MINUTES OF THE MEETING OF THE TAXATION ADMINISTRATION
LIAISON COMMITTEE – “MAIN TALC” HELD ON WEDNESDAY, 3rd
MARCH 2005 AT THE LAW SOCIETY, BLACKHALL PLACE, DUBLIN.
Attendance:
Law Society of Ireland
Caroline Devlin (in the Chair)
Patrick Bradley
Revenue
Liam Irwin
Denis Graham
Gerry Harrahill
Eamonn O’Dea
Michael Gladney
Clare Robson
John Shine
Muriel Hinch
CCAB-I
Marie Barr
Enda Faughnan
Brian Purcell
Gerald Murphy
Irish Taxation Institute
Adrian Sherlock
Cora Murray
Margaret Sheridan
Kenneth McMoreland
With
Apologies:
Colette Carey (Law Society) (Secretary)
Norman Gillanders (Revenue)
Item No. 1
Agree Minutes of December 2004 meeting
The Minutes of the meeting held on 3rd December, 2004 were approved subject to the
amendment of Item 6 “Guidance Notes for Section 481 TCA 1997 (Film Relief
Provisions)” by the insertion of a final sentence as follows:
“Practitioners were invited to make submissions in relation
to the matter.”
Item No. 2
Budget/Finance Bill 2005
Stamp duty: Practitioners said that difficulties had arisen regarding the interaction of
Floor Area Compliance Certificates and stamp duty relief sought by purchasers of
grant-size houses who are purchasing by way of stage payments. Revenue said that
both the Dept. of Finance and Revenue are aware of the issue, which is under active
consideration.
Share options: As this item had been taken up directly with Revenue it was removed
from the agenda.
Corporation Tax: Revenue said that the IAS section had been amended at Committee
stage. Transition arrangements had been provided for payment of Preliminary Tax for
a period of one year to ease the position of those making the transition from Irish
GAAP to IFRS accounts. Changes in value in the last two months of the accounting
period can be disregarded for the purposes of preliminary tax but the tax must be paid
within one month after the accounting period.
VAT: Practitioners queried whether a special meeting of the Indirect Taxes subcommittee had taken place in mid-February to discuss the proposed changes. Revenue
advised that no such meeting had occurred – practitioners had indicated they would
submit comments in writing instead. Draft of the Committee stage amendments were
circulated to the sub-Committee and were discussed at a meeting held on 11th
February.
Section 133 Finance Bill – New Revenue Offences: It was noted that a joint
delegation comprising representatives from each of the constituent practitioner bodies
had met with the Minister for Finance to point out potential difficulties with the draft
legislation and also to suggest amendments to the wording. The matter was now with
the Minister for consideration.
Item No. 3
Issues arising from December meeting
Revenue report on Form 11 error analysis
Revenue presented its report on Form 11 error analysis. Practitioners had also carried
out several ad hoc reviews and noted that their experience of errors differed greatly
from the Revenue report. Revenue said it intends publishing its report with a
commentary in Tax Briefing. Practitioners took issue with the figures shown by the
analysis as compared with their own sampling. Revenue agreed to check their
sampling and indicated that there would be a further review/consultation on the issue.
Amending Form 11 through ROS
Practitioners said they would welcome a facility to amend Forms 11 filed through
ROS. Revenue said that amendments would have to ensure that the original Form 11
as initially filed would have to be kept. As regards ‘instalment’ filing, this process
does not currently suit ROS. Practitioners were of the view that it would be a useful
development. Whilst Revenue are agreeable to it, subject to resources, it is not in the
development programme for ROS for this year.
Contact details for Revenue Managers
Revenue advised that the details had been widely circulated and have been uploaded
on the Revenue website. Practitioners said that there had been instances where the
contact person did not appear to know that he/she had been so designated. It was
agreed that practitioners would furnish details to Revenue in this regard.
