Minutes of SAAF Meeting
Held on Friday 21 March 2014
Glenmore Lodge
Aviemore
Attendees:
Members
Barry Edmondson
Iain Peter
Mike Masino
Nick Cole
Will Manners
Debbie Williams
Colin Matheson
Gavin Howat
George Reid
John Hamilton
Peter Thompson
Abernethy Trust
Outdoor Angus
Outlook Expeditions
Glencoe outdoor Centre
HSE
Skills Active
Observers
Bob Kinnaird
Bob Telfer
Jane Campbell Morrison
Glenmore Lodge
AALS
RYA Scotland (Chair)
In attendance
Megan Griffiths
Derek Grieve
Mike Dales
SportScotland
Scottish Government
Big Pond Scotland
Secretary
Marlia Morris
1
WELCOME AND APOLOGIES
Jane Campbell Morrison gave a warm welcome to all present including Derek Grieve
from the Scottish government and mention Mike Dales who would be attending after
lunch. Jane thanked Glenmore Lodge for providing the venue and secretary for the
meeting. Iain Peter sent a thank you note to Nigel Marshall who was the chair of
SPOE but who has now retired.
2
ADOPTION OF AGENDA
Agenda agreed as circulated.
1
3
MINUTES of PREVIOUS MEETING
The minutes of the previous meeting were agreed.
Matters Arising
SAAF Observer Status, it was agreed that it needs to made clear that observers are
expected to attend meetings and what is expected of them during the meeting.
Derek Grieve agreed that as an observer clarification would help him to meet these
expectations fully. Iain Peter and Bob Telfer agreed with this and Iain agreed to draft
a note for observers.
Jane thanked Derek Grieve for circulating the notes from the last SAAWG meeting
and the position paper to all.
Conference plan, agreed to be discussed later in the agenda.
Two new appointments made. Jim Davis had accepted his position but was unable
to attend the meeting. Keith Ballam has replaced Caroline Warburton has been in
email correspondence with Jane and seemed slightly reluctant. Jane has explained
the need to fill in an application form for SAAF and is yet to hear back.
4
Funding Update for SAAF activities
Still the need for secretarial help as Jane cannot manage these duties alone.
Megan Griffiths explained that SportScotland may have funding for conference but
there is no specific type of funding appropriate to use for SAAF to help in this area.
Megan explained that this is due to funding already being stretched and as there is
not a definitive budget or budget stream it is hard to allocate the money. Megan
explained that ultimately it was Mike Roberts decision as to what proposals go
forward to senior management in SportScotland for consideration.
Iain Peter wants SAAF to submit a formal request to SportScotland through Mike
Roberts for funding so that a formal rejection can be given and SAAF can show
definitively where they are at regarding funding.
Bob Kinnaird added that Glenmore Lodge are happy to continue supporting SAAF as
much as they can. As Glenmore Lodge are also reliant on SportScotland for funding
Bob agrees that submitting a request providing detail of what SAAF want is the best
step forward and Bob will support this within SportScotland. Jane agreed to share
this paperwork with Bob before putting it forward.
Debbie Williams proposed that as a temporary solution the secretarial position be
broken down into separate roles so as a few people can take on responsibility for
these. Iain Peter agreed with Debbie’s idea as a temporary solution and Jane
proposed to discus how they could do this now.
The job of updating and keeping the details on the website up to date was agreed to
be done by George Reid. Debbie offered to fill the role of setting up and arranging
meetings. Bob agreed to talk to Jenny Clarke, Operations manager, to confirm that it
was okay for Glenmore Lodge to continue to be a contact for SAAF correspondence.
A saaf@glenmorelodge.org.uk email with an automatic forward set up was
discussed.
5
Scottish Adventure Activities Working Group
Derek Grieve ran through the background of how the Scottish Government got to
where they are now regarding licensing and gave an update on their position
regarding licensing.
