Hello we live close to the park. An outdoor gym would be great. Basketball would be nice as well. We would love
some off leash time in the morning and evening so we could walk the trail or play fetch with our dog. Ex. Before
10a.m. And after 6 or 7 p.m. A few more trash cans/doggy poo bag stations are needed. One at the bottom of the 2
left trails. People are leaving there trash, beer cans, cigarettes on the grass on a regular basis. I like that you can't rent
picnic spaces as the park thrives with life and that would be formal. The picnic tables now are useless because of
there location. That would be a great basketball spot. Thank you Jenn Vining
*
We have a rather large group of volleyball people in the Treasure Valley but there are not parks that have multiple
sand volleyball courts. I think it would be great if Camelsback could redo there old one and possible put in multiple
courts for all the people that play.
Just an idea….
Jason Weaver
*
I cannot make the meeting so I wanted to send in my suggestion. How about an outdoor recreational and
competitive pool? This is probably a bit much but would be a great addition to the park. More modestly, of the
three possible improvements that are listed I would vote for the "covered picnic shelter."
John
*
I absolutely find this useful and appreciate your communication on this issue...
I apologize for my obvious frustration in my correspondence. I had assumed there was nowhere (other then
dispatch...) to turn on these issues and was obviously mistaken - thanks again!
If you need anything from me just let me know - it is becoming obvious that I owe you one!
Regards,
Eric Holstine
On Jun 23, 2014, at 5:09 PM, "Toby Norton" <TNorton@cityofboise.org> wrote:
Eric,
I alerted the reservation staff to your concerns and they indicated that reservations in Camel’s Back Park are limited
to 50 people at one time with no amplified sound. Because you provided the date and time of the complaint, the
reservation staff has placed a flag in the reservation system so if the same person or group makes another reservation
these past concerns will be displayed. In addition to calling the police on the non-emergency number, feel free to
contact the reservation team at 608-7644 and provide the date and time that a group is being too loud, etc. and they
can flag the reservation. You can also reach the on-call special services staff who will make a site visit at 631-1459
or 631-1461.
We will be working with ACHD on what improvements may be incorporated into the crossings at the park as part
of their project to improve Heron Street. This should also help with parking.
I hope you find this information useful.
Toby
From: Eric Holstine
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2014 6:07 PM
To: Toby Norton
Cc: Thomas Governale; Chloe Ross; MayorBieter
Subject: RE: tennis courts
FYI – dispatch stopped by…didn’t anything about the music/PA system (they were told it would be “winding
down”…) and told me I was just luck that I don’t live by Hyde Park…
I brought up the possible idea of basketball courts and the office could be believe this was even being
considered…in his words “I guess they don’t spend much time down here…”.
Regards,
Eric Holstine
From: Eric Holstine
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2014 5:35 PM
To: 'Toby Norton'
Cc: Thomas Governale; Chloe Ross; mayor@cityofboise.org
Subject: RE: tennis courts
Toby –
Thank you for the detailed reply.
·
I write this as 200 + people play loud music and party at the picnic area. I am able to close the windows
for the sound system but finally called police dispatch when the drumming started. I always wonder when
folks show up with a sound system if they get any warning about music when they reserve the area…??
·
Yes – I absolutely agree calling in complaints is the way to police this area…it is the only thing that
keeps it livable when you live this close…
·
Attached are some pics of the no cross walk on Heron/13th – I realize this is ACHD but someone really
needs to look at safety for this park…I also included a pic of Heron/12 th– you walk out blind and have to
navigate around a car…into the parking lot…
·
Oh & a pic of the party just for fun…
Your professional responses give me faith in the system…but my message is that while new courts are sexy (ok –
not sexy but I could not think of anything other way to describe…) but in my opinion some money needs to be put
into the infrastructure of the park – it is a gem of the community and a money maker when it comes to the street
fair…
Again – I appreciate the opportunity to provide input other than to the police…as I piss of 200 + folks…
Regards,
Eric Holstine
From: Toby Norton [mailto:TNorton@cityofboise.org]
Sent: Monday, June 16, 2014 5:30 PM
To: Eric Holstine
Cc: Thomas Governale; Chloe Ross
Subject: RE: tennis courts
Eric,
Thank you for your comments on Camel’s Back Park. These will be added to the other comments received for the
public meeting. I can add your email to the list and disseminate follow up information from the public
meeting. Information will also be located on the park web page: http://parks.cityofboise.org/parkslocations/parks/camels-back-park/
I am working on getting available information on calls or citations at Camel’s Back since the volleyball court was
installed in 2008. We do consult with the Police Department on some park designs. We do not typically consult
them when adding amenities to parks, however, we can consult with them on the addition of these amenities to vet
these concerns.
