[19:29:06] --------------------------Home-------------------------[19:29:14] --------------------------Paper P3-------------------------[19:29:27] --------------------------Paper F3-------------------------[19:29:56] mahdiniaacc: lender
[19:30:07] mahdiniaacc: employee
[19:30:10] Ansi: oh , you are helping me ?
[19:30:13] Ansi: :)
[19:30:18] mahdiniaacc: government
[19:30:31] --------------------------Chill/Music Room-------------------------[19:30:41] --------------------------Paper F3-------------------------[19:30:48] mahdiniaacc: suppliers
[19:30:59] mahdiniaacc: investors
[19:31:19] plen: wht bout management
[19:31:35] mahdiniaacc: as we studied last session
[19:31:37] Ansi: Financial statements assist this group by providing info about the trends and recent
developmentss in the prosperity of the entity and the range of it's acctivities
[19:31:53] Ansi: {mahdiniaacc} yes, good those are the groups that are outliend in framework
[19:31:55] mahdiniaacc: management is not according to framework
[19:32:05] plen: k
[19:32:06] Ansi: good
[19:32:31] Ansi: so which group i was talking about ?
[19:32:42] Ansi: now you sank inside framework? :P
[19:33:01] --------------------------Paper P3-------------------------[19:33:09] patrots269: hi
[19:33:21] linda4: Hi
[19:36:56] --------------------------Paper F3-------------------------[19:37:12] --------------------------Paper P3-------------------------[19:40:22] wanggla: what time is P3 discussion?
[19:40:49] linda4: {wanggla} Hi
[19:41:11] wanggla: {linda4} I thought it should be 7.30?
[19:41:27] patrots269: we can start now
[19:41:43] wanggla: only 3 of us
[19:41:53] patrots269: so far yes
[19:42:20] wanggla: Okay
[19:43:04] wanggla: I missed the previous discussion, but I read all the document recorded
[19:43:13] patrots269: we are going to cover business process change
[19:43:36] wanggla: good
[19:43:59] patrots269: anyone know the difference between a system and a process
[19:44:17] wanggla: prcoess is part of system?
[19:44:51] patrots269: so business processes are important sub systems
[19:45:32] wanggla: system contains many processes
[19:45:55] wanggla: we use processes to improve system
[19:46:50] patrots269: there are three types of business processes
[19:46:54] wanggla: bit quiet here
[19:47:19] patrots269: linda4 may join in soon
[19:48:19] linda4: okay I'm back
[19:48:22] wanggla: you mean the size of the process?
[19:48:36] patrots269: management, operational & supporting
[19:48:56] patrots269: a system is an input process and output
[19:49:54] wanggla: so middle black box is change
[19:50:31] patrots269: please explain
[19:51:21] wanggla: input and output, so there is something happened in the middle
[19:52:10] linda4: which is the process?
[19:52:22] patrots269: Management processes, the processes that govern the operation of a
system. Typical management processes include Corporate Governance and Strategic Management
[19:52:56] wanggla: so what system here means?
[19:53:05] wanggla: a CG system?
[19:53:20] wanggla: what we try to get?
[19:53:41] wanggla: i don't like this chapter, even it is very important
[19:54:23] patrots269: linda did you like this chapter
[19:54:35] linda4: not really
[19:54:53] linda4: but organisational structure is worse
[19:55:05] wanggla: that might be the reason I failed P3 3 times so far...
