George’s Governing Body Consultation Meeting St Thursday 20 November 2008, 5.00pm

St George’s Governing Body Consultation Meeting

Thursday 20 November 2008, 5.00pm

RC Diocese Representative:-

Canon McBride Episcopal Vicar for the Department for Formation

Children’s Services Representatives: -

Jill Baker

John Stephens

Robert McIntyre

Strategic Director of Chil dren’s Services

Deputy Director of Children’s Services

Assistant Director, Resources

Stephen Bradbury

Kathryn Mildenstein

Sarah Dowling

Director for BSF

Asset Planning Manager

SEN Caseworker, (Minute taker)

Governing Body Representatives: -

Father Leo Heakin Chair of Governors

Mr John Sharpe

Mr Paul Dermody

Mrs Audrey Judge

Mr John Judge

Staff Governor

Foundation Governor

Foundation Governor

Observer

Mr Brandon Ryan

Mr Grahame Walker

Mr Stephen McManamon

Mr Garry Timperley

Mrs Carole Bowler

Foundation Governor

Foundation Governor

Parent Governor

Parent Governor

Foundation Governor

Miss Moyra Shannon

Mr Peter Fisher

Mrs Ann Middleton

Mr Philip Harte

LA Governor

Observer

Clerk to Governing Body

Headteacher

Father Kevin Tierney Foundation Governor

The Chair of Governors welcomed the group and thanked them for attending the meeting.

Mr. Harte said that some of the original proposals for the high schools had changed e.g. a delay in the opening of Walkden High School. However the proposal for St. George’s remains closure, despite the overwhelming response to keep the school open. The community feel let down and are not being treated fairly under BSF. There is no degree of flexibility from the local authority for St. George’s.

Jill Baker: explained that consultation responses had been reported back to the Council’s Cabinet who had made the decision to consult on the revised proposals for the RC high schools.

Paul Dermody raised concerns brought up in a Q&A document and asked Jill

Baker whether she agreed with the principle of off site playing fields.

Jill Baker responded that in some cases, off site playing fields are the only option.

Paul Dermody questioned the figure of

£1.2 million to refurbishment St

G eorge’s building.

Stephen Bradbury explained that surveys had been undertaken for all BSF schools to identify the remedial work required to bring them up to the appropriate standard and that the figure of £1.2 million covered the building and grounds to bring them up to the appropriate standards.

Paul Dermody r aised issues regarding the size of St. George’s site.

Jill Baker explained that the size of the site was just one factor considered when proposals were being developed.

Paul Dermody questioned the guarantee of places for all pupils in the new school.

Jill Baker: stated that the local authority is not the admissions authority for

RC schools and therefore cannot guarantee places. However, the LA would work with all parties to ensure that as far as possible all the pupils who wish to will be able to transfer to the new school in 2012; including any transitional arrangements required. She went on to state that the proposal for 2550 RC places in the city, plus a 6th form, spread across 3 RC high schools, had been agreed with the Diocese and that this was considered the best possible provision for the RC sector. Jill went on to explain the advantage of being in wave 3 of the BSF programme and that the capital receipt from the sale of the

St. Ambrose Barlow site and the new build on the cheaper Wardley site had meant that 3 new schools could now be considered.

John Judge questioned the council ’s reasons for closing St. George’s and that 2550 places did not provide for non RC pupils.

Jill Baker stated that the 2550 places included a projected 25% places for non-Catholic pupils and explained that schools were also closing in the community sector i.e. Moorside and Swinton.

John Judge questioned why the proposal had changed from St. George’s and St Ambrose Barlow coming together on the Wardley site to St. Ambrose

Barlow increasing in size in a new school on the Wardley site and St.

George’s closure.

Jill Baker explained that the local authority was proposing a new build RC school on the Wardley site. This could either be by closing both St Ambrose

Barlow and St George’s or by closing St George’s and moving St Ambrose

Barlow. The Diocese felt that the latter option would be preferable because it would mean that a Roman Catholic sixth form (allocated to St Ambrose

Barlow by the DCSF) would be achievable.

John Judge questioned the 6th Form presumption.

