CSU English Council Agenda
October 10-12, 2012
The Bahia, San Diego
Wednesday Evening, October 10
Meeting Room
7:00-9:00
Composition Coordinators Meeting—Kim Costino (San Bernardino)
Shell
Topic: Acceleration vs. Stretch Courses
Speakers: Nika Hogan, Pasadena City College; Becky Rudd, Citrus
College; Kyra Mello, Yuba College
Topic: Acceleration vs Stretch Courses
The two-year colleges represented here began by starting to look into the
“sustainability gap” (their low retention rates). Of 480 students at
Pasadena City College who might start two levels below freshman comp,
only 48 typically make it through Eng 1A in a typical scenario. This is
not an acceptable rate, so they are working on various pedagogical
interventions. At Yuba, in a similar study starting 4 levels below
freshman comp, 4 students out of 400 made it through freshman
composition. To address this problem, they integrated their reading and
writing courses. Accelerating the curriculum improved retention and
performance in the English courses. At Citrus College, the basic courses
consist of three levels before freshman comp in both reading and writing.
Their solution was “fast track” and learning communities. The students
went from 18 required units to 6. All the solutions presented here resulted
in a “compressed” curriculum, in which the students’ performance and
retention improved.
Thursday Morning, October 11
8:00-8:30
Registration ($60): Margaret Rustick (East Bay) and Kim Flachmann
(Bakersfield)
Continental Breakfast
8:30-8:45
Announcements— Sugie Goen-Salter (San Francisco)
Sugie announced the time of the soiree with the community colleges this
evening and introduced Carolina Cardenas, who is representing the
Chancellor’s office at our meeting.
8:45-10:15
Plenary Panel I: Title "Threshold Concepts in Various Contexts."
This panel explored the idea of threshold concepts from the composition
instructor/TA training perspective as well as the writing center
perspective.
Irene Clark (Northridge) discussed genre theory in relation to
composition and rhetoric and surveyed students’ perceptions of different
composition theories and practice.
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Dawn Janke (SLO) presented the studio approach to tutoring at SLO, in
which the “studio” is set up much like the writing process itself with
different rooms for different writing purposes.
Kathleen Klompien (Channel Islands) focused on designing a group of
tutors to meet the needs of their campus across the curriculum—e.g.,
study groups, work groups, individual tutoring.
10:15-10:30
10:30-12:00
Break
Academic Senate Report: Eileen Klink (Long Beach)
The Senate continues to work on important issues that affect all of us,
especially Early Start and General Education. Eileen will keep us
informed.
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Plenary Panel II: Open Forum
Moderator: Kathryn Rummell (SLO)
Margaret Rustick (East Bay)
Kim Flachmann (Bakersfield)
Sugie Goen-Salter (San Francisco)
The following suggestions came out of a discussion of the future of
English Council:
 Hybrid meetings
 Shorter one-day meetings, alternating North, South, Central
 One big meeting with focused regional meetings
 Current structure
 Alternate Wednesday night focus
 Enhanced advertising for the organization
 Full meeting + chairs’ meeting
 SB 1052/1053
 Changing locations
 Advertising topics in advance
 Outreach to missing campuses
 Surveying members
 Uploaded presentations and then advertised future topics
Outreach taskforce will report to us on these options in spring.
12:00-1:30
Buffet Luncheon
Bahia
Belle
Thursday Afternoon
1:45-315
Breakouts:
Early Start: Sugie Goen-Salter (San Francisco)
Key: ES = Early Start; CO = Chancellor's Office; EC = English Council
DSP = Directed Self-Placement
Marina
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Initial data from 11 campuses:
Most students did what they needed to do on most campuses. Most
students ended up where they would have been without ES (for English
and math).
Scoring: Concerns were expressed about whether students can place into a
higher level course after completing ES. On many campuses this is not an
option. EC intentionally chose a scoring system that didn't enable an ES
instructor to recommend student placement; the instructor can only
indicate if a student competed ES (score of 1) or not (score of 0).
Campuses that do not move students up after ES are receiving some
pressure to do so. Scoring is a confusing process.
At some campuses, students who DSP into a course that is higher than
what the EPT would suggest were counted as having made progress
because of ES, which further confuses the data. ES may completely
undermine DSP, in part because it reifies remediation.
Some discussion from CO indicates that they may pressure campuses to
move to a three-unit ES course. This presents a challenge for financial
aid, which is why the CO initially went with a one-unit ES experience.