[19:55:23] linda4: what did u get in June
[19:55:38] wanggla: I should wait to take Jun 2011 exam, maybe
[19:55:48] patrots269: have you done any past papers and got them marked by a tutor
[19:55:51] wanggla: when there are more accounting related question
[19:56:17] wanggla: no, but I am doing now this time
[19:56:26] linda4: do u managed your time properly for the exam or u just didn't answer/ apply
questions correctly
[19:56:38] wanggla: never finish the questions
[19:56:49] linda4: Ureka
[19:56:59] patrots269: what topics are off june 11
[19:57:06] wanggla: and I feel i have so many things not written yet
[19:57:14] linda4: try doing questions under exam conditions at home
[19:57:20] wanggla: nothing off, but more calculation
[19:57:33] patrots269: i prefer numbers
[19:57:45] wanggla: there is one 25 marks question will be full calculation
[19:57:55] linda4: really
[19:58:06] patrots269: is there still a 50 mark case study
[19:58:09] wanggla: you can have a look of acca website
[19:58:17] patrots269: i will
[19:58:25] linda4: yes would check
[19:58:33] wanggla: 50 marks will have more marks allocated to calculation
[19:58:42] wanggla: for the case study
[19:59:15] patrots269: i done the pilot paper Dec 10 case study and got it marked by a tutor
[19:59:32] wanggla: there is a pilot paper for P3 from Jun 2011, if you read through all, you will find
out the difference
[19:59:41] linda4: ok
[19:59:55] patrots269: i only got 15 out of 50
[20:00:09] linda4: {patrots269} I want to attempt questions as well and let someone correct for me
[20:00:22] linda4: but I'm not going classes
[20:00:30] patrots269: neither am i
[20:00:38] linda4: {patrots269} what do u think is the problem
[20:00:44] wanggla: are you guys good on writting?
[20:01:09] patrots269: knowledge is not the problem
[20:01:12] wanggla: so far i have 2 exams resit, on if F8, the other one is P3
[20:01:19] linda4: its application
[20:01:27] patrots269: yes
[20:01:27] wanggla: the problem for me is writting
[20:01:37] patrots269: what do you mean
[20:01:46] linda4: {wanggla} where are u from?
[20:02:03] wanggla: English is my second language
[20:02:15] linda4: that's the problem
[20:02:45] linda4: {wanggla} but u typed well, lol
[20:02:51] wanggla: P3 is my last one, but i am just keep failing...
[20:02:59] linda4: wow
[20:02:59] wanggla: thank you!!
[20:03:13] linda4: do u attempt alot of questions
[20:03:32] wanggla: you mean practise?
[20:03:45] patrots269: my tutor told me to spend at least an hour a day doing questions
[20:03:48] linda4: try doing question under the 3hr and 15mins alotted time and give it to someone
to mark
[20:04:08] wanggla: i always think in my mind, but don't know how to write down
[20:04:15] linda4: by now u must have attemped all and know the examiners answer
[20:04:36] linda4: {wanggla} that's why doing questions would help u
[20:04:43] linda4: u develop that skill
[20:04:50] linda4: you will*
[20:04:59] patrots269: Ten minutes per day doing past paper questions. This is the demoralizing
part, and i regularly fail to grasp what the question is asking and give up. But it is an area i must
pursue
[20:05:14] linda4: yes
[20:05:26] wanggla: it is hard but we have to do it
[20:05:39] linda4: even if u feel like u don't know try again and again
[20:05:45] wanggla: tutor left a coursework, only 20 marks, i used 2 nights to finish it...
[20:05:52] linda4: because your knowledge is already there
[20:06:02] linda4: {wanggla} lol
[20:06:02] patrots269: how do you approach the case study
[20:06:13] linda4: {wanggla} it happens
[20:06:16] wanggla: have you ever think we should do question 2 or 3 or 4 first?
[20:06:37] linda4: {patrots269} read the requirements first thing first
[20:06:51] wanggla: while that's the strategy when i do P1
[20:06:55] linda4: have u guys read the article in the student accountant
[20:07:12] patrots269: during the 15 minutes i am writing out the models on the back of the
question paper
[20:07:22] wanggla: which one? there is no new things for a while?
[20:07:41] linda4: aug 11th
[20:08:07] wanggla: not yet
[20:08:42] wanggla: have you ever sit P3? or it's your first time?
[20:09:28] wanggla: i know i should read the question, but when i read the case, i feel everything
gives me clue for the model
[20:09:43] wanggla: and ends up running out of time
[20:10:40] wanggla: But when I passed P1, I only prepared for 2 weeks, and on the exam, I suddenly
deicide to do the 2 25 marks question first, and leave the 50 mark case study at last
[20:10:54] linda4: sorry my computer is sticking on me
[20:11:05] linda4: bbut here's the link
[20:11:08] linda4:
http://www.accaglobal.com/pubs/students/publications/student_accountant/archive/sa_aug10_p3.
pdf
[20:11:20] wanggla: thanks a lot!