Jill Baker stated that the DCSF had made it clear to Martin Lochery that if St

Ambrose were to close, the 6 th form would be lost.

Canon McBride confirmed this.

Father Tierney requested clarity on the guarantee of pupil places and jobs for school staff.

Jill Baker stated that she could not guarantee either as the local authority is neither employer nor admissions authority for VA schools, but that the local authority would like to work with RC Diocese and the governing bodies of both schools to bring about the best possible outcomes for pupils and staff.

Father Tierney asked whether this could result in the governing bodies making teachers redundant.

Jill Baker stated this could be the outcome.

Mr. Harte enquired whether the Governing Body had the final power to close the school.

Jill Baker clarified that the local authority can propose the closure of the school and that the Bishop and Governing Body has the right of appeal to the

School’s Adjudicator.

The meeting ended at 6.15 p.m.

St George’s RC Staff Consultation Meeting


RC Diocese Representatives:-

Canon McBride Episcopal Vicar for the Department for Formation

Children’s Services Representatives: -

Jill Baker

Robert McIntyre

Strategic Director of Children’s Services

Assistant Director, Resources

Stephen Bradbury Director for BSF

Kathryn Mildenstein Asset Planning Manager

Paula Flynn Asset Planning Officer, (minute taker)

Sarah Dowling SEN Caseworker, (Minute taker)

Also in attendance were the Headteacher and Staff from St George’s

Roman Catholic High School.

Jill Baker thanked the group for attending and introduced the representatives f rom Children’s Services.

Jill explained that the purpose of the meeting was to discuss the Building

Schools for the Future proposal and to gain the views of the staff. There would also be an opportunity to raise questions. Any responses that could not be given at the meeting would be provided at a later date.

Jill went on to inform the group that Martin Lochery from the RC Diocese should have been attending this meeting; however he had sent apologies due to sickness.

Following consultation on the previous proposal, the Local Authority and the

Roman Catholic Diocese have taken into consideration the comments and views raised and have worked together on an alternative proposal for the RC high schools. Not long after consultation St Ambrose Barlow were given a presumption for a sixth form by the DCSF. However the current St Ambrose

Barlow site would not be large enough to accommodate a sixth form and therefore this issue was taken into consideration when looking at the revised proposal.

The alternative Building Schools for the Future proposal is as follows:

 To close of St George’s RC High School by 2012



To enlarge St Ambrose from 750 to 1050 pupils by creating a new building on the former Wardley High School site by September

2012 and add a 250 place sixth form.

 To rebuild both St Patrick’s and All Hallows (All Hallows building to be located on the former Hope High site) at their existing sizes.

Jill explained that the RC high school proposals are linked financially and in respect of pupil numbers. Therefore if the decision to close St Georges RC

High School is not approved, the whole Roman Catholic school proposal would require revision.

Questions, Answers and Comments

Q. If St Ambrose Barlow closes can we still have a sixth form?

A. No, the 6th form status has been awarded to St Ambrose Barlow RC High

School for its outstanding achievements.

If St Ambrose Barlow had not received funding to create a sixth form then the proposal may well have been to close both St George’s and St Ambrose

Barlow RC High Schools and create one RC high school. This proposal, if approved will deliver 3 brand new RC high schools and a Roman Catholic sixth form.

Jill explained that the consultation for the proposal commenced on the 10

November and will run for a 6 week period until 19 December. During this 6 week period, the LA will be carrying out consultation meetings with staff, parents and governing bodies of the schools to gain their views on the proposal. There will also be a community drop-in consultation event on 26

November. If the proposals are overturned following an appeal to the schools’ adjudicator, the funding could be lost to this authority.

The group was informed that this revised Building Schools for the Future proposal has the support of the Bishop and the Diocese as they feel this is a good opportunity for the Roman Catholic community.

Canon McBride - the proposal is the best we can achieve for Catholic education in Salford. Staff and pupils are to be treated as fairly as possible.

This seems a wonderful opportunity for parents, students and the community as a whole.

Q. Does the Bishop support the consultation or the proposal?

A.

The Bishop agrees with both.

Comment: Martin Lochery recently informed the school that the Diocese had agreed to consultation on this proposal, but that they were in not in agreement with the proposal.

