelopment areas. He stated the one he
is most familiar with, because they have done a couple of projects in it, is around
the freight house crossroads district where they established a TIF and waited for
the developers to come forward with the individual projects.
DAN MUSSER stated those people had a master financial plan, so they could
figure out how the project fit into the plan and how much of the TIF revenue that
one of 22 projects would get. He stated that is a viable mechanism that helps get
everyone working together. He stated they talk about getting certain things with
redevelopment designation or a development designation with TIF or something
else that helps a developer assemble the property.
DAN MUSSER continued that it does show the development community that the
City is serious about the direction they want to go. He stated it seems to him that
it is probably a more risky strategy to assume that one developer would do the
whole thing and buy everyone out. He stated they really need to have a
mechanism, which they can in a TIF redevelopment area, to have it be done in
chunks and have multiple developers, because there are not a lot of developers
in greater Kansas City who do 5,000 or even 500 acre projects. He stated
Corporate Woods is only 200 acres.
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Councilmember Straub asked how much the east side would be.
DAN MUSSER replied he is not sure off the top of his head, but thinks it is about
800 acres.
Councilmember Straub stated there is only 550 developable acres with the whole
thing. He asked if half would be on the east side.
DAN MUSSER stated it is more than half, around 320 acres.
Councilmember Straub asked how much of that is actually developable.
DAN MUSSER replied it is about the same proportion.
DAN MUSSER stated one end of the spectrum is that they do not do anything.
He stated the next step is they do a plan and the next step is they enact some
policies. He stated on the other end of the spectrum, is buying the property and
trying to bring development to the community. He stated they are certainly not
recommending that, but somewhere in between, depending on where Shawnee
wants to be in engaging as a public sector entity in the development, and he
thinks putting together a TIF plan and some mechanism to get the quality of
development, he thinks one of the concerns before was who is the end
developer, what are they going to do, and how much specifics can they get, and
how much teeth can they have to get the kind of thing they want.
Councilmember Straub stated he believes their Planning Department has the
final say on any plan that comes to them, no matter what, and no one knows who
the end user is going to be, even if they get everything approved and sell it at
that point.
DAN MUSSER stated that is true, but they can have the type of development
they want.
Councilmember Straub stated he believes the Planning Department could
approve or disapprove any type of development that comes before the City.
City Manager Gonzales stated it is ultimately up to the City Council.
Councilmember Straub stated he is talking about zoning and planning. He asked
if those departments somewhat direct things.
City Manager Gonzales replied those departments make recommendations
based on plans.
Councilmember Straub stated all the City staff does a good job.
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DAN MUSSER stated he will talk a little about incentives and they have already
talked about TIFs, but these are things that are controlled by the elected bodies
of a community, so the Council and the City staff can make decisions about
applying these TIF and transportation development district revenue bonds. He
stated one example is the Sprint campus which is actually owned by the City of
Overland Park and built by a form of industrial revenue bonds.
DAN MUSSER stated there are bioscience development districts. He stated
typically bioscience uses are going to develop around a higher education
institution or a healthcare facility, but Olathe did not have K-State five years ago,
so all of a sudden with the Kansas Bioscience Authority and all the things they
can leverage as a bank for developing life sciences uses are something that
maybe perhaps with the local company buyer down the street, some sort of
developer strategy or something; take advantage of the strengths of the City and
the uses and their good citizens.
DAN MUSSER stated with STAR bonds, there is a whole competitive process to
have a destination use. He stated those are high risk, longer term, more
competitive strategies, but this is the kind of site that has an attribute. He stated
they attribute some transportation on access and location in the metropolitan
area for that kind of destination use.
Councilmember Pflumm stated that has a requirement for entertainment.
DAN MUSSER stated that is correct. He stated there are some that are more
restrictive than when the original Village West was done for the types of
purposes in that it has to be a unique destination.
Councilmember Pflumm stated they used STAR bonds for the Wal-Mart out
there.
DAN MUSSER stated he believes they are going to talk about Community
Improvement Districts (CID) tonight which is a new tool in Kansas. He stated
they have seen them on the Missouri side and they are very useful tools for
people who own property to get together and tax themselves to do certain things
and there are some other benefits in Kansas that are in this study; things the
Council is already probably aware of. He stated CIDs are a new mechanism to
get different property owners to work together.