You took the right course of action by calling the Police for your concerns of loud music. It is our experience that
enforcement will help discourage these actions.
Don’t hesitate to contact me if you have further questions or concerns.
Thank you,
Toby
From: Eric Holstine
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 6:10 PM
To: Toby Norton
Cc: MayorBieter; BPDGeneralContact
Subject: RE: tennis courts
Toby –
They say timing is everything…I just called in another noise complaint to Boise City dispatch – volley ball court –
folks park/crank music/party.
I have a couple of more questions –
·
·
Is the Boise City Police involved in the decisions about future park plans?
Is there any data on how many calls have been placed to dispatch or citations with the addition of the
volley ball court?
Thanks again for providing this venue for discourse.
Regards,
Eric Holstine
From: Eric Holstine
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 3:11 PM
To: 'tnorton@cityofboise.org'
Cc: 'mayor@cityofboise.org'
Subject: tennis courts
Toby –
This is in regard to the Camel’s Back Park Master Planning Meeting.
My wife and I will we will be out of town for the meeting. Below is what we feel needs to be addressed before any
improvements are considered.
It is my opinion that no additional activities should be added to the park - Until some safety and overcrowding
concerns are addressed Feedback ·
Sidewalks - sidewalks need to be installed along Heron side of the park. People crossing the street have to
weave thru cars and are hard to see as they cross. The park also needs a way for people to enter the park
without having to walk thru the parking from the Heron side of the park.
·
Parking - the park does not have adequate parking for current level of use. In fact the recent addition of
the volleyball court has made the parking situation much worse than it was before it was installed – with
people illegally next to the court with no enforcement from police to keep them from illegally parking.
·
Current Picnic Area - the congested parking makes it dangerous as people speed thru our alley - this
happens often in the summer especially as folks who use the current picnic areas look for close parking
from drop off food/bbqs.
·
Crosswalks –
o Crosswalk at 12th is dangerous!
o A Crosswalk at 13th needs to be installed – the fact that it is not there is crazy!
o A crosswalk desperately needs to be installed for crossing the parking lot entrance.
o Crosswalks need to be installed at all the Heron streets and they need to be higher visibility then
paint and sidewalks…they need blinking lights on the street or some way of dealing with the
congestion and limited visibility cause of congested parking and lack of sidewalks on the Heron
side of the street.
·
Use after dark – additional enforcement presence is necessary. I have called the police 3 times this
spring and one officer said they have seen increased calls to the park when compared to previous years.
·
Dog off leash/waste – when the park officers were eliminated a noticeable increase in off leash dogs
have been observed and dog poop. I would like to see this program brought back.
·
Restroom – these are disgusting and should be addressed as a possibly place to improve visitors park
experience.
·
Tennis – back boards – several neighbors have said these could be installed to help with neighborhood
kids who use the courts for practice.
Thank you for the post card and I really appreciate the opportunity to provide this feedback.
Any chance I could get the minutes from the meeting?
Regards,
Eric Holstine
*
I read the article about potential improvements to Camels Back and while that sounds interesting I was wondering
about the Boise Hills Park that is framed by Crestline and Claremont. Camels Back Park is a great park and mature
in it's offering today. It is logical to me to complete and unfinished park in the same area before working on adding
new amentities to an existing park. is there a priority and special arrangement on the Boise Hills park?
Thanks!
Jason Carney
PS, I live above the Boise Hills Park and would love to see it become more broadly used.
*
We got the yellow postcard. Thank you for the opportunity to comment.
