Breakout Session Synopsis
National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
Supply Breakout
 I-Suite team members present: Mary Ann Szymoniak; Donna Tate; Dave Haston
 The following items were brainstormed by the group prior to the discussion with the
I-Suite members:
 Field for property numbers for accountable property
 The ability to print a way bill
 Current inventory
 Haz- Mat flag
 Categories (same as cache categories)
 Check-in/Check-out report to show items not turned in
 Roles – read only, manage information, reports, input data etc.
 Bar code color coding
 Ability to pull reports by resource item.
 Discussion – Donna asked the group if they wanted technology; did they want to start
small, or would they like to start with a fully developed module (that could be
enhanced or changed as requirements demand over time). The group responded that
they want the technology; they want to have as much as possible when the module is
released and they eventually want the ability to have some sort of interconnectivity
with the ICBS system, ROSS and BUYT information.
 A concern was raised about the durability of the equipment to be able to handle the
work conditions at a cache – need to be able to withstand not only dust/dirt, but also
any kind of inclement weather and rough handling.
 Some sort of PDA technology would be desirable by some, but others were concerned
about the size of a standard PDA being too small. Dave Haston described the type of
equipment that he has researched which would be more rugged than a typical PDA.
 Would like to have the ability to add a bar code in the field (or at the BUYT Unit)
when accountable or sensitive property items are purchased locally. Others suggested
that if this was not possible then the serial number of the item needs to be entered and
tracked to the person it is checked out to.
 Want the ability to sort by a variety of ways: NFES number; Alphabetic; Cache
Categories.
 Need items to have the S-Number assigned by the BUYT in the database – want the
BUYT to either use I-Suite or to have the ability to import their ordering/filling
request data into I-Suite.
 Need to be able to track where an item needs to be returned to ie: cache acceptable
items (items not originally received from the cache, but can be returned to a cache Page 1 of 11
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Breakout Session Synopsis
National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
such as coolers); host unit; BUYT for return to the store, etc..
 Need to track disposable items in and out as well as accountable and durable items.
 Need to have the ability to assign accountable property to a person and possibly
generate an AD-107. (Property transfer form).
 Need to be able to track items to a Division, DP or other location. Would like to have
a block to enter the GPS coordinates of items in the field that could be given to GIS
for plotting on map (SITL and/or DIVS often have this info). Ideally would like to
have this data importable, but a data entry field would be a step in the right direction.
 Suggest looking at the COTS product “Cache Tracker” some units in CA use it – it is
primarily for issues and returns and meets some of the basic requirements.
 Reports:
 Way Bills (for shipping things back)
 Status of available equipment
 Inventory – (currently have to do inventories a couple of times/day. Want to be
able to generate report to know the inventory status at any given time).
 Accountable property status (who it is issued to, where it is located)
 Sensitive property status
 Haz Mat regulations are managed by DOT.
 Comment: “We need to prove we can do this; guarantee there will be money saved
by the utilization of technology by reducing the number of people required at an
incident and improving the amount of loss written off on incidents.”
 Comment: The Coast Guard & Navy have tried to implement bar codes in the field &
it has been difficult due to the inclement nature of the environment the items are
being used it. Possible RFID or something other than typical paper bar code tags
would be a better option.
 Would like to have key words in the NFES catalog – sometimes it is difficult to find
items by the name it is called in the catalog. Would like to eventually have digital
thumbnail photos of all of the catalog items – this would improve the error rate of
ordering the incorrect item.
 Want the ability to have the inventory of the cache van imported into I-Suite.
 Would like to have unit of issue in the bar code.
 Want to have the Demob module show when people do not have anything in Supply
so they don’t have to show up at the Supply unit unnecessarily – this will save time
for everyone. Conversely would like to be able to show exactly what items are
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Breakout Session Synopsis
National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
checked out for vendors and agency employees so that Finance knows not to process
final documents until the resource checks out through Supply. Want the ability to
allow Finance to post any appropriate charges to invoices from the data in the supply
module.
 There was a lot of discussion about the color coding of bar code cards at the incident.
Concern was raised about Union concerns, the ADA standards for utilizing color, as
well as the challenges with having the application and/or Status Check-in recorder
determine what color card should be issued. The general discussion lead to the
suggestion that possibly a code could be incorporated on the card to denote to the
R&D folks the authority of the resource to be able to check out cache items (for
example something like “R” for Restricted, “N” for no authority; “A” for All access –
etc.).