DAN MUSSER stated to summarize from a development perspective, the
behaviors that they think the City should try to incent are lead projects, mixed use
projects, destination businesses, with uses that are complimentary and projects
that have open space and amenities.
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DAN MUSSER stated switching over to talk about the collaboration among
property owners and trying to overcome the issue of multiple property owners
and organized and coherent development, again the plan and policies are
attempting to do that, but encouraging the property owners, and some already
are organizing in an LLC or some other legal mechanism, to bring forward a
bigger and more coherent development. He continued with encouraging
developers to assemble property.
DAN MUSSER stated the City initiated acquisition is kind of at the other end of
the spectrum, but at some point that might be part of a project, particularly one
that might relate to a destination kind of use where they have to compete
regionally and potentially with a development partner in some way. He stated
there is also property acquisition.
DAN MUSSER stated throughout the planning, they talk about sort of what is the
big idea and is there a big idea. He stated the unifying themes are what they
could call a big idea for the theme of the development. He stated they need to
be mixed use. He stated it needs to be mixed use and could be a sustainability
centered development capitalizing on some of the recreational uses to the west –
the idea of an outdoor lifestyle development.
DAN MUSSER stated there is corporate headquarters, because of the visibility
and access from the interstate, as well as the idea of bioscience research and
development and maybe it is all of them, but they were trying to think through
from a visionary standpoint what kind of development they could call this.
DAN MUSSER moved to next steps. He stated this moves to the end of tonight’s
presentation. He stated they are encouraging the Council to consider and adopt
a CID policy, think about after they have accepted this plan to establish some
additional incentive policies for incentives relating to the project, establish some
mixed use design guidelines and ultimately update the comprehensive plan, the
land use plan for this area, to be something different than what it is now.
DAN MUSSER stated one thing the development community needs to
understand is what does the community want and whatever they are entitled to
do as developers, they need to be fair and open with their property owners that
are citizens.
DAN MUSSER stated if this is a direction the City wants to go, there are some
legal mechanisms and regulatory mechanisms they can start to do to move in
that direction; that is their recommendation.
Councilmember Pflumm stated he is very appreciative for what they have done
and they have come a long way.
DAN MUSSER stated they received a lot of good help and input along the way.
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AUGUST 18, 2009
City Manager Gonzales stated it would be good to have a formal
acknowledgement sent to the Council on something like this.
Councilmember Pflumm, seconded by Councilmember Straub, moved to forward
the final study of the I-435 Corridor Land Use Analysis and Market Study
prepared by Gould/Evans/Zimmer to the City Council for approval. The motion
carried 4-0.
2.
PRESENTATION OF A MULTI-HAZARD MITIGATION PLAN.
Chairperson Sandifer stated that the Federal Disaster Mitigation Act of 2000
requires all local governments to assess their risks to natural hazards and
identify actions that can be taken in advance to reduce future losses. Johnson
County has coordinated the development of a County-wide plan. Staff will
present information about the plan. Adoption of a resolution will be required.
Fire Chief Hudson stated he appreciates the opportunity to visit with the
Committee this evening about Johnson County’s new updated version of the
Hazard Mitigation Plan. He stated it is a plan that was put together with the
assistance of all the communities and many agencies in the County.
Fire Chief Hudson stated the purpose of this type of planning is to better protect
their citizens and property in the communities from the effects of hazard events.
He stated also to make their communities eligible for Federal assistance dollars,
should a disaster strike in the County or in their community and helps recoup
some of the dollars spent in mitigating those hazards.
Fire Chief Hudson stated the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA)
defines hazard mitigation as, Any sustained action taken to reduce or
eliminate long term risk to human life and property from a hazard event. He
stated every year there are hundreds of people killed in the United States and
thousands more injured from natural and manmade disasters.
Fire Chief Hudson stated billions of tax dollars are spent mitigating these
disasters and it is quite a burden on the businesses, organizations, and
communities. He stated many are predictable and much of the damage caused
by these disasters can be eliminated with good planning.
Fire Chief Hudson stated the process through which hazards that threaten
communities, such as storms, floods, and others, are in the mitigation planning
are identified. He stated the impacts are determined; mitigation goals are set,
appropriate strategies to lessen those impacts are prioritized and implemented.
He stated that is what they did during this process.