The park is fine, just as it is. It is busy all the time, with all sorts of users. It does not need a gym; it does not need a
shelter; it most surely does not need a basketball court, with all the noise that comes with it,
You have a busy park, much-loved and regularly used. We suggest you maintain it, keep it in good repair, manage it
for the many good uses now in play. If you have some extra money, build a park in some part of town that needs
one.
Regards,
Steve Rinehart
Sharon Lidz
*
I am unable to make the June 25th Camel's Back Park Master Plan Meeting. I wanted to let you know that I do not
think adding a basketball court is a good idea. Boise is warming up rapidly year after year. We should not pave
any more green space and make the ground even hotter. An outdoor gym does seem like a good idea however.
Thanks,
Michael Adams
*
Please keep as much open space grass area as possible in Camel's Back Park. Camel's Back is a wonderful park, but
it is small. It gets lots of use (it is probably overused as it is), and I am concerned about adding more amenities. I am
a big basketball player myself, and relied on free open courts when I was young. I advocate putting them in parks
that have the space for them.
As a nearly 20-year resident of Boise, I have many fond memories of Camel's Back Park. Perhaps my fondest is of
throwing the ball and the frisbee for my dog Belle. I know it's "illegal" to do, but I was always very respectful of
others and made sure not to get in their way. Never once did an officer approach me.
I also remember just laying in the grass looking up at the hill, talking with friends.
More than anything, I advocate as many off-leash areas for dogs as possible. Dog users get tons of use out of parks.
Thanks,
Don May
*
Hi. I won’t be able to attend the meeting on proposed amenities for Camels Back park. I would like to submit my
opinion that an outdoor basketball court would be a fantastic addition to the park.
Thanks for your time.
Timothy R. Gammill, CR
*
Hi, how about putting in some courts of the fasting growing SPORT in the USA , PICKLEBALL. This is a sport for
all ages 8 to 80 and older. You can go to the web and put in usapa and check it out. Boise area pickleball
association has a web site you can check it out. I think B.A.P.A. has over 100 members in the club. One tennis
court 60x 120 will make 4 pickleball courts. If you have any question please give me a call. Thanks, Rodell Hill
*
Thank you for the interest in improving Camel's Back. We would support adding a basketball court and an outdoor
gym. That would be wonderful!
Thank you,
Lori
*
I will be unable to attend the June 25th meeting to discuss the Camel's Back Park Master Plan. As a neighbor and
frequent user of the park, however, I would like to express my support for enhanced maintenance of the trails to
prevent further erosion.
The possible improvements identified to include a covered picnic shelter and a basketball court merit further
consideration. Still, careful planning should ensure that the open space is not unduly compromised. It appears that
it is this aspect of the park, along with the trails, most enjoyed by users.
The possibility of an outdoor gym was also suggested to which I have strong reservations. I fear it would detract
from the open space, equipment would not be well maintained or cleaned, and over time not used. There are many
affordable options for indoor gyms that people make use of and exercising outdoors is an alternative.
Thank you for your efforts and any consideration given to the above.
Sincerely,
Suzanne Troje
*
I'm emailing regarding impovements at Camel's Back. I love Camel's Back & use it and lower Hull's Gultch trails to
walk my dog at least 2-3 times a week, year round. Lately, I've started taking a large canvas bag with me on Sunday
mornings, just to take some of the many, many, water bottles/ aluminum cans & other recyleables that are discarded
into the regular trash cans around the playground, so I can recyle them from my home.
Camel's Back is a major party/picnic/ bicycling/hiking spot and it is just wrong that much of the aftermath of these
activities goes into the trash & landfill, when so much of this stuff, with a small effort, is recyclable. I'm an optimist,
but I believe if there were 1-2 large green recycling dumpsters close to the picnic area, tennis court or play ground,
most people would use them. If it's a cost issue, even just having recycle dumpster(s) available from April through
October would address most of this problem.
Also, this could a be considered part of a broader effort to educate the public about the importance of recycling, to
make Boise "greener" & as a model for children, youth & othes not familiar with the practice. It would give
recycling more public visiblity.
This is probably not the type of improvement suggestion you are receiving from others, but to me, it is so very
important. It doesn't seem like it would be that costly and I would consider it a major, innovative improvement to
Camel's Back.
I will try to attend the the meeting at NJH on the 25th.
