Entering the Conversation
English 101
September 22, 2008
To succeed with Paper #2, understand…
• How to introduce what others are saying
• How to summarize what others are saying
• How to quote (and cite) what others are
saying
• How to respond to what others are saying
• How to signal the differences between
what you are saying and what others are
saying
Surprise!
• All of the items on that list are in chapters
1 through 5 of They Say/I Say
• However…
▫ You are also responsible for knowing how to
use parenthetical citations and how to
create a proper works cited list.
 See Maimon, A Writer’s Resource or another
such handbook.
Entering the Conversation
• When we say “entering the conversation,”
we mean that when you are responding to
a text you must put it in context and
interact with it as you make your point(s).
▫ A REPORT simply restates what has been said.
▫ An ANALYSIS shows that you can break things
apart and show how they fit together as a whole.
▫ A “conversation” requires both report and analysis
but also your own assertions (the ARGUMENT).
Structuring the Conversation
• Provide context for your claim.
• Present your claim.
• Support your claim, which includes (but is
not limited to):
▫ Summarizing, framing, clarifying, pointing out flaws
in, and amending “their” claims
▫ Remember to always keep what “they say” in view.
• Wrap it up.
“They Say” – Context for Your
Own Claim
• Common sense dictates that _____.
▫ Explain, then make your own claim
• I’ve always believed that ________.
▫ Explain, then make your own claim.
• Although not stated directly, A appears to
believe _________.
▫ Explain, then make your own claim.
The Art of Summarizing
Concise
Accurate
Brief
Independent
Neutral
The Art of Summarizing (cont’d)
• Understand what you are summarizing.
• Avoid LIST SUMMARIES.
• Use signal verbs.
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argue, assert, believe, claim, etc.
acknowledge, agree, endorse, support, etc.
complain, contend, question, refute, etc.
demand, encourage, implore, urge, etc.
Citing a Summary
• When you are summarizing a text, you
still have to cite the page numbers you
are summarizing, if you are summarizing
only part of the text.
▫ Smilansky discusses gossips and terrorists
to make a point about the contradictions
inherent in moral complaints (92-93).
Smilansky, Saul. “The Paradox of Moral Complaint.” 10
Moral Paradoxes. Malden, MA: Blackwell, 2007. 90-99.
Print.
Parenthetical References
• Parenthetical references should point the user
directly to the citation at the end.
▫ (Author Last Name Page #) -> (Smith 25)
▫ There should be an entry in the works cited for
Smith’s text.
• However, if the author is already stated, the
reference looks different:
▫ According to John Smith, we are “doomed” (51).
Parenthetical References
• The reference always appears at the end
of the sentence in which the quotation or
paraphrasing is located.
• The period goes after the parenthesis.
• There is no page number used for
parenthetical references of web sites.
Works Cited
• ALWAYS refer to a handbook or a legitimate web
site before creating your works cited page(s).
• All references in your text should match up with
a citation in the works cited list.
• Entries are arranged alphabetically by the
author's last name, or by the title of the work if
there is no author
• Indent entries that break across lines.
• Entries are double-spaced
The Art of Quoting
• Write the arguments of others into your
own text…literally.
▫ Provides credibility to your own argument
▫ Ensures your argument is fair and accurate
▫ Quotations act as evidence
• BE WARY! Do not
▫ quote too little
▫ quote too much
Quoting is More than Putting
Words in Quotation Marks
• Quote relevant passages—but only quote
what you need
• Frame every quotation; avoid “hit and
run” quotations
• Use the QUOTATION SANDWICH
▫ Introduction
▫ Quotation
▫ Explanation
The Quotation Sandwich
According to Smilansky, “a person cannot
complain when others treat him or her in ways
similar to those in which the complainer freely
treats others” (91). In other words, Smilansky
believes that if Bob kills my family, Bob doesn’t
have the right to complain if I kill his. This
situation exemplifies the paradox of moral
complaint.
Smilansky, Saul. “The Paradox of Moral Complaint.” 10 Moral Paradoxes.
Malden, MA: Blackwell, 2007. 90-99. Print.
Three Ways to Respond
• Agree, disagree, or some combination of
agreement and disagreement.
▫ The point is that you RESPOND AT ALL.
• Declare your stance quickly and clearly.
• Responding well takes practice; it is more
difficult than it seems.
Disagree…and Explain Why
• Disliking something is not the same as
disagreeing with it.
• If you disagree with something you must
fully explain why that is the case—with a
logical argument.
• Disagreeing is MORE than simply adding
“not” to what someone else said.
Disagree…and Explain Why
• I think X is mistaken because she
overlooks an entire field of research which
I will now summarize for you.
• I disagree with X’s view that grass is blue
because, as recent research has shown,
grass is only ever blue in Kentucky and
we are in Washington.
Agree…But With a Difference
• Avoid parroting back what someone else
has said.
