[Session 2, June 28, 2007]
[Begin Tape 4, Side A]
ASTONE:
Okay, Newton Cope owned the Firehouse Restaurant and he and I became
sort of kindred souls. He was just a funny guy and he was always in the
news for marrying rich ladies. At one point in time he was engaged to Lee
Radziwill, who was Jackie Kennedy’s sister. However, the wedding never
occurred. Very quickly, my wife and I are having lunch over at St.
Georges, his restaurant in Napa – now they don’t have it anymore, in fact
it’s Michael Terrelli’s place now, whatever that guy’s name is, anyway,
We were having lunch in the patio and there’s Newton sitting over so he
comes over and says “Hi, good to see you,” and I said, “Didn’t I read
where you recently got married?” And he goes, “No, if you’ve got a
minute let me tell you the story.” So he sat there for about an hour and
told my wife and I this story about how he did not marry Lee Radziwill. It
was because the Kennedys – the morning of the wedding they came in and
presented him with a pre-nup agreement because they didn’t want him to
be just a money-hungry kind of guy.
PRINCE:
So he was – they were actually going to get married.
ASTONE:
The day, that day. So they cancelled the wedding and you know Truman
Capote told this story on Johnny Carson one night. They cancelled the
wedding and went on the honeymoon, which was a month-long trip
around the world, and then he stopped seeing her. That was my friend,
Newton Cope. Okay. Another one was I got a call from Maurice Read,
who wanted to know who was responsible for street signs in Old
Sacramento. I said, probably me since I’m responsible for everything else.
He says, “I want to see how we can name the alley across the street from
the Firehouse, Joe’s Alley. I knew Maurice as someone who was close to
Joe Serna, and a lot of other people. And I says, “Well, okay, is this to
commemorate Joe Serna?” And he goes, “No, no, no. No, it’s
commemorating Joe Gilbert.” I had met Joe Gilbert, and I knew Joe
Gilbert, but one thing I did not know about Joe Gilbert was that Joe
Gilbert was the single person, according to a lot of people who was most
responsible for convincing this car dealer to buy this building in Old
Sacramento and open the first-class eatery. The Firehouse. So it was at a
moment in time when I was able to just submit the work order and out the
sign up there – Joe’s Alley, and this has been at least five years ago and
the sign is still up and I don’t think those that see it have the least bit of
understanding as to know who it’s named after or anything like that. This
is one of those little stories that I will take to my grave.
PRINCE:
So, is it Joe’s Alley or Joe’s Street?
ASTONE:
Joe’s Alley. And it’s on the overhand right next to the – it’s actually part
of the California State Military Museum. Okay, then the last story about
Newton. Newton Cope was a great guy.
PRINCE:
Now, he originally owned the Firehouse Restaurant and sold it to the
person that Joe Gilbert knew?
ASTONE:
No, no, no. No, he sold it to the guy ________ who owns it now. His
brothers ran it, his daughter ran it, but he always owned it and then he sold
it. So, Newton died, what this last year sometime, but six, eight months
before he died he calls me. And, “Ed, this is Newton Cope.” “Oh my
God, what’s going on, how are you?” He goes, “I’m not well, I’m bedridden, I’m dying.” So, you know, right then, I don’t do well, because
what do you talk about? You’ll be okay, naw, you’ll make it, you’re a
fighter.” So he says, “No, I’m thinking of you because I have just signed
the last of the papers divesting myself of the last bit of property that I own
in Old Sacramento, and so for the first time since 1960 I own nothing in
Old Sacramento.” And I said, “And you thought of me?” And he goes,
“Yep. You’re a good guy.” And we went on and lauded each other about
different things, and that was the last time I talked with him and not too
long after that he died. And then I wrote to his daughter and then I called
the mayor’s office and asked if they could adjourn one of the council
meetings in his honor. And I gave them a bunch of stuff to read. And
they did, and his family was really moved by that. Newt was a good guy.