The working group had done some preliminary work to improve and amend the
regulations with the prospect of making them fit for purpose in Scotland. However
they agreed that this group is not the best way to get results. They agreed the sector
2
would gain merit from putting this work in. The ministers involved agreed that the
best group to lead this work would be SAAF.As no transfer of the legislation had
taken place yet and there is still no timeframe for this to happen it would be helpful
for SAAF to draft a document on how they would go about creating new regulations
for this legislation, taking into account the sectors needs and give this back to the
working group.
Derek answered questions about what the impact would be if the transfer did not
take place. Derek agreed the worst case scenario would be that the UK does not
transfer the legislation however he is not anticipating that this is as a case, it is more
an issue of when it is going to happen not if. Gavin Howat added that it was his
understanding that they would not be repealing in England and that there should be
a public statement confirming this next week.
Derek discussed the potential for funding from the Scottish Government for this
work. He explained that the Government doesn’t offer funding that would help the
secretary role but where the group can assist the government there is opportunity for
practical support from the Government. Derek’s budget is stretched for next year but
if SAAF were to form a view on how the Government could help support them with
this work then they could see what they could provide.
Iain Peter thanked Derek for the great opportunity but felt that this could either be
great for SAAF or be a disaster. Currently SAAF does not have the practical ability to
cope with this but it does not reflect the commitment to doing it. It was agreed there
is a need to know clearly from the Scottish Government what exactly is needed and
a timescale for this. Debbie Williams added that it is better to be proactive than have
to react to what someone else has put in place. Jane agreed that this is exactly what
SAAF exists for.
Derek replied that the Scottish Government is looking to SAAF to form a view on
what they think they need to do to carry out this task and provide the Government
with this. He thinks that engaging with the sector to give direction on this would not
be a wasted exercise. It would be SAAF’s responsibility to define the ‘sector’ and to
ensure that all views were included.
Jane agreed SAAF would have to sit down and decide who to involve. This led to the
agreement that SAAF should pull together a small group to look at the work that
would be involved in taking this on. Nick Cole, Mike Masino, Debbie Williams and
Jane Campbell-Morrison volunteered to do this.
6
Referendum issues and their impact on sport
Derek Grieve discussed the practical consequence on Sport if Scotland gains
independence. Derek advised that there is a working group for Scottish Sport that
has been formed to look at these issues. This is an independent group that is
expected to produce a report that covers how Scotland is t become an independent
sporting nation at all levels even if the referendum does not go through. This is
expected to be out early spring/May.
Jane enquired about a timescale for the Youth Sport Strategy and Derek said this
would likely be around July.
Derek left the meeting and after lunch further discussion regarding whether taking on
the work the Government is offering is a good idea for SAAF. George Reid
expressed reservations and wanted to discuss the options SAAF had.
3
There was concern that if SAAF were to turn this work down it would be
contradictory to the stance that they are trying to make that SAAF is here to be
involved and take on work. Nick Cole talked about there being an expectation for
SAAF to take the lead and be productive. It was agreed if the Government are
inviting SAAF to do this work it should be looked at as it would be worse to be seen
to do nothing. Jane reiterated that there was no briefing paper and the expectation
was that SAAF would produce such paper. All agreed that this is a positive as SAAF
can propose exactly what they think they will need and how they want to go about
conducting this work. It was proposed that the working group set up earlier would
create a brief, circulate this, allow for feedback and then submit this to the
Government. This was agreed.
7
AAIAC
The last AAIAC meeting was held Jan 2014. Funding from Skills Active was stopping
in May which is resulting in AAIAC reinvestigating their position. The general
consensus was that AAIAC are wanting to continue to exist but they need to think
about how to move forward and what they are going to do about funding. They chose
to postpone new memberships until they have a clear plan of what they are going to
do. The incident statistics project was moving along but are delayed due to the size
of the project and the uncertainty of AAIAC’s future. The review of the ropes course
guidelines has been delayed but will result in a better piece of info. It was confirmed
that this report would include information regarding zip lines.