 Would like to have the bar code readers read UPC codes from the items purchased by
the BUYT. Would need to have a reference table for the application to know what
the name of the item referenced by the UPC code was.
 There was a concern expressed about the skill level of some folks employed at the
incident cache - the bar code/scanner equipment and process cannot be too complex.
 There was also a request from a Communications (radio) person to have the ability to
use the inventory check/in check out for Radio cache management – either as a
separate part of I-Suite (I-Comm), or as part of the Supply module specifically
designated for radio tracking.. Contact for this suggestion is Ric Plate, Alaska
Forestry
 Volunteers for providing more information and/or serving as SMEs:
 Tracy Stelman, Stanislaus NF
 Tom Crakes – City of Santa Maria, CA Fire Department
 Mike Crickard – Logistics/Inventory Division Chief, Coast Guard, Elizabeth City,
NC
 The I-Suite team asked that the people in the Supply breakout group share the
isuite_suggestions@dms.nwcg.gov e-mail address for providing additional
suggestions, or to volunteer as SMEs or informational resources.
Supply Unit Leader Breakout
 Incident Replacement for Non-Standard Specialized Equipment or Chainsaws
 Requestor must have signed approval from their immediate supervisor.
 Requestor must then go to COMP to fill out proper forms.
 Requestor must get OPS signed approval.
 Requestor must get FINC signed approval.
 Requestor must leave original item with SUPL when receiving new item.
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Breakout Session Synopsis
National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
These procedures are documented in full in the Interagency Fire Business
Management Handbook.
 Shipping and Storage of Hazardous Materials
 SPUL and RCMD must have CFR49 certification. (recertify every 2 years)
 Interactive online training is available from the DOT website
 Great guide in the National Catalog
 Incident Replacement for Contractor Hose
 Require contractors to have standard NFES hose.
 Replace only with the same type hose, if not standard NFES.
 Pumps - Proper Maintenance & Training
 Standardize all equipment to run on the same fuel mix.
 Require standardized training on operation and maintenance for people running
equipment.
 Bi-Lingual signage on equipment with last service, fuel mix, and cache location.
 Reduce HazMat, maintenance, and oil consumption while increasing reliability
and efficiency by changing to 4 stroke pumps.
 Standardization of Check-Out System
 Bar Coding system for all national cache locations.
 Incident check-out forms to be posted on website for easy access.
 Send any check out forms that are in use to cdsanders@fs.fed.us for posting to the
website.
 Bring suggestions, or send to the I-Suite Workgroup
isuite_suggestions@dms.nwcg.gov, for creating a standard form(s) for next
meeting.
 Shortage of RCMD and ORMD
 Recruit people for RCMD’s and ORMD’s, federal, state, local and private sector.
 Take time on an incident to help your RCMD or ORMD recruit succeed.
 Make the GAC aware of the priority need to get trainee’s out on incidents.
 Long Term Use of Pumps and Sprinkler Kits
 Purchase more pumps for the National Cache system
 Sign-up a local pumps on an EERA
 Solicit pump usage from local vendors or Fire Departments.
 More pre-planning & prioritizing of pump usage with OPS
 More mechanics for a faster turn around time.
 Make sure the IC & LOGS knows pumps are a critical need, to ensure possible
resource trading with other incidents.
 Bi-Lingual Signage at Incidents
 Request that cache create Bi-Lingual warning and caution signs to be included in
the signage kits.
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National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
Request that cache create Bi-Lingual potable and non-potable water signs to be
included in the signage kits.
 Computer for Supply (ISIS)
 Make CTSP aware of the rugged or remote areas associated with the supply
locations.
 Possibility of a PDA or PDR issued to supply.
Ground Support Breakout
 Issues
 Form 296B
 Serco
 Operators, ID, drivers license
 Rental vehicles
 AD issues
 DOT requirements
 Form 296B Comments
 Just another form
 If you can’t fill out a 296A what makes you think you can fill out a 296B
 Most of Ground Support can be covered under 296A
 Refer form 296B to Facilities if they want it
 Can document any damage on shift tickets
 If equipment functions properly is not damaged then mechanics don’t have time
to inspect everything.
 More of a performance issue than anything else
 Form 296B Summary
 Great form - let someone else use it
 Need to use good value judgment on the level of detail of an inspection.