Thank you for considerng this idea.
Chris Rudeen
*
Per our discussion, please add the following street improvements to the comments for CB Park.
Thanks,
Scott
---------- Forwarded message ---------From: scott beecham
Date: Tuesday, May 20, 2014
Subject: neighborhood/street enhancement
Hi Don and Matt,
I am a neighbor concerned with access and pedestrian/biker safety along Heron in front of Camel's Back
(specifically at the trail connection points). Parking is obviously limited in the lot and, as cars spill over on to Heron,
visibility is reduced by the on street parking.
Has NENA looked at options for street improvements to help formalize on street parking and establish safer access
points? It looks like a great opportunity for "bulb-outs" at the north terminus of 10th and 11th streets (see attached).
Is there any grant money/city money/ACHD money available for this sort of improvement? I am happy to help get
the conversation going with the City and ACHD if that is helpful.
Matt - Perhaps you have already looked into this; can you provide any insight?
Thanks for your consideration.
Scott
*
I live on 16th and Heron and got a post card in the mail about proposed changes to Camel's back park. I can't attend
the meeting next week so I wanted to share my comments with you.
1) I don't see the need to add basketball courts. There are already courts at North Jr High and Elm Grove Park that I
don't see being used very much. The one thing that is used a ton at CB Park is the open space, so I don't think it
would be a good idea to take away any of that.
2) A covered picnic shelter is a good idea, as is the outdoor gym. Although I'm curious what an outdoor gym is.
3) What the park needs more than anything is a sun shade over the playground area, especially since the equipment
is dark colors and gets very hot in the sun. In fact, two years ago my 2 years old daughter simply leaned against the
slide and got blisters from the burns she received, and the temps was below 80 that day!
Thanks
Richard Wensel
*
I would like to share my opinion re: improvements to Camel's Back Park.
- I feel the open space, especially the grass areas are what make the park special, would hate to see his taken away
- I also feel a shade canopy or a few would be beneficial to all of the families that play on the playground. Our 2
year old suffered significant deep 2nd degree burns on her forearms and belly from hugging the bottom of a slide at
Camel's Back Park that was in full sun in 86 degree weather. The burns required medical attention. The shade
protection would also be beneficial to decrease sun exposure that could lead to skin cancer. I feel this would be
money and time well spent.
Thank you for your time Becky Wensel
*
Good luck and have fun with this icon of Boise!
Suggestion: bocce ball court!
Heaps of fun, (participants bring their own balls), and it's a perfect fit for North Enders.
Caren Sage
*
I may be too late to add a comment about Camels back park as I have been away from the city the last few weeks. If
not, my suggestion would be to set up a few bocce ball courts. A simple game anyone can play that is gaining in
popularity in the east and Midwest. Just a suggestion, good luck with the plan.
Tom Donnelly
Aerial
*
If we were not able to make your meeting on Wednesday, where can we go to find out more information about the
proposed changes to Camels Back Park?
Thank you,
Don Plum
President
North End Neighborhood Association
*
Thank you Tony, for hosting last night's meeting regarding potential "improvements" to Camel's Back Park. I think
the park works well with its current activities. I do not support a covering for the picnic area, a basketball court, or
an outdoor gym. It is truly incredible how well used the park is and it is a blessing to live less than a block away,
even though during special events, evenings and weekends, parking in my neighborhood is at a premium. Please
keep what open space is left for all our games of tag, frisbee throwing, soccer practices, boot camps, etc. and for just
stretching out on a blanket to do a bit of cloud gazing.
I know it is not your domain, but I do think it would be a good idea for ACHD to install a "calming" area at the
intersection of 13th and Heron, (similar to the ones in Hyde Park), to help slow traffic and make access to the park
safer.
Sincerely,
Mary Vinson
*
I am part of a small group at Hyde Park Mennonite Fellowship exploring the effects of climate change and what can
be done about it. We have a couple of suggestions which we hope you will consider as you plan for projects in
Camels Back Park.
We would like you to consider placing a level two electric car charging station in Camels Back Park.
We also would like you to consider installing photo volteic solar panels in Camels Back Park to power the charging
station. These could potentially be placed on the roof of a picnic shelter, over the tennis courts, or other sites.