Canon McBride

–

We have looked at the proposal with the Headteacher, governing body and LA representatives. The Diocese is looking at 3 new schools and feels that this is the best way ahead – no deal has been made with City Council.

Q. Are the RC schools being black mailed? Why are we split between

Catholic and non Catholic?

A.

No there is a difference between of Catholic and non Catholic schools, they are not the same, but the proposals are inter linked. The projected figures indicate that we only require 2550 RC places within the city and the amount of money will only build 3 new high schools. If St George’s does not close there will be four RC high schools, and there is only approval for 2550 places. BSF is a way of investing in schools for the future, new transformational schools in Salford. Refurbishment of old buildings is not the best option for the long term as they are restrictive.

Comment: Pupils who walk to school walk past Harrop Fold as St George’s has a great ethos.

Comment: It is not best practice to transport pupils who currently walk. It is not the building it is the children and staff which make the school.

Canon Mc Bride: Thank you for the comment, no final decision has been made and this is one of the reasons why we are undertaking consultation.

Comment: You are targeting an area which has some of the most disadvantaged pupils.

Comment: If we drill down, under BSF an error was made and extra places were created to send the non Catholics to Walkden?

Comment

– Mr. Harte:

I would like to make two points. During the last consultation 448 responses were received. Of those responses 429 were from

St George’s parents and governors and the view was to keep the school open. I feel mistakes have been made in forecasting pupil numbers, leading to a reduction in St George’s numbers to create an extra 300 places at Walkden, and 300 at St Ambrose Barlow. It is unfair for pupils in Little Hulton to have to walk to Wardley. Catholic education is determined by the mission. St

George’s mission statement is strong. All are in agreement to fight to keep the school open.

A:

In terms of consultation, it is clear that you don’t want the school to close.

Q. Why wasn’t St. George’s feedback taken on board during consultation on the previous proposals.

A. We cannot guarantee to give people what they are asking for. Overall, 3 schools is a better option.

Q. We feel that you have already made up your mind theref ore it doesn’t matter how many objections you receive – therefore what can we do?

A.

We’ve looked at the advantages and disadvantages and a lot of thought has gone into this.

Comment: Do you really know this school? Teachers know this school inside out, you are taking away something precious, this school is precious. If you were on the inside you would find it difficult to close.

Comment: How can you close this school when you don’t know what will happen to the lives of the pupils. Teachers feel resentful when decisions are being made when you have no knowledge of the school.

Comment : All teachers enjoy working here, all are long standing members of staff.

Comment: We are disgusted by you saying that other schools will lose funding if we don’t close.

Comment – Mr. Harte: As a point of interest every child placed at St

George’s chose St George’s as their first choice. If you have good schools build on them, don’t close them.

Q: Will you admit you’re wrong on numbers?

A: No. Pupil numbers are projected and therefore it would be impossible to predict totally accurate numbers.

Comment

– Mr. Harte:

Mistakes have been made in calculating pupil numbers.

A: As stated, pupil projections are projections.

Q: Do you have planning permission for a school on Wardley site?

A: No, planning for residential houses on the site was refused as the land is classed as green belt. The City Council need to prove there are no other suitable alternatives sites for the new school.

Q: How do we get jobs in the 6th form?

A:

There will be positions which St George’s staff can apply for.

Canon McBride: There will be co-operation between the schools, for example schools in Oldham. RC schools are working together.

Jill Baker: stated that TUPE is not designed for s chools, and doesn’t give people job security. There are different legal opinions about whether TUPE would apply to staff if these proposals were to be approved. The city council and the Diocese have commissioned legal advice.

Mr. Harte: thanked the LA’s representatives for attending and informed staff that the school intends to fight this proposal. He also informed the group that the LA cannot legally close a RC school and the only people who can are the school’s governing body or the Bishop.

Jill Baker: informed Mr. Harte that this was not correct and legally the City

Council does have powers to propose the closure of a RC school, hence the reason the City Council is consulting on the proposal.

The meeting ended at 4.45pm.