The CO has some data from the 11 campuses showing that when given a
choice, students preferred a three-unit as opposed to a one-unit course.
Some speculate it's because students were discouraged by campuses from
taking the one-unit course.
We still need to collect data looking at the success of students who took
ES compared to those who didn't. Yet, without these data, the CO still
seems to be claiming some success. Indeed, some in the CO are claiming
that ES was wildly successful. No one is quite sure how "success" is
defined.
If a student earns a 0 on ES, the campus is not reimbursed for
accommodating that student. SFSU lost $30,000 because of this.
Some campuses, like Long Beach, had a good compliance rate, largely
due to administrative coordination.
The amount of resources that were required for compliance across CSU
campuses was astronomical.
Campuses should report how ES worked for them, especially since the
CO is collecting its own data.
From CO rep, Carolina Cardenas:
24,000 students were designated as needing ES;
18,700 actually participated;
15,500 complied at a designation campus.
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There were two groups of no shows: those who enrolled and never
completed; those who never signed up.
Right now is the best opportunity to make suggestions for change. The
CO is interested in gathering information to "tweak what needs tweaking."
There is a desire with new leadership that "everyone is happy with ES." In
terms of outreach, high school counselors like ES; they like to use
coursework in the summer as an incentive: "If you work hard in high
school, you won't need to do ES."
Cardenas works with high school counselors and reinforces the idea that
remediation needs to begin in summer, not be completed in the summer.
For campuses without remedial English, ES has no value.
English Education, WL:ELD: Mary Warner (San Jose)
Members Present: Barbara Bartholomew, CSUB; Dorothy Clark, CSUN;
Linda Greenberg, Cal State LA; Christine Accomando, HSU; Eileen
Klink, CSULB; Alison Baker, CSU Pomona; Jennifer Fletcher, CSUMB;
Mary Adler, Channel Islands; April Brannon, Fullerton; Mary Warner,
San Jose.
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The implications of SB1079 were discussed:
Subject Matter Prep (SMPP) advisers can't certify subject matter
competence for other universities. Advisers can evaluate transcripts and
grant equivalency as they see fit; the ambiguity of 1079 is deliberate in
order to empower SMPP coordinators.
Other issues surrounding granting equivalency:
 There is no official language that governs the protocols for the SMPP
certification letter.
 Some campuses must have credential analysts sign letter too.
Other Concerns for ENG ED and SMPP Coordinators:
 Enrollment in SMPPs is up at CSUF, SJSU, and seems to be
increasing elsewhere.
 PACTs and TPAs are onerous for students.
 There is concern about when SMPP programs will have to be “revisioned” in light of new standards.
Members agree that the implications of WL:ELD credential could be
damaging and came up with talking points to present to the CTCC
meeting the next day:
 Teachers are socialized/trained into a way of reading and writing that
cannot be reduced down to a course or two.
 If it is true that teachers are not prepared to teach ELD, why not beef
up the CLAD certification?
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Would it be possible to limit the type/level of classes WL:ELD
credential holder have (i.e., up to ninth grade)?
There is concern that the new credential is not rooted in a discipline; it
is more pedagogical than substantive.
The English certification should be the baseline and candidates could
add on to the certification if they’d like.
The CSET for WL:ELD certification is problematic in that there is
more of a grammatical approach to language. Research shows
grammar instruction does not make people better writers (or readers).
WL:ELD credential will create hiring issues in schools.
Principals/dept. chairs won’t be able to distinguish who is most
qualified to teach English.
Reasons for Position on WL:ELD:
 Have to be able to teach English practices/habits of mind/threshold
concepts and a couple courses won't do that: The degree is bigger than
the sum of its parts.
 As envisioned, this new credential actually makes less qualified
WL:ELD credential holders more marketable than English credential
holders to teach English classes; it encourages people who want to
teach English to take fewer English classes in order to earn their
credential.
 The emphasis on linguistics does not address the demands of the ELA
classroom. It is important to note that linguistics is not (only or even
mostly) about grammar; linguists study morphology, history of
language, etc.
 WL:ELD credential holders who teach English and don't get re-hired
because of poor performance after their first year have a "stain" on
their records that could impact their ability to get any teaching job in
the future.
Action Plan:
We've sent a resolution forward in April and a follow-up email in
September. From here, EC taskforce will work with the CCTC in
Sacramento to address this issue.