Camels Back Park receives a lot of direct sunlight throughout the year.
We believe that Camels Back Park is an excellent site for such a charging station and realize that there would be a
cost to such a project.
We suggest that Boise City approach other entities and invite them to partner with the city on such a project. Idaho
Power, the North End Neighborhood Association, the Hyde Park Merchants Association come immediately to
mind. We imagine there are others who would be interested.
Thank you for the opportunity to comment on the future of Camels Back Park--it is indeed a fabulous resource!
Anne Hausrath
PS We would be delighted to discuss this proposal with you
-Anne Stites Hausrath
*
thank you again for conducting the meeting last night. it was good to see that there was a decent turnout and that
people wanted to be involved. following are our comments and requests related to the proposed update to the park
master plan:



we are opposed to a covered shelter at the park. many organizations and groups that use the site come with
their own pop-up covers so the need for the city to provide such a structure is unnecessary. given the
current level of after hours and homeless use at the park, a covered structure would only encourage this
inappropriate activity;
we are opposed to a basketball court at the park. the two proposed locations would definitely interfere with
the open space that is now used for many group activities. additionally, there are numerous basketball
courts at the elementary and middle schools in the north end. again, this facility would enourage afterhours use of the park especially if it is located so that car lights could be used for lighting (in both of the
proposed locations displayed at the neighborhood meeting this could be the case);
we are opposed to an outdoor gym. the neighbors surrounding the park are not requesting this
facility. although it is a neighborhood park the request for this type of facility seems to be coming from
people/businesses outside of the neighborhood.
i believe you heard loud and clear that the green space and trees are essential to the park. maintaining this is should
remain a priority. keep in mind that when we try to be everything for everyone we fail.
the opportunity for a recognizable entrance to the park was also discussed. we would request that any such
development be fully coordinated with ACHD so that the current traffic congestion/speed would be addressed at the
same time. although the traffic speed adjacent to the park is 20 mph, a large number of vehicles are driving well in
excess. a quick look at the traffic tickets written by the boise pd will show they have no problem handing out a lot
of paper in a short period of time.
although the city views this park as a neighborhood park it really is a regional park. the fact that the parking lot is
full on all weekends and during most days reflects this. if it was indeed a neighborhood park the parking lots would
be empty as the residents would largely be walking or riding bikes to get there. the fact that this park serves as a
trailhead for the ridge to rivers trail system also supports the fact that this is a regional park.
on a separate note, as homeowners we did not receive written notice of the meeting and only heard about it from
neighbors.
sincerely,
alan & kim pinkerton
*
I was unable to attend the meeting last night. Are there meeting minutes available?
Thanks,
John Tansey
*
Good afternoon. I am unable to make this evening's meeting at North Junior High, therefore I am providing written
comments on the park improvements proposal. I am in support of a covered picnic area and an outdoor gym.
However, I am not in support of constructing a basketball court at Camel's Back park. There are two elementary
schools and one Junior High located within the neighborhood and within close proximity to the park; that I see no
need to construct an additional basketball court in the neighborhood.
I would also ask that the City of Boise be mindful of the existing use of the grassy area for various school and
community activities (i.e. soccer). The location of the covered picnic area and the outdoor gym should not impede
on the existing use of the grassy area. The proposed picnic area should be constructed between the existing picnic
area and the playground. The outdoor gym should be constructed immediately east of the tennis courts or on the
northwestern corner of the park.
It would have been helpful if you could have posted map that clearly identified the proposed improvement locations.
Thank you,
Ester Ceja
Boise, Idaho
*
My Husband and I may be unable to attend the meeting. Below is what we feel should be addressed regarding the
changes to Camels Back park. It is in my opinion that NO additional activities or changes should be made to the
park.
1. There is currently not enough parking for the day to day activities that happen at the park additional structures or
recreation will only add to the problem. Making a bigger parking area will not solve the problem.
2. The volleyball area has brought too much noise, traffic and police calls. Basketball will only add to this issue
3. The park is being "loved" to death by the people climbing the hill and the erosion is visible.
4. Sidewalks and crosswalks need to be addressed first. The park is dangerous. Kids need to exit the park by
darting between cars parked at 11th and Heron to get to the crosswalk. There needs to be a crosswalk on 13th and
Heron.