St George’s RC High School parents consultation meeting


Children’s Services and Roman Catholic Diocese representatives:-

Jill Baker

John Stephens

Strategic Director of Children’s Services

Deputy Direc tor of Children’s Services

Robert McIntyre Assistant Director, Resources

Stephen Bradbury

Kathryn Mildenstein

Mike Hall

Cannon McBride

Director of BSF

Asset Planning Manager

Lead for Every Child Matters - BSF

Episcopal Vicar for the Department for Formation

Chris Wells

Paula Flynn

Independent Chair

Asset Planning Officer, (minute taker)

Chris Wells opened the meeting and informed the group that he was attending tonight’s meeting to act as independent chair. Jill Baker would be making a presentation which would then be followed by a question and answer session.

Mr Harte asked if he could take a few minutes to speak to the audience.

Chris Wells agreed.

Comment – Mr Harte – During the last consultation the City Council received

448 record of view responses. 4 of these were from All Hallows, 15 from St

Ambrose Barlow and the remaining 429 from St George’s. It is apparent from this consultation that the City Council have not taken on board the comments and concerns that people raised about the closur e of St George’s and this does not make sense; even though the money available for the BSF programme has increased.

The City Council state that the St George’s site is not suitable, this is not the case, the site is a perfectly good site. Concerns have been raised regarding the size of the playing fields. However, in the past it has been assessed and the report produced from this assessment clearly stated that the size of

Harrop Fold’s playing field was large enough to be shared by two schools.

In the documentation produced by the City Council for the revised RC proposal, it states that the new proposal will provide for those pupils that live in the Little Hulton and Walkden areas, the opportunity to attend a new and outstanding school building; however this new building will be 300 places short for the pupils of St Georges. As St Ambrose Barlow is not closing, it will be the responsibility of the St Ambrose Barlow governing body who will determine the admission arrangements. This alternative proposal is destroying the Roman Catholic Education for both RC and non RC pupils who wish to attend a Roman Catholic School of their choice.

Mr. Harte concluded by stating that he would carry on fighting for catholic education for all who wished to receive it.

Response - Jill commented that she would like to respond to a few points that

Mr Harte had made. Firstly the suggestion was made that the pot of money for the BSF programme had increased. This is true but not because the

Government have allocated additional funding. The additional funding, if the proposal went ahead, would come from the sale of the current St Ambrose

Barlow site and as stated during the last consultation, any funding secured from sale of school sites, whether it be land that belongs to the Diocese or the

City Council will automatically be transferred to the BSF pot. This additional money would enable us to build 3 new RC High Schools rather than undertake refurbishments.

Mr Harte had also raised the issue regarding RC and non RC pupil numbers.

We have projected that we need 2550 RC pupil places in the city. The figure of 2550 includes about 25% of pupils who are not catholic’s. However the RC admissions criteria in Salford give preference to Roman Catholic pupils.

Presentation

Background

• In autumn 2007 we consulted about proposals for the development of the

Roman Catholic High Schools across the city.

• Following the previous consultation, officers of the Local Authority met with the Bishop of Salford and representatives from the Roman Catholic

Diocese and agreed a proposal which involves all four Roman Catholic

High Schools.

• A further report was made to the Council’s Cabinet in October 2008 summarising a set of alternative linked proposals to reorganise the Roman

Catholic School estate for the Building Schools for the Future programme

(BSF).The City Council now wants to seek your views on an alternative proposal.

What are the proposals for RC high schools in Salford?

• The closure of St George’s Roman Catholic High School by 2012

• To enlarge St Ambrose Barlow Roman Catholic High School from 750 to

1050 pupils, by creating a new building on the former Wardley High School site by September 2012. Also to change the school’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth form by September 2011, before the new building opens.

•

To rebuild All Hallows Roman Catholic High School on part of the site currently occupied by Oasis Academy (ex Hope High School), at its existing site by September 2012.

• To rebuild St Patrick’s Roman Catholic High School on its existing site, at its existing size by September 2012.

Why is this proposal linked to the proposals for other RC high schools?

• The Roman Catholic sector proposals are linked financially and in respect of pupil numbers.

• Therefore if the decision to c lose St George’s Roman Catholic High School is not approved, all the Roman Catholic High School proposals will require revision.