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Fire Chief Hudson stated they are so fortunate in this county to have the Johnson
County Office of Emergency Preparedness and Homeland Security. He stated
this whole process was facilitated by that agency and joining them this evening is
the director of that agency, Nick Crossly. He stated they certainly appreciate
Nick attending the meeting this evening, as well as appreciate all the hard work
that went into this planning process by his staff. He stated it is probably the best,
most efficient, and effective plan they have ever had in their county to address
this type of thing.
Fire Chief Hudson stated Nick and his staff, along with the other communities
involved, prepared this plan and pursuant to the Disaster Mitigation Act of 2000,
the plan follows the methodology outlined in that plan.
Fire Chief Hudson stated Nick and his staff formed a hazard mitigation planning
committee that was comprised of participating jurisdictions and other state and
federal agencies. He stated the committee conducted a risk assessment that
identified and profiled hazards that pose a risk to the County. He stated they
addressed the County’s vulnerability to these hazards and examined the
capabilities in place now that they have to mitigate them.
Fire Chief Hudson stated based on the risk assessment; the committee identified
four major goals, along with objectives for those goals for reducing the risks from
hazards. He stated those goals are to reduce risk to the people and property of
Johnson County from the impacts of natural and manmade hazards, project
critical facilities and other community assets from the impacts of these hazards,
to improve education and awareness to the County about the hazards and risks
of the hazards, and strengthen communication between agencies and with the
public.
Fire Chief Hudson stated they put in place strategies for each community that
was involved in putting this plan together. He stated he is really proud of
Shawnee with regards to this, because he feels when he looks at the strategies
in place in this plan, these are things Shawnee has implemented over the last
many years and already have in place in their planning when they are working
with their developers or assessing the risks in their communities to doing what
they were doing earlier this evening with the corridor study. He stated they have
been creating that vision and have talked about how they are going to protect
that vision and mitigate emergencies that might impact that vision, so he is really
proud of this community, in that they have been on top of this and ahead of the
curve for years.
Fire Chief Hudson stated those strategies include restricting or eliminating
development in existing and future flood plain areas and acquire land, if
necessary, and have done that in this community on a couple of occasions.
Review all enhancements to building codes as they are updated and adopt those
they deem appropriate. Review all future building plans and review the ability to
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add a safe room for citizens and employees in public buildings, libraries, schools,
where they can and look for Federal dollars to assist in doing those things.
Fire Chief Hudson continued it includes identifying habitable buildings in the flood
plain or are subject to flooding. Prioritize those locations and purchase buildings,
as necessary, if funding becomes available that are subject to flooding in the
community and they have done that as well.
Fire Chief Hudson stated they have prioritized locations were flood damage may
occur and design or construct improvements as funding becomes available. He
stated these are simple things the City has already been doing for years.
Fire Chief Hudson stated the City works with Johnson County, its citizens and
businesses to prepare for winter storms and the damage that can impact their
businesses and community through power outages. He stated they have really
done that a lot and thinks over the past two to three years, have really focused
on doing just that – not just for their community, but internally in their own
organization.
Fire Chief Hudson stated they work with other jurisdictions to build infrastructure
for flood warning systems and components. He stated the City has been doing
that for many years. Identify again what is in the flood plain and what is subject
to flooding, prioritize those locations, and complete or install flood proofing
techniques for buildings as funding becomes available, especially if buyout is not
an option.
Fire Chief Hudson stated each year this plan will be reviewed, monitored, and
updated. He stated Shawnee will continue to work with Johnson County and
Nick’s office to stay on top of this plan and keep it drilled down where it needs to
be like today. He stated the plan is really way down below the surface in
preparing to mitigate these emergencies.
Fire Chief Hudson stated they are going to meet annually and also meet, if need
be, after a disaster event to determine what planning they had done needs to be
updated or changed.
Councilmember Straub asked when the last disaster took place in Johnson
County.
Fire Chief Hudson stated he would say since the 1960’s he counted about 18
disasters; actual incidents that have been declared disasters in this County. He
stated those can be something as simple as a snow storm or an ice storm that
impacts the community with power outages. He stated that is a disaster in the
community having thousands of people without power in the dead of winter and
how are they going to mitigate that and what is the plan to take care of these
people and get the power back and the mess cleaned up.
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Councilmember Pflumm stated in today’s day and age, they need to be ready for
other types of disasters that could potentially happen anywhere in the U.S. or
anywhere in the world.
Fire Chief Hudson stated he thinks during this planning process, many of those
types of disasters that include drought, disease and other types of emergencies
were taken into account in this plan and how those are going to get mitigated,
what are their resources in doing that, and what is the impact of the community
and how are they going to marry those up.