The next AAIAC meeting will be in May 2014.
8
‘Make Young People Your Business – Adventure Tourism’ event
‘Make Young People Your Business’ are particularly keen to target businesses that
are difficult to penetrate such as the outdoor industry. 84,000 20-24 year olds are
unemployed. This has dropped from 134,000.
An event for employers was held at Glenmore Lodge on 5th March where Angela
Constance wanted to identify what the barriers are in securing employment in the
outdoors. This was attended by Debbie Williams.
There were a number of short presentations from BASI, Outward Bound and
Springboard Charity. Work experience, certificate of work readiness, modern
apprentices, people taking jobs reflecting their level of education and community job
Scotland were all ideas talked about to increase Youth employment rate.
The aim from this for the outdoor sector would be looking at how to become more
‘first employer’ friendly. To do this employers need to engage.
9
SkillsActive
Peter Thompson presented Skills Active’s UK Outdoors Skills Protocol and UK
Outdoors register. Peter explained the sign up process for the Skills protocol and
asked through the chair whether SAAF would consider signing up to this.
The Outdoors register is a national marketing opportunity for outdoor employers. The
pilot is launching in May. The idea is to generate more participants which mean
increased business resulting in increased employment.
Jane invited all to discuss whether SAAF should register. SAAF might not have a
commitment to many of the bullet points but by signing up may encourage others in
the sector to follow. All agreed SAAF would register and Jane would action this in the
near future.
4
10
Outdoor Learning Opportunities in Gaelic
Jane welcomed Mike Dales of Big Pond Scotland to discuss the development of
Gaelic-medium outdoor learning.
Mike talked about the need to establish a positive view of the Gaelic language by
associating it with fun activities such as canoeing, climbing, skiing etc. as a pose to
just being used at home or for formal events.
Mike talked about:
1. Developing a network of Gaelic speaking instructors through a Gaelic IDS
scheme. This needs to have the same aspects as an English language
training scheme. It would promote a special relationship with Gaelic language
and the landscape. The scheme would provide skills for the wider tourism
industry.
2. Finding some sort of permanent base for activities provided in Gaelic to be
provided from. Would need to ensure a viable business model whether it be a
centre or a course module.
To do this there is a need for a partner, development of an IDS scheme, recruitment,
delivery and on-going work.
This is a long term perspective and plenty of details were exchanged and ideas
offered to assist Mike in accomplishing this.
11
SportScotland Outdoor Group
Bob Kinnaird has found working with SportScotland is an uphill battle as senior
management don’t understand the needs of the outdoor sector therefore
SportScotland initiatives do not reflect the sector needs. There have been partial
success like Megan Griffiths role now existing. Bob added that it was quite possible
that post Commonwealth Games the focus will become the Outdoors and the time to
embed the sector into SportScotlands work cycle will be then.
Megan Griffiths went on to say that within SportScotland there had been much talk
over the past year but no clear direction. Megan is working at keeping outdoor sector
incentives on the agenda.
Iain Peter acknowledged the job Meagan & Bob are doing. He added again the need
to get definitive answers from SportScotland so SAAF can show other parties how
difficult it is for the outdoor sector to get things done.
12
SAAF Working Groups
Mike Masino advised that there were a number of venue options available for
conference. Jane voiced the need for a diary date for this.
The main focus had to be to achieve much greater engagement with the outdoor
sector. Emails had been sent out but response was proving slow.
12
AOB
Licencing Highland Council was mentioned. Everyone agreed that this was a positive
result and showed how effective SAAF could be.
Iain Peter mentioned Glenmore Lodge’s commitment to continuing to provide
secretarial support. Bob Kinnaird confirmed Glenmore Lodge’s support.
13
DATES OF NEXT MEETING
Friday 13th June 2014 at Glenmore Lodge
5