Our aim is that every pupil attending St George’s in 2012 will be able to continue their education at a Roman Catholic school if they wish to do so.

We will work with the Headteachers and the Governing Bodies of St

Ambrose Barlow and St George’s and the RC Diocese to try to ensure that all those pupils who wish to, will be able to transfer to the new school in

2012.

What alter native places will be available if St George’s were to close?

• St Ambrose Barlow RC High School (completely rebuilt and increased in capacity by 300 places) or

• Walkden High School (completely rebuilt and increased in capacity by 300 places) or

•

Harrop Fold School.

Why not close both St Ambrose Barlow and St George’s and open a replacement school?

• St Ambrose Barlow RC High School has received funding to create a 6th form.

• If the proposal were to close both schools then the funding for the 6th form would be withdrawn by the government.

• This proposal, if approved, would create 3 new RC High Schools and one new Roman Catholic 6th form.

What is the proposed timescale?

• Public Consultation – from 10 November to 19 December 2008.

• Six weeks representation period for comments/objections – ends 19

December 2008.

• Report to Cabinet to consider outcome of consultation and authorisation to publish linked notice – 27 January 2008.

If Cabinet authorises the publication of the notice.

• Publication of a linked s tatutory notice to close St George’s Roman

Catholic High School and to enlarge St Ambrose Barlow Roman Catholic

High School from 750 to 1050 pupils, by creating a new building on the former Wardley High School site by September 2012. Also to change the sch ool’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth from by

September 2011, before the main new building opens.

• Six week representation period for comments/objections

– end of March

2009.

• The Local Authority decision maker will consider any comments and

•

The Bishop of Salford and the Governing Body of the school have the right to appeal the Local Authority’s decision to the Schools Adjudicator. objections received and determine the proposals within 2 months of the end of the representation period – May 2009.

Questions, Answers and Comments

Comment - As Roman Catholics we are in complete obedience to the RC faith; however this is a matter of looking after our schools. We are not here in the interest of the City Council or the Diocese but of the pupils and I think it is disgusting that you are considering turning Catholics and non Catholics against each other. This proposal will mean that you will have to turn away

Catholic and non Catholic pupils. It seems to me that if you are a wealthy catholic then you count but if you are a poor Catholic you don’t! We are here to stay, this is our school, we built it and we don’t want it taken away from us.

The Bishop gave assurances that he would not let another RC High School close. Does this mean he is now back tracking? We are here in this hall to say that we are not accepting the closure.

Reply - Cannon McBride - I am not in any way going to try and answer all the points, I am here to listen to your views. If I was your parish priest and was in your situation then I would feel exactly the same, however sometimes there are tough decisions that have to be made. I am trying to give you a point of view and let you know the type of things that have to be taken into consideration when making these type of decisions, but this does not mean that I am going against what you are saying.

I am the parish priest of both the Cathedral and St Joseph’s Primary Schools and those pupils have further to travel to the nearest RC High School. That’s not to say that this is a justi fication for the closure of St George’s but we only receive so much funding from the City Council and the Government and the

Bishop has to look at the whole RC population across the city. We don’t want to close schools, but sometimes tough decisions have to be made.

Q.

This school works well because it’s small. The teachers know all the pupils, parents and even grandparents and they know the area. Can the council tell me why they think that a school of 1050 pupils is transformational for the future?

A.

People have different views about the size of schools and your view is that a 600 place school is ideal. St Patricks is a 900 place school and St Ambrose

Barlow is a 750 place school. Both are very successful and I would suspect that they both think that t hey are good. The fact that St Patrick’s has received an outstanding OfSTED and the new proposed school will not be much larger shows that schools of different sizes are workable. However if your view is that 600 place schools are preferable then you should record this and submit your view as part of the consultation process.

Comment - I think we all take on board that reorganisation is not simple but we either all matter in the RC community or we don’t and this proposal shows that the pupils in the Walkde n and Little Hulton areas of the city don’t. It appears that the Diocese has done a deal with the City Council on this proposal and the Diocese has failed.

Comment -

We don’t want this school to close and don’t want the BSF money. You are unrealistic if you are expecting parents to have to pay for travel expenses, especially if parents have to pay for more than one child.