[20:11:37] patrots269: did anyone watch the video of the examiner
[20:11:39] linda4: did u listen to examiner podcast
[20:11:48] linda4: with Steve Skidmore
[20:11:53] linda4: {patrots269} yes
[20:11:54] linda4: lol
[20:11:58] patrots269: yes and i took notes
[20:12:03] wanggla: yes I did
[20:12:45] linda4: he even showed an eg of what to and what not to write for an answer
[20:12:53] linda4: same amount of words
[20:13:12] patrots269: {linda4} is this your first attempt
[20:13:17] linda4: just one was really answering the question and one was not
[20:13:22] linda4: {patrots269} No
[20:13:31] linda4: I wrote it in June
[20:13:37] patrots269: join the club
[20:13:40] linda4: was not prepared at all
[20:13:58] linda4: so at least I knew my problem
[20:14:17] linda4: working on passing it now
[20:14:22] patrots269: do you have problems learning the models
[20:14:36] linda4: not really
[20:14:38] wanggla: {linda4} the question on that artcle is just the coursework i need to do...
[20:14:54] wanggla: models is fine, only the combination
[20:15:05] linda4: its application
[20:15:09] wanggla: sometimes we can use 3 models for one question
[20:15:17] linda4: I truly believe this is the problem
[20:15:28] linda4: also we waste alot of time on question1
[20:15:38] patrots269: i think you have to learn the models before you can apply them
[20:15:44] linda4: thinking we could pass with doing that question alone
[20:16:04] linda4: well I do believe most of us know the models
[20:16:05] wanggla: i can't remember who told me, but for one model, we just need to select 2 - 3
aspects if we can't cover all
[20:16:17] linda4: if doing the P3 paper
[20:16:34] linda4: but many believe they would explain a model and pass
[20:16:43] linda4: and that is so not true
[20:16:58] linda4: we need to answer what is asked
[20:17:09] wanggla: i remembered, it is my colleague, he got 75 on P3
[20:17:20] linda4: and not use 10 external models because we know them all
[20:17:28] wanggla: and he said, always use SWOT combine another model
[20:18:07] wanggla: and you will get at least 2 more marks on that question
[20:18:39] wanggla: i didn't try yet as I just run out of time
[20:19:09] linda4: when did he sit the exam, I'm assuming its a he
[20:19:42] linda4: because SWOT would not always be relevant
[20:19:54] linda4: maybe part of it but not all
[20:19:54] wanggla: he only sit P3 for this level so far, so I image not too long ago
[20:20:43] linda4: SWOT combines both external and internal analysis
[20:20:55] wanggla: anyway, control the quantity of writting is important
[20:21:02] linda4: yes
[20:21:24] wanggla: he means strengh and weakness is very easy to identity
[20:21:27] linda4: apportion time to the amount of marks
[20:21:37] patrots269: to focus the mind remember you need to earn one mark every 1.8 minutes
[20:22:04] wanggla: while when we write a point, we need to explain it
[20:22:16] patrots269: yes critically
[20:22:34] linda4: there's always an "BECAUSE"
[20:22:39] wanggla: so 1-2 sentences?
[20:23:15] linda4: do u guys make use of the table in the question
[20:23:23] wanggla: yes
[20:23:26] linda4: qualitative info.
[20:23:41] wanggla: you mean model or figures?