Graduate Coordinators: Bob Carlisle (Bakersfield)
Present: Bob Carlisle, CSU Bakersfield, Moderator; Faiza Shereen, Cal
Poly Pomona; and Mimi Hotchkiss, CSU Long Beach
Pacific
Bakersfield:
Numbers in MA Program70 - 100 students; currently about 70
1 course release a year for coordinator
Bob’s been Grad Coordinator for 12 years. Program was down to a
handful of students but is now robust because of active recruiting. Since
many of students are “in house,” undergraduate advising plays a large
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role. Bob also sends flyers to high school faculty in the area reminding
them of grad courses available and suited to them. Also, faculty of upperdivision undergraduate courses are encouraged to tell students about the
program.
MA is in English, but students have the chance to take four courses (two
of which are already required of all) to receive, in addition to the degree, a
Certificate in the Teaching of Writing. This has been recognized by local
community colleges as essential training; some won’t hire grads who
don’t have it.
Entrance requirement: BA in English, three prerequisite classes; 3.0
overall GPA; if BA is not in English, list of prerequisites to take.
Basic Program Overview:
11 classes
 3 absolute requirements:
research methodologies
linguistics
literary criticism
 5 literature
 2 rhetoric/composition
 2 additional composition courses secure Certificate in the Teaching of
Writing
 Choice of Thesis or Exam (3 units for either one; most students
encouraged to do exam)
Students take literature courses in designated areas and write their MA
exam in areas they haven’t taken courses. Depending on their course
coverage, students write exam in a minimum of 1/maximum of 3 areas.
Areas: Historical periods in Brit & Am lit, plus Style and Stylistics;
Theory of Composition; Instruction of Composition & Literature; Basic
Writing-or-ESL.
 Students given a reading list for each: For Literary areas, about 5 items
of literature, and 3 criticism.
 Questions are built on the reading list.
 Exams read by two people.
 Students can retake exam.
Surveys Administered by CSUB:
Because it is important to realize the actual needs of the students going
into the program (only a very small percentage of Bakersfield grads go
on to PhD programs, for example), Bob designed surveys to get this
information, which he shared with us. It is highly useful to have actual
data to turn to about students’ plans for the degree when making
curricular decisions.
Bob shared results of three surveys he has recently given to incoming and
exiting MA students and to TAs, which have provided useful feedback,
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including evidence that most students are happy with their educational
experience at CSUB. This is useful information for curriculum
development, and WASC was impressed with them as well.
Survey 1: Given to all students already accepted in the program as they
start. (Survey includes a few who weren’t caught in first semester.)
Survey 2: Exit Survey: “Satisfaction with English Graduate
Program”
Survey 3: TA Program
Bakersfield’s TA program is only composition at the moment. Students
who completed these surveys had already graduated within the last 4 or so
years.
Cal Poly Pomona
Currently about 70 students, though 150 a couple of years ago; concern
over the falling numbers and wondering what is happening on other
campuses.
Entrance Requirements: 3.0 BA in English; if not in English, Overall
GPA 3.0. Below 3.0 conditional acceptance; students must maintain 3.5
or above first semester, meet with grad coordinator.
Pomona offers three Options within the MA, although the degree is MA
in English for all:
 Literature
 Rhetoric/Composition
 TESL
Numbers are about equal in all three areas. Students used to take
coursework in two options, but administrative changes have disallowed
this. The original plan was to have students choose one option and one
set of “guided electives.” Students can do “double literature,” and the
department is moving towards “double TESL,” but there aren’t currently
enough classes to do double Rhetoric/Composition.
There was a theory and research methods course required across the
board; now it is just required for the students in the Literature Option.
The argument was that most of the course work is directed to people
interested in literature.
Assessment:
Faiza once administered a five-question survey asking how the students
responded to the program. The survey asked students what their career
plans were, how they felt the requirements had served them, etc. They are
now preparing for another assessment, focusing on what their plans are:
teaching, PhD, etc.
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Pomona’s MA program is a terminal degree for most of their students.
Thesis is valuable, if someone has something they really want to pursue;
otherwise, encouraged to do comprehensives.
General Question:
What does everyone have in place for helping students get CC jobs?
 Bakersfield’s program enjoys a strong reputation with local CC chairs.
Student population wanting to stay in area, a big plus for hiring
schools.