Fire Chief Hudson stated they plan on disseminating hazard mitigations, ideas,
and activities to all participants to pursue the implementation of high priority, but
low or no cost recommended actions, maintain vigilant monitoring of multiobjective cost share and other funding opportunities to help the community
implement the plans recommended actions for which no current funding exists.
Also, they plan to monitor and assist in implementation and update the plan.
Fire Chief Hudson stated there are many of these that they plan to do, but the
idea behind it is they are going to monitor this annually, meet and talk about it,
review it, update it, and bring it back before this Governing Body and the public
for their input so they are aware it exists and what is out there.
Councilmember Sawyer, seconded by Councilmember Straub, moved to
recommend the Council adopt the resolution for the Johnson County MultiHazard Mitigation Plan. The motion carried 4-0.
3.
DISCUSS NEW
DISTRICT (CID).
POLICY
STATEMENT,
COMMUNITY
IMPROVEMENT
Chairperson Sandifer stated that the State has recently enacted legislation to
allow Community Improvement Districts (CID). Staff has prepared a draft policy
statement for the establishment of a Community Improvement District (CID).
Finance Director Kidney stated this policy is pretty much in the same format that
the Council has seen in the past with the TIF policies and TDD policies they have
passed over the past couple of years, but there are some things significantly
different about a CID policy.
Finance Director Kidney stated it was recently passed and adopted by the state
legislature as a statue number, but it is a very important policy. He stated the
earlier presentation this evening talked about how Missouri has had a very
similar policy to this which has been successful. He stated some of the
successes in Missouri have been more of the CID policies and not the TIF
policies.
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Finance Director Kidney stated when the state legislature recently adopted it, it
appears it picked the good parts from the Missouri policy.
Councilmember Sawyer asked Finance Director Kidney to elaborate on their
successes.
Finance Director Kidney replied he could not name anything specific at this time.
Councilmember Sawyer asked what if they adopt this policy and then find out it is
not such a great success.
Finance Director Kidney stated he can tell the Committee some of the reasons
why this is a better policy.
Councilmember Sawyer stated Finance Director Kidney made the statement that
Missouri had success with this, so he wants to know about those successes.
Finance Director Kidney replied he can tell Councilmember Sawyer that Missouri
had some problems providing at large or providing their own . . .
Councilmember Sawyer stated Finance Director Kidney did not say ‘problems’,
but ‘successes’.
Finance Director Kidney stated some of the problems Missouri has had in their
policies are providing at large taxes towards projects, but this one does not. He
stated this is one where they think this is a good policy for the City.
Councilmember Sawyer stated he will go back to the statement made earlier by
Finance Director Kidney, in that Missouri has had successes, so where are they.
JANET GARMS, Kutak Rock, stated she does not know all of the successes, but
can cite a few. She stated in the Power and Light District downtown, they have
formed a Community Improvement District (CID) to try to clean up that area. She
stated the CID also allows for security and maintenance. She stated if anyone is
ever down there and see the gentlemen and women on the little scooters with the
black and yellow outfits, those people are paid through the CID. She stated she
believes that kind of tool has been used in St. Louis as well and would be happy
to help Finance Director Kidney find more examples.
Councilmember Sawyer stated that answers his question.
Councilmember Pflumm stated the Power and Light District is a good success.
Finance Director Kidney stated the overall philosophy behind this type of district
is a tax that the property owners within a certain area levies either a sales tax or
a special assessment fee against themselves. He stated the special assessment
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AUGUST 18, 2009
tax would go on the property tax bill or the special sales tax would be levied on
the retail sales within their own stores or the things on the property.
Chairperson Sandifer asked if they would be in charge of levying their own tax
against themselves.
Finance Director Kidney explained they would be in charge of coming up with
what the policy is and what the levels are and the City would then take over from
there. He stated that is a good question, in that they would say they need “X”
amount of dollars per year to do the improvements and those would be certified
through the City to the County and the County would put it on their own tax bills.
Chairperson Sandifer asked if that is only with their approval.
Finance Director Kidney answered yes. He stated they are the ones who are
coming to the City who ask the City to do it and the City would then say yes and
it makes sense.