• I agree that coffee in the morning is a
good thing, because my experience as a
coffee drinker confirms it.
• Smilansky’s theory of the paradox of
moral complaint is useful as it sheds light
on the problems of guilt and innocence.
Agree and Disagree Simultaneously
• Move beyond the “is too/is not”
exchanges and the potential for shouting
matches.
• Complicate your argument and provide
nuance so as to highlight your skills.
• It does not have to be a 50/50
proposition.
Agree and Disagree Simultaneously
• Although I agree with Jones up to a point,
I cannot accept her overall premise that
grass is always blue.
▫ Sometimes grass is blue
▫ Most of the time grass is green
▫ Grass can be other colors
▫ There is plenty of evidence to work through
and another conclusion to be made.
Distinguishing What YOU Say
From What THEY Say
• Who says what should always be clear.
▫ Use VOICE MARKERS
• When you read texts, pay close attention
to voice markers in use.
Distinguishing What YOU Say
From What THEY Say
X argues ______.
According to X, ______.
The evidence shows that ______.
It is widely held that ______.
I wholeheartedly endorse what X calls the
___________.
• The conclusions regarding ________,
which X refers to as _______, add weight
to the argument that _________.
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Effective Uses of “I”
• Assertiveness // Clarity // Positioning
Original: “In studying American popular culture of the
1980s, the question of to what degree materialism
was a major characteristic of the cultural milieu was
explored.”
Better: “In my study of American popular culture of the
1980s, I explored the degree to which materialism
characterized the cultural milieu.”
Ineffective Uses of “I”
• When it’s already clear it’s your
statement, or you have already asserted
your position
Original: “I think that Aristotle's ethical arguments are
logical and readily applicable to contemporary cases,
or at least it seems that way to me.”
Better: “Aristotle's ethical arguments are logical and
readily applicable to contemporary cases.”
Style, aka “your voice”
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Say what you mean
Say it clearly
Say it an appropriate tone
Be yourself
BUT…
AVOID WORDINESS
• Common reasons for wordiness
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Uncertainty about your topic
Lack of a developed argument
Lack of evidence
Uncontrollable urge to use adjectives for
everything.
Common Wordiness Problems
• Lots of qualifiers
▫ WORDY: Most people usually think that many
puppies are generally pretty cute.
▫ CLEAR: Most people think that puppies are cute.
• Using words that mean the same thing
▫ WORDY: Adrienne fulfilled all our hopes and dreams
when she saved the whole entire planet.
▫ CLEAR: Adrienne fulfilled all our hopes when she
saved the planet.
Common Wordiness Problems
• Overuse of prepositional phrases
▫ WORDY: The reason for the failure of the economic
system of the island was the inability of Gilligan in
finding adequate resources without incurring
expenses at the hands of the headhunters on the
other side of the island.
▫ CLEAR: Gilligan hurt the economic system of the
island because he couldn't find adequate resources
without angering the headhunters.
Common Wordiness Problems
• Using stock phrases you can replace with
one or two words
▫ WORDY: The fact that I did not like the aliens
affected our working relationship. The aliens must
be addressed in a professional manner.
▫ CLEAR: My dislike of the aliens affected our working
relationship. The aliens must be addressed
professionally.
Ostentatious Erudition
“Never use a long word where a short one
will do.” – George Orwell
• Do not blindly use multi-syllabic words in
an effort to sound “more collegiate.”
▫ Can make you sound like you don't know
what you are talking about
▫ Can give the impression that you are
plagiarizing from a source you don't
understand
Ostentatious Erudition
• Never use a word you can't clearly define.
▫ If you know one, and can use it correctly,
and it fits with your tone, then great.
 BAD: "That miscreant has a superlative
aesthetic sense, but he's dopey.“
• It’s okay to repeat the same word(s) in
your paper, particularly when they are
significant or central terms.
▫ Don’t try to fix something that isn’t broken.
Ostentatious Erudition
• Something nice, from Ecclesiastes:
“I returned and saw under the sun, that the
race is not to the swift, nor the battle to
the strong, neither yet bread to the wise,
nor yet riches to men of understanding,
nor yet favour to men of skill; but time
and chance happeneth to them all.”
Ostentatious Erudition
• What happened when some overzealous
student got hold of that passage:
“Objective considerations of contemporary
phenomena compel the conclusion that success
or failure in competitive activities exhibits no
tendency to be commensurate with innate
capacity, but that a considerable element of the
unpredictable must invariably be taken into
account.”
Arguing is Not Just Talking Loudly
• You cannot produce a scholarly argument
simply by using exclamation points and
calling people names.
• Instead
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Make a claim.
Provide evidence.
Acknowledge or make a counterargument.
Have an awareness of your audience.
Cite your source.
Avoid Fallacies!
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Hasty generalization
Missing the point
Post hoc ergo propter hoc
Appeal to false authority
Ad populum
Ad hominum
Appeal to ignorance
• Trust me, there are more…