5. Park needs additional law and rule enforcement after dark and on weekends.
6. Covering the existing shelter will add to the transient problem.
--
Michelle Cornell
*
I read a short article on idahostatesman.com regarding the Camel's Back Master Plan meeting. I own a property on
10th Street but live out of state. Could you please send me more information on this?
Thanks in advance,
Bill Waterfield
*
My name is Hans Germann and I live across the street from Camel’s Back Park. I am writing in
response to hearing from my neighbors Alan and Kim Pinkerton that the city is proposing some drastic
changes to the park. I hope that by living directly across from the park my concerns are both heard and
considered since any changes could impact me greatly.
To begin, I am not alone in viewing Camel’s Back Park as a clearly defined open and green space
that is symbolic in defining where city and development ends and the foothills of the Boise Front begin.
It truly is the gateway to the foothills and should be preserved as such. Over the last 8 years of living
across from the park, I am yet to hear a single comment from those I have discussed the park with
wishing to have more developed facilities. Not one.
In addressing each item individually; the basketball court idea doesn’t fit with the spirit of the
park. To those in the neighborhood, as well as citywide, Camel’s Back is a demonstrated display of
keeping green space in an urban environment. More than just that, it is also a vital transition from
urban to nature. There are a number of available basketball courts around the north end at middle and
high schools…which receive little to moderate use at best. It is not a value-adding development for this
particular park. Another concern with basketball courts is the likelihood of after-hours use of the
facilities which impacts homeowners negatively given the close proximity of houses to the park.
With respect to a covered shelter area, Boise enjoys a very mild climate, so I’m not sure this will
offer any added utility to current park-goers. What this could produce is more interest in using the
shelters by large groups. The problem(s) with more large groups than the park already receives is:
A. The shortage of available parking and adding impact to homeowners’ curbside parking.
B. The proximity to residences compared to several other parks in the city which are better suited for
large group activity (Anne Morrison, Catherine Albertson, Veteran’s Menorial, Julia Davis to name a
few). Large groups at the park during operating hours are great, but on many occasions large groups
tend to stay until after legal park hours creating night-time noise and disturbances for 13th street
residences.
C. Congesting neighborhood streets with even more traffic than they already receive, also adding to the
current high percentage of drivers who go well over the 20MPH speed limit on 13th (usually while driving
right past the playground).
D. Creating a more inviting environment for homeless vagrancy which is already a growing problem at
the park.
As for an outdoor gym or exercise type space created, this too goes against the spirit of the
park. Most visitors to this park in particular come for the immediate access to nature. This type of
development is a great idea for a park, but better suited at a different locale.
Camel’s Back Park is intended to be a neighborhood park, but is clearly receiving regional (citywide) usage. The amount of vehicles that descend upon it on any given day will attest to the fact that it
really is at its maximum occupancy already. To try and ‘improve’ the park with added facilities will have
vehicle parking busting at the seams. And keep in mind that it is nestled in a neighborhood. There are a
number of other parks within the city that are far better suited to accommodate more usage without
impacting homeowners. If in fact a surplus of funds is available to the City Parks Department, I have
friends who live near 5 Mile and Overland who would love to have a new park in their neighborhood for
their two daughters to enjoy!
To say the least I am strongly opposed to these proposed changes to Camel’s Back Park and will
do everything I can to preserve the park as it currently is. Thank you for your time and consideration in
this matter.
June 2014 Animal Control Stats
6/1/2014
Sunday
Camels Back
Dog at Large
warning
6/1/2014
Sunday
Camels Back
Dog at Large
Infraction
6/1/2014
Sunday
Camels Back
Failure to Bear License Tag
warning
6/7/2014
Saturday
Camels Back
Dog at Large
warning
6/19/2014
Thursday
Camels Back
Dog at Large
warning
6/19/2014
Thursday
Camels Back
Failure to Bear License Tag
warning
6/23/2014
Monday
Camels Back
Dog at Large
Infraction
6/29/2014
Sunday
Camels Back
Dog at Large
Letter - Warning
8
Camels Back