[20:23:52] linda4: figures
[20:24:01] wanggla: seldomly
[20:24:22] patrots269: maybe you should start with the numbers
[20:24:25] wanggla: I only provide a rate like market share or sales increase rate
[20:24:59] wanggla: and NGO questions are more popular now
[20:25:11] wanggla: even every time there will be NGO question
[20:25:26] wanggla: or NPO
[20:25:42] patrots269: what is NGO, NPO
[20:26:05] wanggla: not for profit org
[20:26:22] linda4: oh
[20:27:01] wanggla: and it just not make sense as i don't know how it exactly works
[20:27:20] wanggla: all my works so far are profit seeking companies
[20:27:41] linda4: {wanggla} give an exxample of a question
[20:27:51] linda4: and then tell me what gave u problems
[20:28:02] wanggla: i think the one i just failed in jun 10
[20:28:12] linda4: WET
[20:28:17] wanggla: yep
[20:28:30] linda4: I did over question 1
[20:28:38] linda4: and it was better than I thought
[20:29:10] wanggla: when i read the examiner's answer, i just feel i shouldn't be given a pass
[20:29:24] linda4: that question did not give us any specific model
[20:29:44] linda4: but based on the reuirements there were a few that could have helped
[20:29:44] wanggla: and i waste nearly 2 hours on this one
[20:30:00] linda4: I wasted my time too
[20:30:08] wanggla: i used 3-4 models for the fist question
[20:30:18] wanggla: mendelow
[20:30:37] linda4: PESTEL, Medelow, Organisation mission statement
[20:32:02] wanggla: that's the question"strategic position; covering
environment, strategic capability, stakeholder expectations and organisational mission" from acca
[20:32:36] wanggla: what should be under strategic capability?
[20:32:51] linda4: Strategic Capability ....Threshold resource & competencies and Unique resources
and core competencies
[20:33:00] wanggla: SW
[20:33:05] wanggla: 7M
[20:33:09] linda4: yes
[20:33:10] wanggla: HR
[20:33:33] linda4: and we did this in Chapter 3
[20:33:41] wanggla: yes
[20:33:45] linda4: the chapter explains well
[20:33:51] linda4: thanks to Patrots
[20:34:09] wanggla: but do you realy have the time to write? if you manage to organise the answer's
structure
[20:34:34] wanggla: oh, is the time now
[20:34:54] linda4: here's what since its only 3 of us
[20:35:11] wanggla: so we might do some more questions in the future
[20:36:13] wanggla: thanks guys and have a good night
[20:36:19] linda4: can we do a question for this week
[20:36:27] linda4: lets say for Friday?
[20:36:33] wanggla: sure
[20:37:00] patrots269: what que
[20:37:03] wanggla: which one you suggest? i just fed up read the questions as I read them for 3
times
[20:37:08] linda4: lol
[20:37:22] linda4: June 2009?
[20:37:32] linda4: do u guys have that
[20:37:45] linda4: if not we can pick any other
[20:37:51] wanggla: green tech?
[20:38:01] patrots269: yes i have it
[20:38:05] wanggla: should be fine, they are on acca website anyway
[20:38:10] linda4: can't say I just picked a question
[20:38:17] linda4: kool
[20:38:33] wanggla: that's fine
[20:38:35] linda4: I want us to time ourselves first
[20:38:43] wanggla: just use this one
[20:38:50] linda4: and see how much we get done
[20:39:03] linda4: yes only 1
[20:39:16] linda4: question
[20:39:20] linda4: question 1
[20:39:21] wanggla: no problem
[20:39:32] wanggla: Friday 7.30pm
[20:39:37] linda4: yes
[20:39:38] wanggla: Jun 09 Q1
[20:39:47] linda4: yes, do we agree
[20:39:54] wanggla: agree!
[20:40:03] patrots269: agree
[20:40:11] wanggla: deal!
[20:40:13] linda4: on Friday we can say how long it took us
[20:40:25] linda4: if u guys want to type it out u can
[20:40:28] wanggla: might take me 3 nights
[20:40:32] linda4: lol
[20:40:39] linda4: start from today
[20:40:41] linda4: lol
[20:40:58] wanggla: got evening course tomorrow so from tuesday
[20:41:03] wanggla: till friday!
[20:41:14] linda4: okay then
[20:41:20] wanggla: thanks very much
[20:41:34] patrots269: see you then
[20:41:39] wanggla: and see you later
[20:41:41] linda4: sorry Patrots for us not doing the chapter today
[20:41:56] wanggla: night night!
[20:42:09] patrots269: no problem i think learned more tonight
[20:42:23] linda4: {patrots269} okay then
[20:42:27] linda4: take care u guys
[20:42:30] linda4: bye
[20:42:31] patrots269: see you