Attribution of Tax Briefing Articles
Revenue agreed that they would try to ensure that contact details appear with each
article published, although the contact person may not be author of the piece in every
case but would be a person designated to deal with queries on the issue in question. It
was agreed that it would be sufficient to provide an e-mail address for contact
purposes but where possible this should be the e-mail address of an individual rather
than a general e-mail address.
Item No. 4
Revenue Customer Service Issues
Offshore Asset submissions: Practitioners noted that settlement and review letters are
issuing from Revenue but in the case of reviews, there is no time-frame within which
Revenue may revert seeking substantiating documentation e.g. bank statements etc.
Revenue responded that the intention in the regions is to follow up quickly on the
initial letters and on the responses received - perhaps within a one month to six weeks
timeframe. Practitioners queried whether any information could be provided regarding
the number of cases affected. Revenue said there would be certain minimum level
and random sampling would be employed. The matter is to be kept under review.
Item No. 5
ROS issues
Update on CT ROS payments – US SEC issue: This issue was raised by CCAB-I and
there has been fairly active consultation that is now concluded. Some enhancements
to the system are required and a meeting is scheduled to take place on 4th March.
Revenue indicated its appreciation of the progress made on this issue. The matter is
to remain on the agenda.
Update on CAT e-payment arrangements: Issues in relation to the Solicitors’
Accounts Regulations and the use of ROS for CAT payments have been resolved. The
Law Society has advised the profession accordingly. Revenue thanked the Law
Society for its assistance in the matter. From the point of view of solicitors, a
partially paper-based and partially electronic system is not helpful. It was agreed that
Revenue and the Law Society would liaise in this regard.
ROS availability for non-resident clients: Revenue expect to be in position to report
to the next meeting on this issue.
ROS filing date 2005: The ROS filing date has been extended to 17th November
2005. Revenue stressed that payment must be made and the return filed by that date.
Last year there had been a significant number of cases where filing was done in time
but the requirement to pay by the given date had not been complied with. For those
not using ROS, the pay and file date is 31st October 2005. Practitioners said that
some clients mistakenly believe that they can take advantage of the extended date but
still pay by cheque. Also, some clients are reluctant to use electronic payment
systems. Revenue asked that practitioners encourage clients to use the ROS facility.
Item No. 6
Guidance Notes for Section 481 TCA 1997 (Film Relief)
Practitioners had intended making a submission in relation to the guidelines and were
disappointed to note that they had issued before Christmas. Revenue said that on10th
November a six-week period for submissions had been announced and it had been
made clear that the commencement date would be 1st January. However, Revenue
will look at any submission that practitioners may wish to make at this stage.
Item No. 7
Operational Issues
Interest on underpaid tax: Revenue said that an article on the issue will appear in
the Revenue publication ‘Tax Briefing’.
Accessing e-brief: Practitioners said that it is not possible for them to register through
the system itself as it is not being recognised unless it is on Outlook. It can also be
difficult to locate and it was suggested that an ‘icon’ might be assigned to it on the tax
practitioner’s page.
Outsourcing of processing of statutory forms: Practitioners are experiencing
difficulty with technical support from Revenue. An undertaking had been given that
Form 11s would be processed by 11 February. However, the error rate was very high
with first assessments showing an error rate of 90%. A multiplicity of errors had been
in evidence and no clear error pattern had emerged. Not only were initial assessments
wrong, but subsequent amended assessments were also wrong in many cases.
Revenue pointed out that by using ROS, customers were guaranteed a correct result.
The TALC Simplification sub-Committee is also looking the Form 11 problems. .
Professional Services Withholding Tax – Interim Refunds – Hardship cases: This
matter has been referred to the TALC Simplification sub-Committee and is to be
removed from the Main TALC agenda.
Surcharges: This issue has been resolved and districts are now using the date of
receipt in Dublin rather than the date of receipt in the Collector General’s offices. It
was agreed that practitioners would provide sample instances to Revenue to assist
Revenue in determining where the process went wrong.