Finance Director Kidney stated the other ones would be the sales tax, where they
ask for the sales tax to be levied against their own retail sales and that would be
certified to the state when they do their sales tax returns. They would put on
their returns that they are within the sales tax district and the state would collect it
and remit it to the City and the City would turn around and remit it back out,
based on the development agreement.
Councilmember Sawyer asked about sales tax and if the state has some level
they will go to, is it 1% or half a percent higher.
Finance Director Kidney replied the limit is 2%, in increments of either 1/10 th or
one-quarter, however it is up to the Governing Body to set what those limits are
as part of the development agreement.
Finance Director Kidney stated with a special assessment provision, all owners
must agree – a sales tax, 55% of the owners within the area must agree to it.
Councilmember Straub asked if they all have to charge it.
Finance Director Kidney answered yes. He stated there may be businesses
within this district that do not have a retail sales and it would not matter. He
stated that is one of the things he would think the Governing Body would
consider, because even though only 55% approved it, not everyone, yet it does
not impact them because they do not have retail sales.
Finance Director Kidney stated on CID the taxes would continue to the
jurisdiction, property taxes or sales taxes that are currently levied within the
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AUGUST 18, 2009
jurisdiction. He stated the CID tax would only be an additional amount that they
tax themselves that they use for the improvement or operations.
Finance Director Kidney stated in a sales tax, the limit is at 22 years. He stated
on a special assessment he does not believe there is a limit in the statute, but
that would be a policy decision made by the City. He stated if they are bonded
they would be limited to 22 years, but if they are not bonded, it is pay-as-you-go
and might be something the City would want to put into the development
agreement, in that they would renew it or look at every “X” amount of years.
Finance Director Kidney stated each one of these stand on their own, just like
any of the projects they have had in the past. He stated the Governing Body
would look at the merits of each individual and what makes the most sense for
that property owner and what makes the most sense for the City. He stated that
is why the policy is written somewhat vague on some things and will have
maximums in place, but should not spell out exactly, because they will not know
what will be coming out of this.
Councilmember Straub asked if there is anyone in the City at this point who
would be interested in doing this.
Finance Director Kidney answered sure. He stated the same developers who
have talked to the City about a TDD (Transportation Development District) has
also talked to them about a CID. He stated there is one down on Nieman Drive
that is not following through on either one of the policies, just due to the
economy. He stated the potential hotel, the Holiday Inn, has talked to the City
about a TDD to help provide the transportation linkage they would have to do
with that property. He stated their attorney has called him inquiring if the City
would ever consider doing a CID. He stated he does not think there is anything
eminent coming in right now, but knows there are a couple other policies that
have been passed by other cities, but is not sure of the specific cities, so he is
not sure Shawnee would be the first if someone came in, but would be new.
Councilmember Pflumm asked if the hotel was going to start relatively quickly.
JIM MARTIN stated the last thing they heard is that it was going to be breaking
ground in September, but that has been postponed before. He stated in today’s
economy it is a little tough.
Councilmember Pflumm stated that is why he was asking, because it was
supposed to be coming up quick.
Finance Director Kidney stated the City can not levy its own property, so if they
have property within a district area, the statutes prohibit the City levying a special
assessment against themselves.
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City Manager Gonzales stated to be clear on Finance Director Kidney’s graph,
one of the City’s shopping centers is interested in this as well and would actually
tear down the pad site, rebuild some new buildings, so as they do that, the
assessed value of the shopping center will increase. She stated the property
taxes related to all those improvements come to the City. She stated that is not
part of the increment that goes back to them; the only thing that goes back to
them is the special assessment that they have requested the City to approve, but
is over and above any of the core property tax that is generated – the current and
anything due to any of the improvements.
Chairperson Sandifer stated the City is basically then not out anything.
City Manager Gonzales stated that is correct – absolutely.
Councilmember Goode stated 100% of the people in that district have agreed.
City Manager Gonzales stated they would have to in order for it to be submitted.
Chairperson Sandifer stated they are also talking about them having a higher
appraised value afterwards.
City Manager Gonzales stated that is the goal for everyone, in that this is a tool
that would help them increase their value and the City would benefit as would
they.
Councilmember Straub stated to have it occupied would be really nice, another
bonus.
City Manager Gonzales stated this is a center that is still pretty well occupied.
She stated this is a great tool for some of those shopping centers that have not
been able to have a tool that would work for them.
Councilmember Straub stated it does not sound like a down side for the City.
Councilmember Pflumm stated they have been talking about the theaters down
there for years and he brought up in the past that they should use a TIF, even
though it is not perfect, but this might help out.
