SALFORD SCHOOLS FORUM
8 July 2015
Meeting commenced: 4.15 pm
Meeting ended: 5.35 pm
PRESENT: School Members
Drew Povey
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Secondary Headteachers
Brian Pearson (Chair)
James Schofield
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Secondary School Governors
Daniel Gauld
Stephen Lawler-Smith
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Primary Headteachers
Judith Elderkin
Stacey Corlett
Andrew Sargeant
Sheila Hamnett
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Primary School Governors
Cheryl Hurst (substitute for Jenny Langley) - Academy Schools
Judith Lawson (substitute for Alison Cookson)
Non-School Members
Debbie Ramsay
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Pupil Referral Units
Diane Ogg
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Non-Teacher Trade Union
Alex Klein
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Faith Communities
Leon Dowd
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14/19 Partnership
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Assistant Director
Strategic Finance Manager
Finance Officer – Schools
Senior Management Support Officer
Officers
Cathy Starbuck
Chris Hesketh
Debbie Fulton
Elizabeth Jones (Clerk)
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1.
APOLOGIES FOR ABSENCE
Apologies for absence were submitted on behalf of Martin Hanbury, James Inman, Alison
Cookson, Rachel Knight, Julie Finlay, Cheryl Fox and Jenny Langley.
2.
MEMBERSHIP OF FORUM / ATTENDANCE INFORMATION
Cathy Starbuck confirmed that it had been agreed that Diane Ogg will continue as the
Non-Trade Union Member for another four years.
Brian Pearson explained that his last meeting as Chair will be the 16th September, the
guidance states ‘The Chair and Deputy Chair shall not be drawn from the same sector or
area of responsibility’.
He directed everyone who is eligible to please think about if they are interested and at the
next meeting a new Chair and Deputy Chair will be elected.
RESOLVED: THAT (1) the membership details are noted
3.
FORUM RESOLUTIONS
An update report was submitted providing details of the resolutions made by the Salford
Schools Forum.
RESOLVED: THAT the report be noted.
4.
RECORD OF PREVIOUS MEETING
RESOLVED: THAT the minutes of the meeting held on 18 March 2015, were approved as
a correct record.
5.
MATTERS ARISING
Debbie Fulton confirmed that in regards to Pupil Place Planning it looks like there will be a
overspend of £40,000; this will depend on the September numbers.
6.
EARLY YEARS PUPIL PREMIUM REPORT
Cathy Starbuck presented this report which provides an update on the Early Years Pupil
Premium (EYPP) and how this will be implemented in Salford from April 2015.
During discussions the following points were raised: The EYPP gives providers of early year’s education extra funding to support
disadvantaged 3 and 4 year olds.
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8 July 2015
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Early years providers will have to use this extra funding to improve the quality of
education for disadvantaged children.
Ofsted Inspections will report on whether providers spend their EYPP funding
effectively.
This has been in operation from April 2015, schools have not yet been paid, we are
waiting for some LAC data then payment should follow.
We need to continue to collate National Insurance data for families, there is a big
drive nationally and we will continue to streamline the process.
RESOLVED: THAT the information provided is noted.
7.
DSG OUTTURN 2014-15 REPORT
Chris Hesketh presented this report which outlined the provisional outturn position on DSG
dedicated schools grant for 2014/15.
It sets out:
 A forecast underspend on NDSB non-delegated schools budget of £5.5m for
2014/15.
 An accumulated surplus DSG balance of £7.2m at 31 March 2015,
predominantly in the high needs and early years blocks.
 Reasons behind the surplus.
 Proposals for carrying forward the surplus in line with School and Early Years
Finance Regulations.
It is recommended that Schools Forum:
 Notes the DSG outturn position for 2014/15.
 Notes the council’s intentions regarding fund surpluses within the high needs
block and de-delegated elements of the schools block.
 Determines that the small over spend in the central services (growth fund)
element of the schools block be met by the growth fund in 2015/16.
 Agrees to the proposals made in section 4.4 for the use of surplus funds in the
early years block.
During discussions the following points were raised: That there was a discrepancy in the report. Table 2 identified a surplus at 31
March 15 of £7.2M, while the narrative at paragraph 4.1 stated the surplus was
£6.6M. Chris apologised for the error and advised that the figure in the table was
correct, but that he would double-check workings to confirm. [17 July 2015:
Chris confirms that the surplus is £7.2M as stated in table 2]
 The report accurately captures the issues.
 Concerns were raised that the funding isn’t getting to the children fast enough.
 Due to a change in procedure this was a blip and it is now being processed
quicker.
 Schools have the opportunity to claim but not all the schools are taking
advantage.
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Concerns were raised that when the budget is being drawn up the funding will
be reduced because we have an under spend.
Concerns were raised in regards to the post 16 process. There is a lot of
bureaucracy surrounding it.
Why are schools not using the SEN tool.
Schools had previously expressed how difficult the tool was to use; this has now
been made more user friendly and we are hoping they will start using it.
The tool has been sent out to all Headteachers with no set deadline on it, but the
sooner you use it the better. The tool can be updated throughout the year if you
experience big changes.
The school budgets are based on the October count but some schools are
growing so the tool kit can be completed at any point.