Charter of Rights: Practitioners said that a clear statement is needed to the effect that
there is no diminution of taxpayers’ rights. Revenue was requested to furnish a letter
in unequivocal terms stating that taxpayer’s rights are unconditional and are
unaffected by Revenue’s expectations from the taxpayer. Revenue indicated that in its
view the position had been clearly stated in the TALC forum. Revenue’s goal is to
make compliance easier, not to take away rights. Revenue agreed to furnish a letter
and may also address the issue in ‘Tax Briefing’.
Withdrawal of CGT Clearance Certificates: Practitioners sought clarification from
Revenue regarding the status of CGT Clearance Certificates and instanced a recent
case where Revenue had indicated that it would withdraw a certificate. If there is a
difficulty, Revenue should seek a means of rectifying the situation that does not
impact on a third party. Revenue said the case turned on its own facts but
nothwithstanding that, what had happened was wrong and should not have happened.
Revenue will look into the matter and will revert.
Sanction for sub-Committee on IFRS: A consultation process will take place over
the coming year. Revenue will liaise with TALC members regarding the membership
of a Consultative Committee. It was agreed that membership should be confined to
two representatives per organisation as the indications are that quite a number of
organisations will wish to participate and participation confined to the financial
services industry. Revenue would be interested to receive suggestions as to who
should be consulted and will circulate its proposals and suggest a date for a first
meeting in the next few weeks. The Consultative Committee will not be designated as
a sub-Committee of TALC.
Revenue service level agreement with ODCE: Revenue has signed a service level
agreement setting out the system by which information will be provided. Where
Revenue has information obtained through voluntary disclosure, Revenue will not
initiate disclosure to the ODCE but where the ODCE seek disclosable information,
Revenue will furnish it and will indicate that there has been a voluntary disclosure by
the taxpayer. Revenue undertook to circulate the agreement to members. It was agreed
that practitioners will check with Revenue before quoting from the agreement or
publishing all or part of it.
Revenue guidance relating to Directors’ Compliance Statements: Revenue expects
to publish guidance notes in late March or early April. If Revenue requires any input,
practitioners are happy to assist.
Savings Directive: The Law Society had been advised that there will be no paper
filing of returns, which may be problematic for some practitioners. Revenue
undertook to make enquiries but its initial view was that it may be possible to have
both electronic and paper filing.
Item No. 8
Updates from TALC sub-Committees
Capital Taxes Ad-Hoc sub-Committee: Revenue will revert with the names of its
nominees to sub-Committee.
Minutes of sub-Committee meetings: The Minutes of the February 2005 meetings of
the Simplification Group and the Audit sub-Committee were circulated and noted.
Item No. 9
A.O.B.
Revenue Statement of Strategy: Revenue advised that the Statement of Strategy
document will be launched on 30th March. Copies will be circulated to all TALC
members. The number of staff assigned to compliance activities will be increased by
30%. There will be increased self-service facilities/options but this will not reduce
the level of Revenue service available to taxpayers. Revenue thanked practitioners
for their contribution to the consultation process, which is acknowledged in the
preamble to the Strategy document.
BES – Film Relief: Practitioners said that it is unfair that this should be levied and
then be subject to PRSI also. Revenue said that it may be an unintended effect of the
legislation and it may be possible to ‘code’ it differently. Revenue will look into the
matter.
RTC – payment cards: Practitioners queried a situation where a monetary limit had
been imposed. Revenue was of the view that this would be an unusual occurrence but
said that there are circumstances where it can occasionally occur. Revenue
recommended that practitioners speak to the relevant inspector if it is causing a
difficulty. It may be that the sub-contractor does not know what the principal’s limit
is. Revenue undertook to investigate the matter.
Delays in repayment of tax: Practitioners said that in some cases, the delay in
repayment was running at six months. The issue had been raised at the TALC
Collection sub-Committee and assurances had been given that there is no policy of
deliberate delay. Revenue re-iterated this. Practitioners also said that in some cases,
very petty queries had been raised. Practitioners undertook provide examples to
Revenue. Revenue undertook to check the overall position in the Districts.
DATES OF REMAINING MEETINGS FOR 2005:
Tuesday, 17th May
Thursday, 15th September
Friday, 9th December