City Manager Gonzales stated that is correct.
Finance Director Kidney stated this rests solely on the discretion of the
Governing Body within the statutes, but the statutes are very liberal for the use of
these policies. He stated when the developer or owners will come and talk with
the staff, these are things they would talk about and bring forward to the
Governing Body – whether yes or no, these items are present in this
development.
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Finance Director Kidney stated it promotes and supports efforts to develop or
redevelop a commercial site. He stated it stimulates quality, retail development.
He stated it attracts and promotes mixed use urban development. It allows for
construction, infrastructure, including the infrastructure beyond what the City
would require or otherwise build.
Finance Director Kidney stated if a developer comes in and just wants to build an
intersection, but the City talks to them and tells them that intersection another
block down would be really good for the City in order to promote that and get the
traffic flow through would be on example of an item they would bring forward or
talk to the developers about.
Finance Director Kidney stated there are the areas that have been targeted by
the Governing Body for economic develop and impact on other infrastructure
systems. He stated there is also the financial for the rest of the city and any
other governmental unit. He stated with this type of policy, they would hope it
would be fairly low.
Finance Director Kidney stated the one item that they would consider is that they
are able to do a government or general backed bond, or also pledge the security
of the City behind these things. He stated that is an area where staff and
Finance would have a lot of caution before doing that step. He stated when they
talk about a win/win for the City, that is one step where they would have great
caution if the owners ask for it and that could be an item that the Governing Body
could put into this policy, in that the City would not have a full faith in credit
behind any of these projects or any of these bonds, or just something they would
leave open on a case by case scenario, but one item for definite consideration.
Councilmember Straub stated he would want it to be on a case by case basis,
because he would not want to rule it out altogether, because if it is a win/win for
the City, the City has to take some risk if it is a project that would work. He
stated he is a promotion of development.
Finance Director Kidney stated consideration of conformance of local
requirements are also things the Council would want to look at. He stated they
would want to make sure there is compliance with uses in the Comprehensive
Plan, have a high degree of architectural design and site layout and use the
enhanced use of landscaping, the water quality, BMPs, and other sustainable
features are things they would be looking for in any kind of development that
would use this tool.
Finance Director Kidney stated additional considerations of any project they
would be working with include the cost of the proposed improvements, source of
funding, including the amount of equity funding. He stated the City might have
some caution if someone was bringing forward a $50 million project, yet the
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AUGUST 18, 2009
equity they have is very low and their projections may not pan out to $50 million.
He stated those are the kinds of things they would consider. He stated there is
payment risk mitigation mechanisms, so if there is a geo-backed or something
they would want some mitigation in there to make sure the City is not holding
everything.
Finance Director Kidney continued with experience stability of a proposed
developer. He stated they would not want a development that the City is not
comfortable would not be followed through with. He stated there is the nature
and quality of the tenants and hopefully the City would have control on what they
would like to see in the development. He stated they would consider the
economic competition that that business might be in.
Finance Director Kidney stated there is also the impact to current businesses to
consider. He stated there is some concern there if the City gives one group of
owners or a developer this tool, but right across the street the developer has built
their buildings without this tool and the new one is recruiting from the old one and
maybe offering a lower . . . He stated if there is an ice cream place with the same
square footage and move into another ice cream place, that is doing something
to their neighboring developer or business owner.
Finance Director Kidney stated these are simply things the Governing Body
should consider. He stated when they go through the applications; these are
items the staff will be looking forward to bring forward to the City Council for their
consideration.
Finance Director Kidney presented the whole smorgasbord of things someone
can use these funds for which are actually kind of a summary. He stated one big
difference they see in a TIF versus CID is multiple on-site and off-site
improvements. He stated with a TIF everything has to be done within that district
and they can not spend money outside. He stated with a CID they can spend
money outside the district; buildings, structures, facilities, sidewalks, traffic
signals, public improvements, parking garages, streetscapes, landscaping,
shelters, restrooms, fountains, cultural amenities, paintings, mass transit
facilities, lakes, waters – you name it.
Councilmember Straub asked what would be considered outside of the project if
someone is developing a certain area.
Finance Director Kidney stated one example would be a downtown area where
there is no parking, so they draw a district around the downtown, but yet they
want parking so they build a parking garage a block away. He stated it would be
outside that district, yet it would benefit them.