 Not much support from Ground Support
 Use as a tickler sheet for inspections – add to job aid
 Serco Issues Comments
 Can serco mechanic leave region to work on r5 equipment
 Must follow all fs guidelines
 Shift work on fire – is there a clause in serco contract allowing for 12 or 14 hr
shifts when on incident?
 If part needed will go through regular ordering system?
 R5 pays $55/hr
 Can Serco work on all equipment or just r5
 CDF and other agencies will bring their own mechanics to work on equipment
 How many DGR’s will be available and how many Serco inspectors will be
available? Are we to support Serco inspectors
 If sending ST team of equipment to other states send a mechanic.
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National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
 Serco Summary
 Need more written information and clear guidelines so we don’t violate rules.
 Dispatch protocol needs clarification
 Big concern what to do with R5 engines in another state.
 Operators, ID Cards License Government Drivers Comments
 In some forests to drive a FS rig you must attend defensive driving
 OPM says anytime operating Government rig must have Government ID (many
agencies consider state-issued driver’s license sufficient).
 Big liability for agency if accidents or fatalities
 Seems like we are moving backwards a step-state license used should be
sufficient
 Should be same for all qualified AD’s/equipment
 If one agency is ok with policies then should be recognized by all agencies
 Operators, ID Cards License Government Drivers Summary
 If additional regulations continue along with ad pay rates being lowered and
reformed then all the ad’s will be run off and we won’t have a valued resource to
fill needs
 Rental Vehicle /Cost Comments
 Number of vehicles limited average is 35 per team
 Personal vehicles - can they drive to incident in personal vehicles?
 If personal vehicles are used then are they covered if accident occurs
 Total number of vehicles on incident is a concern
 Trend is to give us restrictions not easing up on service required.
 Reinstitute policy that allows POV’s to be contracted.
 Policy changes could increase suppression costs
 If you rent a vehicle on your Government CC then does that vehicle belong to the
Incident and who is responsible for that vehicle?
 Rental Summary
 Endorse recommendations from Incident rental vehicle working group
 Allow flexibility for best value
 Coordinate w/Finance and document decisions made (rental vs. Agency)
 Bin Items
 AD issues need to be looked at seriously
 New DOT regulations need to be brought to the attention of GSUL and others
 We have the questions do you have the answers?
Facilities / Food Unit Leader Breakout
 Training Issues
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Breakout Session Synopsis
National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
Incorporate more contract training into NWCG FDUL and FACL training
courses.
Need to do the certification and recertification program for COTRs and the
refresher for FDUL, FACL. (Has not been offered for two years.) Develop a
cadre of qualified instructors, in each geographic areas, in agreement the
Contracting Officer.
Provide uniform training for inspections by FACL and FDUL.
 Requirements
 LSC, in addition to existing prerequisites, should be required to be an FDUL.
 or FDUL training should be required to be an LSC.
 Clarify requirements for national shower/food COR qualifications, addressing
multi-agency issues.
 Contract Issues
 Ensure that it is known that additional potable water trucks (other than the initial
one with shower unit) are not part of the national contract. It no longer will (or
should be) offered as an optional piece of equipment.
 Resolve lack of readily available technical support for shower and food contracts.
(CO wants a technical support “group” funded with FTE, assigned and available
year round for shower and food contracts “full time position”.)
 Share information about noncompliance of contractors with other contract
administration personnel so that they know what to look out for and know when
problems are resolved. Contractors are required to have past performance
appraisals on hand. Current year.
 How to address changes for national food contract? Currently goes to Alice
Forbes, we suggest that Alice delegate to a technical group / specialist. Or thru
the new Logistics Committee.
 Forms
 Provide a standard inspection form/checklist for FACL and FDUL; send
suggestions to Mary Fields.
 Supplemental form 296B is not needed.
 Use supplemental pre-use (separate) form and final inspection form for payment
or a 3-part (triplicate) form. Send form input to Rich Rusk, national Logistics
committee chair.
 Other Items
 Have Cache System look into changing “hot food cans” to new style with “zip
lids”.
 Invite NWCG representatives to the Logistics Workshop.
Communications Breakout
 Narrowbanding
 NIFC Starter Kits
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Breakout Session Synopsis
National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
Camp-In-A-Box (From a Comm. Stand point).