RESOLVED: THAT (1) the information provided is noted.
THAT (2) forum members approve that the small over spend in the central
services (growth fund) element of the schools block be met by the growth fund in 2015/16.
THAT (3) forum members agree to the proposals made in section 4.4 for the
use of surplus funds in the early years block.
8.
SCHOOL BALANCES AS AT 31ST MARCH
Debbie Fulton presented this report which outlined the position with school balances as at
31 March 2015.
The report shows that:  The number of schools in deficit is 3. Two of these schools have decreased their
deficit in line with their agreed deficit recovery plans. There is 1 new school in
deficit at the year end. This is a temporary situation only. A licensed deficit
agreement is not required for this school as a surplus is forecast in 2015/16. The
continued robust deficit management application and monitoring process has
significantly reduced the number of schools entering into a deficit budget
situation and encouraged those already in deficit to reduce their deficits quicker
than the approved plans.
 Increases in pupil numbers have resulted in the sustained increase in the
primary sector budgets and should, in time, flow through into the secondary
sector.
 The level of surplus balances is increasing. Schools Forum may wish to take a
view on the processes that monitor and manage the level of surplus balances.
 Academy conversions will impact on the overall level of schools balances.
Members of School Forum are asked to consider the current position on school balances
and the actions being taken to assist and challenge schools.
During discussions the following points were raised: This is good news. School balances are increasing and the deficits are
decreasing.
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Judith Elderkin congratulated Harrop Fold on the great steps it had taken in
recovering from a substantial deficit a few years ago
Is there a process to monitor and manage the level of surplus as some of the
schools accumulating big balances have new buildings so this is concerning.
Are the children getting the full benefit of the funding allocated to them if the
school has a big balance.
Can we do anything more to encourage these schools to spend more. The
money is there to teach children not for the school to save up.
There are 2 Primary Schools with an uncommitted balance above 8%, 1 High
School and 1 Special School with an uncommitted balance above 5%.
There are real and sensible reasons why a school may have a big surplus.
There will be future changes to National Insurance contributions; this will have a
massive impact over the next few years on school balances. Schools have to
replace IT equipment that was originally funded by the Local Authority and that
now falls to them.
Schools should have a surplus balance just to account for that level of risk but
we should feel confident that the Local Authority is challenging the schools and
taking appropriate action if necessary.
Chris Hesketh explained that Salford Council do monitor the school balance and seek the
evidence, but school autonomy is important so any issues with the balance will be
discussed with them first. Currently there are no school balances which are felt to be
excessive.
Cathy Starbuck added that there is a Salford ‘Schools Causing Concern’ meeting that
looks at any school concerns and raises it with the school and governors. There is also a
process to invoke claw back if it felt it was needed.
RESOLVED: THAT the information provided is noted.
10.
ANY OTHER BUSINESS
 Shared Parental Leave
Sheila Hamnett explained to the meeting that she had received queries from both her
Headteachers and also fellow Governors about the paper regarding the Shared Parental
Leave document and policy which was sent from the Local Authority to be considered at
Governing Body meetings.
Will Schools Forum be including this in funding that is used to administer Maternity Pay?
Chris Hesketh responded that Schools Forum determined that “staff costs, supply cover”
should be a de-delegated item and in 2015/2016 we will deduct a total of £678k (Primary
£21.97pp, Secondary £36.10pp).
It’s intended for the de-delegated sum to provide for costs of supply cover for maternity
leave. With the introduction of shared parental leave it would be useful to consider whether
Schools Forum wish to change the terms of the scheme, which currently only refer to “old
style” maternity and paternity (see below), and whether we think the de-delegated sum is
sufficient.
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“Qualifying absences under the scheme:
Maternity and Adoption Leave
Maternity and Adoption leave will cover the payments of the teacher or higher level
teaching assistant (TA4) who is on maternity from the date of the maternity leave until their
agreed return from their maternity leave. The school will be required to fund the cost of any
replacement member of staff.
Paternity Leave
Paternity leave will cover the cost of the teacher for the first 5 days of paternity leave at or
around the time of birth. Should a qualifying employee apply for a second week of
paternity, the supply scheme will only reimburse for the paternity rate of pay”
Everyone agreed to go away and take guidance and discuss in more detail at the next
meeting.
 Letter to Secretary of State for Education
Brian Pearson handed out to everyone a letter that he had received that had been sent to
the Secretary of State for Education Nicky Morgan from Lancashire Schools Forum. He
asked if they wanted him to also write to Nicky Morgan to push for ‘Nationally Funding
Formula’
Everyone agreed not to respond.
 EMTAS Services
Daniel Gauld explained that at the request of Primary Headteachers, information regarding
the EMTAS service has recently been shared with Headteachers. The service is
maintained by de-delegated funding from all schools. In October there will be a decision by
Schools Forum to either continue to de-delegate the funding or not.
It was agreed that Cathy Starbuck will send out a short simple survey to get Headteachers
views on how they will vote and the results will be brought back to Schools Forum for
further discussion.
11.
DATE AND TIME OF NEXT MEETING
The next meeting will be held on Wednesday 16th September 2015 in Committee Room 4
at 4.15pm.
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