Finance Director Kidney stated this is a true difference of a CID, versus a TIF in
that there can actually be operational expenditures paid for through a CID. He
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AUGUST 18, 2009
stated these things can only happen within the district and include contractual
music, news, childcare, modes of transportation, security personnel, equipment,
facilities for protection of property and person, cleaning and other maintenance
services, promotion of tourism, recreational, cultural activities, support business
activity, economic development, and training programs which is one they have
heard talked about a few times just around some of their discussions and it would
be great if they could offer some kind of incentive for businesses to have some
kind of training program and this is a funding mechanism for that.
Councilmember Pflumm asked if they do not use bonds for up front purposes,
then they have to use them for ongoing operational costs.
Finance Director Kidney replied probably not if it is generally obligated by the
City.
JANET GARMS stated under Federal law, there are some problems to do tax
exempt bonds for operating expenses. She stated probably what this would work
out to be if they wanted to go for that, is the pay-as-you-go, which they can do
under the CID statute without bonding. She stated they would then have to come
in and be reimbursed, so that is probably a policy decision, but an easier way to
track that kind of operating expense.
Finance Director Kidney continued with financing bonds. He stated they have in
the policy a $3 million minimum which was put in place basically for a lot of
marketing reasons. He stated they are not going to be able to issue these type
of special bonds for anything less than $3 million, plus the financing costs
underneath everything is going to be pretty price restrictive.
Finance Director Kidney stated the City would love to have a pay-as-you-go. He
stated bonds are either a special revenue or, if the Council would allow, a geobacked full credit of the City bond. He stated fees that are part of this process is
a $5,000 application fee which is standard with the City’s other policies. He
stated they would ask for a funding agreement to be put into place with a
$20,000 retainer. He stated there is also an annual administrative fee of half a
percent of the money that is remitted back to the City before it is distributed back
out.
Finance Director Kidney stated the application would come in. He stated they
would need a legal description, map, proposed use, current proposed taxes, and
the fee. He stated they would then come before the Council for a funding
agreement. He stated the finance team would have a review and once the
review is complete, they would help them make sure that the petition brought
forward to Council meets everything in the application. He stated the Governing
Body would make the determination, along with the development agreement.
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Finance Director Kidney stated staff recommends the Committee forward this
draft to the City Council with a recommendation to approve the policy statement.
Councilmember Pflumm, seconded by Councilmember Straub, moved to
recommend the Council approve the new policy statement for a Community
Improvement District (CID).
Councilmember Sawyer stated they are talking about bonds backed by the City,
so what will that do to the City’s bond rating.
Finance Director Kidney stated that would be considered as part of the City’s
bond rating.
Councilmember Sawyer stated that would put indebtedness onto the City. He
stated he is really amazed that they are willing to do that with all the other issues
that have been talking about over the last month. He stated he is not willing to
put the City in that kind of shape and is amazed that the two councilmembers
who made the motion and seconded the motion are willing to do that after all the
talk he has heard over the last couple of weeks.
Councilmember Pflumm stated the reason they are probably in this economic
situation is because the City has not had the development that they are required.
He stated they have to maintain a positive economic growth in this city. He
stated this is basically self-taxation for a group or entity or property owner to
apply additional taxes. He stated it gives property owners the opportunity to build
within the City of Shawnee, so that is the reason he made the motion. He stated
it is not what is in the City’s checking account today, but what they need to have
in their checking account and how they get there.
Councilmember Sawyer stated he would clarify one thing, because that all
sounds great. He stated Councilmember Pflumm left out one part. He stated if
they allow the City to bond it and become indebted for it, whoever decides to do it
and it fails, the City is responsible. He stated Councilmember Pflumm can put all
the mumble jumble together about economic times, but that is the same thing as
putting the City in jeopardy.
Councilmember Sawyer stated when the people come to Shawnee to give them
a bond rating, they will look at what they have agreed to do, because that is part
of the indebtedness. He stated it could be the best developer in the world and
they pay their bills or whatever, but it still is going to be part of the City’s
indebtedness until it is paid off.
City Manager Gonzales stated that is correct.
Councilmember Straub stated he understands exactly what Councilmember
Sawyer is saying, but also agrees with Councilmember Pflumm and has
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AUGUST 18, 2009
mentioned it over the past two years, at least, that Shawnee was probably a
couple steps ahead of Olathe 40 years ago, as far as development is concerned,
and over the past 40 years Olathe, Overland Park, and Lenexa has exploded.