MIRPS / ROSS
NIFC Update
Firescope Update
 Narrowbanding
 All federal frequncies are narrowband.
 All NIFC Equipment fall within this standard/limitation.
 All LPH radios AND Some older EPH radios need to be surplused .
 All cooperator radios that do not match the narrowband standard need to be
replaced.
 The quantity of radios needed may increase to the point where Ops may be
negatively impacted.
 NIFC put out a Safety Bulletin in JULY 2004
 NIFC Starter Kits
 Suggested to add 2 additional radio kits to the starter systems
 4381 CMD-TAC
 4244 LOGS
 NIFC Update
 Freq coordination
 Need to contact the CDO at Bosie
 Radio caches are still pre-positioned in GACC’s
 When radios go back for rework, radios go back to NIFC.
 Starter system is the only kit available for pre-order, no other pre-orders are
available this year.
 All equipment that is not being used or not needed, needs to be shipped back to
for reassignment.
 Starter systems do not need to be kept whole.
 Satelite phones
 Use the phones if you need them.
 Try to use the sat phones in starter kits to help get a better cost overall for
contract pricing.
 Camp-In-A-Box
 MIRPS & ROSS
 In California, a study was done by FIRESCOPE and it was found that personnel
in ROSS and MIRPS, which is the California equivalent of ROSS, was
signficantly inaccurate which may contribute to the delays and frequent UTF’s
when placing orders for personnel.
 Is this just a California problem???
 FIRESCOPE Update
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National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
Firescope Communications Specialist Group
 Acts as Fire Working Group for the California Statewide Interoperability
Executive Committee (CALSIEC)
 Makes recommendations to FIRESCOPE Task Force
Recommendation for minimum 240 channel VHF conventional radio in every
California fire epartment vehicle
Recommendation that DIVS, STEN, and single resource boss receive 4 hours of
annual basic radio training
Pending recommendation that 800 MHz. radios (non-trunking) be available for
Strike Teams and Overhead that respond into areas that are normally served by
800 MHz. trunked radio systems.
Other issues being worked on…
 Developing a statewide plan by determing channels that could be used for
mutual aid for all-risk incidents in all 58 counties in California
 Investigation of the viability of inter-agency rapid response communications
teams (CAT) for first 72 hours of incidents
 Creating a statewide database of interoperability communications equipment
(mobile communications centers, radio caches, gateway “black boxes”, etc.)
 What is Hazard Pay?
 QUESTIONS
 www.yahoogroups.com - search “CAINCOMM”
 www.firescope.org
 www.nifc.gov
CTSP Breakout
 CTSP Work Group Charter
 Charter concept
 Draft charter
 Training / Task book
 Charter Concept
 Legitimizing the CTSP position
 Ability to make supported recommendations
 Development of standards
 CTSP Roles & Responsibilities
 Draft Charter
 Much interest in the process was expressed
 Section by section review provided good info
 More questions to be answered
 Training / Task Book
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National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
Need to develop a Training Task Group
Standardize the training material
Meeting field expectations
 Presentation by ISO Group
 New IRM management group
 Information Solutions Organization (ISO)
 Desire to develop support tools for Fire and All Risk incidents
 ISO Roles
 Designed to be replaceable
 Operations Section
 Desktop Services
 Server Management
 Network Management
 Radio/Voice
 ISO & Incident Support
 No short term changes to current SOP
 Desire to make ISO IT personnel CTSP qualified
 Develop uniform skill set
 I-Suite / Incident Based Automation Update
 Current status & progress
 ROSS data import
 Overview of updates for 2005
 Sneak peek of 2006 release
 InciWeb
 Standardized incident web presence
 Forest Service developed
 Managed by local agency, but can be delegated to team
 Beta in Region 1, 4, & 5
 Centrally hosted – looking for new home
 Standardized interface for public information
 Based upon ICS 209 info
 Has some redundancy with other projects
 InciWeb Contact Information
 http://www.inciweb.org
 Jon Holden - jholden@fs.fed.us
 Miscellaneous
 Database Tools
 I-Supply
 I-Tools
 I-Eval
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Breakout Session Synopsis
National Logistics Meeting
March 17, 2005
 Open Discussion Topics
 Standard file structure
 CTSP discussion board will be returning to operation
 Using disk imaging software
 Laptop admin privileges
 Questions?
 Contact Information
 www.firefyi.com
 Brian Lamb blamb@blm.gov
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