He was a fighter pilot stationed out at McClellan and he was coming in for
a landing, and the tower – I think he was flying some sort of World War II
type fighter – and the tower told him to go around, he told them he didn’t
have enough gas, so they told him to go around, so he went around, and he
crashed-landed on the golf course there at Del Paso Country Club, he
crash landed safely. In those days those planes went slow enough you
could crash-land them on a nice grassy area. And one of the first people
that came over to him was his uncle, and was really mad at him for
screwing up the golf course, and he had a picture in his office at the
Firehouse of him standing next to this airplane – this fighter plane that he
had crash- landed out there at Del Paso.
PRINCE:
So, do you know if those photographs are still in there?
ASTONE:
They’re not in there, I think the family took a lot of the pictures out.
PRINCE:
Was he from Sacramento, Newton Cope?
ASTONE:
Originally? No, no. But he lived here and married – he was working in
the car business, probably a salesman, married J. Jacobs’, who was the
Cadillac dealer, ended up marrying his daughter, became a Buick dealer,
and did very well. A good guy a good guy, a fun guy. Oh my God, there
are a lot of stories I won’t even bore you with, but they were fun times.
PRINCE:
So how do you feel about leaving?
ASTONE:
I feel good. I stayed too long, it time for other people to get involved and
to direct the destinies and take this thing to the next level, and you know,
all those kinds of clichés. I feel very good about what me and my
collegues and those that I could convince to come with us were able to
accomplish. You go down there you see it, it’s real. It’s a fact of life. It’s
got it high points it’s got its low points, and all those kinds of things, so
I’m ready to do some other things. I think I feel well enough to do some
other things, not work, but to enjoy retirement.
PRINCE:
Good. Do you think you’re going to stay in the area?
ASTONE:
Oh yeah, we’ll stay in the greater Sacramento area. We might move up to
one of the retirement communities, but, only because we have a two-story
house, it’s too big, and we want to get out of that. It’s just time to do other
things. We’ve got four kids, and six grandkids, and spend more time with
them and two of them live out that way, actually three of them live out that
way and the other one’s back in Denver. So I feel very positive about
moving on. I think that the documents have to guide the future. And there
are a lot of Documents. I’m putting together now a manual that Jim will
review and edit and it’s kind of like a design manual, and it speaks about
the private buildings, it talks about the public areas. And one of the key
parts of that of the part I’ve authored so far – it says everybody that works
on Old Sacramento needs to read the redevelopment plan – the ordinance
– that initial ordinance, because that still is valid. I didn’t write it so it’s
not from …
PRINCE:
So it’s never been amended?
ASTONE:
It’s been extended. No, never amended.
PRINCE:
So it’s still the original. That goes back to …
ASTONE:
’66. And it’s a fabulous, I mean it states it the way it is. Now, not
everything in the Redevelopment plan and in the master plan was
developed. For example, where the railroad museum is now that showed
on the master plan as a nine-hundred car parking garage. So, there are
those kinds of decisions that were made. But the basic concepts were
there. You can’t be all things to all people but you got to try. You’ve got
to try to be all things to the preservation policies and goals, constraints and
aspirations. But you’ve got to recognize that there is a commercial
element here and unless you’re prepared to buy out those private people
you’ve got to play ball with them. And they have some unique needs and
wants and desires.
PRINCE:
As does the city, the city’s involvement there and the state. So what I find
is really interesting about this district and the whole project is all these
different interests and participants that were and still are part of it, and that
it is successful.
ASTONE:
Well, and we have some pompous and arrogant people – who shall go
nameless – that are hiding behind the mantle of historic preservation -saying oh, that’s not historic preservation. Old Sacramento’s not historic
preservation – that’s contrived. Fine, go back and chastise the people that
wrote the redevelopment plan and wrote the master plan. Not those of us
that have implemented – because we’ve implemented according to that
master plan. I take a little exception to some of those people, and I have
no respect for them and no interest in any aspect of them. Because they
deal in an academic world they deal in an artificial world, they deal in a
planner’s world. Let’s plan, let’s plan, oh my God, let’s re-plan, let’s revisit and let’s plan some more. And you know, planners do not want to
implement for fear they will be judged by the results of that
implementation.