He stated Shawnee has always been the safe one. He stated he thinks if they do
have the greatest developer in the world who comes around that always pays his
bills, Jack Waters for example, has done a lot for this City bringing commercial in,
but that is a smaller developer.
Councilmember Straub stated he would like to have 119 th and I-35 with all that
development and wishes that was off I-435 out here in Shawnee. He stated that
started 10 years ago and why it did not come to Shawnee is beyond him. He
asked why they did not get the water park that they just put in Wyandotte County.
City Manager Gonzales replied because Shawnee did not buy the property.
Councilmember Straub stated there are a lot of reasons.
Councilmember Pflumm stated Shawnee did not buy it because they did not do
the commercial development to have the money to buy it.
City Manager Gonzales stated Wyandotte County bought the property for the
Legends. She stated G.O. Bonds backed it and they paid for it out of their city
budget. She stated Shawnee has not ever had the financial ability to do
something like that.
Councilmember Pflumm stated that is because they never made those choices.
Councilmember Sawyer stated it is not without risk.
Councilmember Straub stated he has always said that, but if they do not step up
to the plate and start playing, Olathe will continue to explode. He asked about
Overland Park, because they could have had the Overland Park convention
center here in Shawnee at I-435 and Midland.
Councilmember Sawyer stated he does not know if Olathe and Overland Park
put government backed bonds up.
City Manager Gonzales stated Janet can probably speak to the convention
center – the structuring of that financing in Overland Park and how much of it
was city funded.
JANET GARMS explained that the convention center itself was funded through
the general obligation bonds of the city.
Councilmember Straub asked if that has gone under yet.
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JANET GARMS replied the convention center itself, not the hotel, was funded
with general obligation bonds.
Councilmember Sawyer asked if she is talking about the original one, because
that is the one Councilmember Straub and Councilmember Pflumm is talking
about; Councilmember Pflumm is talking about the first one.
JANET GARMS stated she was not there and could not tell them how it was
funded and was speaking to the new convention center.
Councilmember Sawyer stated his contention is nothing with Councilmember
Straub, but he is amazed that they are in a downturn economy. He stated
Councilmember Straub is the one who keeps telling people and keeps reading
his emails time and time again and that is what he keeps preaching. He stated
for Councilmember Straub to be all for putting the City in debt is beyond him.
Councilmember Straub asked if they put the City in any debt at all tonight by
recommending this or did they approve any government bonds at this point.
Councilmember Sawyer stated the answer is no.
Councilmember Straub stated he did not put the City in any debt then, but said if
they look at the project and look at all the things; the City has the opportunity to
take that risk. He stated Councilmember Sawyer presented it like if it was the
best developer ever in the world who has always paid his bills, would he then be
willing to look at the City and consider that risk. He stated sometimes they have
to take a risk to succeed and thinks that is what Overland Park has been doing
for the past 40 years or more and Olathe as well. He stated he did not vote on
any bonds going in tonight. He stated this may not come up for five or ten years
– they just do not know.
Councilmember Sawyer stated he would remove that part that they would ever
put the City in that position, because they have never done that to his knowledge
before and does not think they are in any shape to do it now. He stated that is
his opinion.
Chairperson Sandifer stated he was under the indication that the Finance
Department is not real comfortable with it either.
Finance Director Kidney replied they have had requests on the TIF district to
have geos and have discouraged them. He stated if that geo portion stayed in
the policy, the Finance Department would definitely discourage against it,
especially right now.
Chairperson Sandifer stated they could take it out and if there was ever a reason
to put it back in, they could.
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AUGUST 18, 2009
Finance Director Kidney stated it is the Council’s policy.
Councilmember Pflumm stated they are going to discourage it anyway. He
stated having it in there just gives them a policy so they do not shut the door on
any other developers walking in here.
Therefore the motion read:
Councilmember Pflumm, seconded by Councilmember Straub, moved to forward
the new policy statement for a Community Improvement District (CID) to the City
Council with no recommendations. The motion tied 2-2.
ADJOURNMENT
Councilmember Straub, seconded by Councilmember Pflumm, moved to adjourn. The
motion carried 4-0, and the meeting adjourned at 9:12 p.m.
Minutes prepared by: Cindy Terrell, Recording Secretary
APPROVED BY:
____________________________________________
Stephen Powell, City Clerk