 Pomona holds an annual grad student symposium at the end of the
academic year for their own students; encourages students to choose a
paper, work with faculty to revise, present; all faculty and students
attend the symposium. Students have this on their resume. There has
also been money from Dean’s office to help students attend regional
conferences. Pomona has also developed a strong reputation with local
CCs.
 Long Beach: reputation as well; workshops for graduates on applying
successfully for CC jobs, featuring former MA students employed in
area.
In addition to these things noted, we also discussed several areas of
mutual interest: how MA exams were scored; the exam vs. thesis question
(everyone favors exams because of the faculty resource issues); recruiting;
reasons for fluctuations in enrollment.
3:15-3:30
3:30-5:00
Break with Refreshments
Disciplinary Breakouts
English Education: Mary Warner (San Jose)
Present: Barbara Bartholomew, CSUB; Dorothy Clark, CSUN; Linda
Greenberg, Cal State LA; Christine Accomando, HSU; Eileen Klink,
CSULB; Alison Baker, CSU Pomona; Jennifer Fletcher, CSUMB; Mary
Adler, Channel Islands; April Brannon, Fullerton; Mary Warner, San
Jose.
Marina
With the few remaining ENG ED directors, we discussed a bit more about
the EO 1077. We also talked about how some programs are facing a
decline in English Ed applicants; others are growing. Additionally we
talked about when we will have to submit new program approval
documents. Because of the funding issues in the state, many districts are
not able to get the textbooks or do the assessment of the new Common
Core State Standards. Until the assessment of the standards has been
done on the 7-12 level, it’s not likely that the CCTC can ask for Subject
Matter Programs to be revised.
Pacific
Composition: Margaret Rustick (East Bay)
Kim F. discussed her Dean’s desire to establish a new “funding model”
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for composition courses. Having more information about all of this can
help us get a clearer picture and be prepared to make arguments. She is
also updating our chart of course caps in composition classes. No
members at the meeting knew the funding formula for any of their
courses. So Kim will follow up on email.
John E. on textbooks – see online textbook writingspaces.org (peer review
model, with instruction)
 Might be a model for CSU.
 Since there are only a few campuses that don’t have/aren’t producing
stretch programs, it might be good for us to build our own materials
that are online and free.
 Not many textbooks fit into a stretch model well. We could benefit
from creating materials and having more choices: tight course,
scaffolded version, more scaffolded version (for 3 quarters). Essays,
curriculum, models, etc. might be good to share to support each other
across campuses. Chris notes that this might help programs who start
out stretching, but might fall back on earlier practices if things are
tricky/don’t have support.
 Possible to get a grant to develop this?
 Sugie notes that three campuses only that won’t be moving to stretch
model: Monterey Bay, San Diego, Dominguez Hills (7 have stretch; 5
are in pilot; 4 are in development – although some are in holding
pattern due to funding and Early Start).
 Don: How do teachers find out from their colleagues about how their
individual choices articulate with outcomes?
 Brenda H. and Brenda G. both discussed that this is mostly tracked
through performance reviews.
 One in-house text (Fresh Voices) that includes student essays selected
by committee (200 submitted; 20 chosen) is well loved; it gets a little
profit.
 Useful for new TAs, new instructors, faculty development.
 Some campuses have been told they can’t require something that you
make a profit from (Pomona).
 Brenda G. said one reason they have some suggested texts is to get
everyone into a shared culture.
What about producing a “Stretch Initiative for CSU” handbook, which
would showcase highlights from each campus’s programs. This could be
a viable alternative to Early Start. Could explain model and background
briefly. What it’s accomplishing for the CSU. It could provide a place to
point people instead of Early Start, a different alternative for the CO.
Would explain model and background briefly, how students get into your
stretch program, how far most CSUs have already traveled along this
path, and what our various outcomes are.
 Information might be searchable by campus.
 We could also offer a view of CSU as a whole (overview, philosophy,
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data, etc.) – a place to show the paths that students are taking (and
how they’re successful). For example, both SFSU and CSUSB have
data showing higher persistence for students who place into stretch
programs (in comparison to students who placed into first-year
composition).
Creating some shared knowledge could help us attract lecturers and
help show how important faculty development is.
Where do we want to start collecting this information?
 We can start with campuses that already have public documents
and have been up and running for a while.
 We could choose a Stretch Task Force to collect data and decide
how to disseminate, data-crunch.
 Margaret can start to electronically collect it; Chris will help; let’s
volunteer Kathleen and maybe Kim C; we will also post to list to
invite others who might be interested; Sugie might be able to help
in April.