PRINCE:
Now are these the planners or the preservationists, or are they one and the
same?
ASTONE:
One and the same. They’re one and the same.
PRINCE:
So how would they like to see it done? Do they ever discuss that?
ASTONE:
No, no. Well, what they want to see is the private sector out of there so
that it can be a pristine academic exercise.
PRINCE:
So how do you answer the charges, I guess you could say, maybe that’s
too harsh of a word – that it’s not authentic, that it’s not historic
preservation, because it’s been reconstructed.
ASTONE:
No, no. It is historic preservation without a doubt it’s historic preservation,
it’s just one element, or one aspect of historic preservation. It’s not
consistent with their view of pure preservation.
PRINCE:
Right.
ASTONE:
Their approach to pure preservation is unaffordable. The state of
California can’t even afford to do it. Cripes, look at the B.F. Hastings
building that’s owned by the state of California – the organization that has
all the money in the world, all right? It is the most historic building in Old
Sacramento, it is also the one that is suffering the worst decay and the
worst deferred maintenance, without a doubt. Go look at it.
PRINCE:
I have, I’ve seen it.
ASTONE:
It’s horrible! It’s horrible! So if government – if that level of government
cannot or is not able or is not interested in doing the right thing with it,
then let’s get eighty- five percent of the loaf, or ninety percent of the loaf
by introducing private sector activities, and have an Evangeline’s, gift
store, or a Visions of Eden store, and the Tango dance studio in there, and
some of these other things – Fats Restaurants. But you know, at least
we’ve got eighty-five to ninety-five percent of what we want. Instead of
having to be a Hastings building – you’ve got nothing, you’ve got very
little.
PRINCE:
Does the state, do they have any sort of mandate to keep that building up
the way it’s supposed to be or the way …
ASTONE:
sure they do.
PRINCE:
But they don’t …
ASTONE:
They don’t do it. I think one of the evolutionary things I’ve seen about the
state is their preoccupation with the railroad museum and they’re not
doing the 1849 scene, they’re not maintaining the B.F. Hastings building.
They’re criticizing us for different things.
PRINCE:
So all the energies that go from the state for their portion of the property
there goes to the railroad museum.
ASTONE:
Oh, without a doubt. And the expansion of the railroad museum, you
know into the shops. That’s a big deal, that’s a huge deal. Okay? Don’t
they have a few other responsibilities?
PRINCE:
I would think so.
ASTONE:
But besides all of that, I feel good. I feel really good about walking out
the door.
PRINCE:
Good, good.
ASTONE:
I have been one of the luckiest people alive to have been able to make a
living coming to work every morning, working on something that is so
much fun, that is such a crack up to deal with, that there are so many
funny things, that is so enjoyable – not without its frustrations, but that’s
okay. Life is that way, and I have been fortunate, I have been blessed.
PRINCE:
Okay, well thank you so much Ed, it’s been enjoyable talking with you
and I really appreciate …
ASTONE:
Are we done?
PRINCE:
Unless you have something else that you’d like to add.
ASTONE:
No, no, no.
PRINCE:
Well, we’ll be talking to you again, when we have the group together.
We’re going to have you, Jim and Ted all together and I’ll let you know as
soon as that’s set up, okay?
ASTONE:
I will not get a word in edgewise.
PRINCE:
I’m sure you will.
ASTONE:
How is that going to work? How is that going to be structured?
PRINCE:
Don’t worry, we’ll figure it out, okay?
[Laughter]
ASTONE:
All right.
PRINCE:
Thanks a lot.
ASTONE:
Thank you.
PRINCE:
Okay.
[End of Tape 4, Side A]