We should see who might be willing to fund this project; the task force
should work on this as a potential grant project.
Task force will be on the schedule for April.
Other Issues:
 Sugie: History of stretch at SFSU: a lot of buy-in initially because
faculty built the course together; after a while, the course grows and
changes as people move in new directions; at a certain point, you need
to check the course; they just recently revised learning outcomes,
collected sample assignments from teachers, etc.
 Margaret claims that the three-quarter stretch sequence is the most
cohesive.
 E-folios: Pomona and East Bay intend to go to e-folios or to some
electronic format. SJSU won’t mandate program-wide. Ian – uses
Blackboard, a lot of people use since many multi-modal assignments.
 John: Can you migrate portfolios from Blackboard system to another
system. Probably not.
 Margaret: A2 – E2 Issue (Access and Equity initiative) –Follett wants
every book to be electronic format on iPads, etc.
 Big trend in STEM, at Stanford, etc.
 Margaret went with Fountainhead (smaller press), which caused issues
because bookstore only ordered half of what she needed.
 Kim F.: Did a mandate come from the CO mandating that students
needed to take their GWAR at the campus from which they graduated
to solve past problem of shopping around (Can’t go take an easier test
and then come back; but it’s okay if students transfer from another
place)? Her admin says they might be misreading in holding students
to this. Language in CO document is unclear. They might need to
create guidelines by setting campus policy? Carolina (CO) will check
into it – see EO 665.
 GWAR: East Bay getting pressure to put GWAR in Extended
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University.
GWAR: Fraud at East Bay –Some students take online GWAR classes
for other students.
Everyone agrees we need a GWAR meeting.
Status of the Early Start Bill: Margaret said it passed; they’re just
making small fine-tuning tweaks, but no teeth left in the bill, so it’s
unobjectionable.
Kelly: Is anyone teaching fully online writing classes? Bakersfield,
East Bay, and Northridge.
Shell
Department Chairs: Kathryn Rummell (San Luis Obispo)
We discussed the following issues:
Teaching loads and commensurate research loads at semester campuses;
Movement to semesters;
Course caps;
Lack of hiring despite increase in retirements;
Tenured/tenure track faculty teaching composition;
Decrease in graduate enrollments across the board;
Travel funding availability.
5:30-6:30
Wine and Beer Soiree
Friday Morning, October 12
Reports and Business Meeting
7:30-8:30
Continental Breakfast
8:30-9:45
General Reports: Special Topics; Breakout Sessions
See notes above.
9:45-10:00
Break
10:00-10:30
Report from ECCTYC (Gary Enns, Cerro Coso Community College)
Suite of
President
Shell
The ECCTYC conference this year is in Anaheim, Oct 24-26, 2013.
Sixty-five CCCs have accepted EAP placements.
The CCCs need more information on the EAP conditional status.
They are revising their statement on “compressed” composition classes,
which are on their websites; these statements will be confirmed on Nov.
15, 2012, at NCTE.
They are worried about whether or not they are disenfranchising students
with decisions they are currently making.
They are currently focusing on Veterans’ Programs on their campuses,
which need to be promoted.
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They want to look at the success of developmental classes, along with a
class size and the full-time to part-time faculty ratio.
Inside English is the ECCTYC professional journal that they distributed to
CSUs with TA Programs. It includes organizational reports, literary and
composition articles, and publisher ads.
TYCCA: They are looking at dual enrollment classes and have a followup meeting at NCTE.
10:30-11:00
11:00-11:45
Resolutions and Directives: Vice President
Business Meeting
We discussed the options for the future of English Council, and Sugie told
us we do not have the money to meet two times a year after this year.
The Executive Committee recommended that we do away with the
Wednesday night meeting for comp. The membership supported this
recommendation.
Sugie researched other venues for our spring meeting but found nothing
cheaper than the Doubletree in Burlingame.
Margaret will send out a reminder about the English Council blog.
One of our plenary sessions in the spring will be alternative technology
forums for our meetings.
We discussed topics that would bring more people to the meeting: One
was assessment of literature in an attempt to bring back the literature
faculty.
Business Meeting:
Treasurer’s Report: Margaret Rustick--There is no change in our total
money.
11:45
12:00
Adjournment
Executive Committee Luncheon
Spring English Council Meeting, April 10-12, 2013
Doubletree, Burlingame
Minutes submitted by
Kim Flachmann, CSU, Bakersfield
Secretary, English Council
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