Comment I am a parent governor from St George’s and I want to make it clear that we are going to fight this proposal all the way and intend to appeal to the Adjudicator if necessary. St George’s is a successful and oversubscribed school and should not be closed.

Comment I don’t understand why you want to close St George’s as it is not a failing school. I helped put the labour government where it is now so why are the labour government not listening to us. The Little Hulton and Walkden areas are falling apart and you are taking away the one good thing that’s left.

Comment – I wish to direct this to Cannon McBride – There has never been a divide in the Little Hulton and Walkden community although this proposal is causing this and you are allowing this to happen.

Q.

I am a pupil at St George’s, have you actually asked the pupils what they want. This school is brilliant, I was off sick last week and actually missed going to school.

A . Yes, as part of the consultation process we will be consulting with the school’s student council.

Q . The City Council got it wrong with Harrop Fold and you are getting it wrong again. When Joseph Eastham and Little Hulton High schools closed to create

Harrop Fold, the City Council made lots of promises which were broken, the

City Council don’t know anything and can’t plan anything. The Little

Hulton/Walkden border ends at the bridge where you are proposing to locate the new school. It will take children at least 45 minutes to travel to the proposed new site and no children will be able to arrive at school for 9.00am.

We already have a desolate shopping centre in Little Hulton and now you are removing the main focus of the community; this school needs to remain.

Q

. I am a headteacher from one of St George’s associated primary schools. I have tried to look at this dispassionately but can’t. In order to even consider this proposal as a sensible option I would need a guarantee that every child in the current associated primary schools will be guaranteed a place. My school is already oversubscribed and currently has a waiting list for admissions. I have also recently been informed that Father Heakin baptised 70 children in the area.

A . As outlined earlier the governing body sets the admission criteria for a RC school and the Diocese works with schools to ensure that RC pupils have a place in a RC school if they so wish. My suggestion to the Diocese is that if there are to be 3 RC High schools then they need to look which schools will get priority. Consideration needs to be given to this and it would not be unreasonable to say that the closest schools to Little Hulton/Walkden could get priority. This is how we would deal with it in the community sector.

Q.

What about the non catholic pupils? They have supported the school; this proposal will remove parental choice. There are fewer faith schools so priority will be given to baptised RC pupils.

A . Jill Baker - As stated earlier it is the governing body of the school that sets the admission criteria.

Comment It is obvious from this proposal that not every child matters.

Where is my choice as a parent and the pupils? Lancashire Martyrs and St

Joseph’s closed and the land has been sold for houses. The management at

St George’s is second to none. The school has excellent SEN provision and as a parent with a child with autism and ADHD you will be taking this excellent provision away if St George’s closes.

Comment I think it is scandalous what you are doing with St Georges, the education is fantastic. Why is Councillor Warmisham not here, he is the one making the decision so he should be standing here. He has shut 3 RC feeder schools and replaced them with one school which is too small- can you not count?

Comment I left this school in May and this is a very personal issue to me.

Every year the school’s results are getting better, the school is like a family and therefore the condition of the building should not come into it. We would not be the people we are without St George’s and the City Council is just not listening to us. This is our second consultation and yet again our views are not being considered. Also a majority of pupils that attend St George’s walk to school, however the location of the new school will mean that pupils will have to be bussed in.

Q . My dad came here, I came here and this is the only school that I would consider sending my child to, who has been diagnosed with ADHD. The size of St Ge orge’s is right, however I think the increased size of St Ambrose

Barlow will make the school too big. What will happen to those pupils that need a small family atmosphere?

A.

I would say that parents whose children attend larger schools that are also successful would have the view that larger schools also work. You may not agree as your preference is for smaller schools, but that does not mean that larger schools are not successful. An example of this is St Patrick’s which is a

900 place school with an outstanding OfSTED report.

Comment - I think you have missed the point on what is being said about smaller schools. I have a daughter with SEN and I am only too aware that certain children have certain needs which means they cannot succeed in a larger school. Some children might just need a bit more attention and if you place these children in larger schools then they will not succeed. If St

Georges closes we will have to go out of the area, big schools are not just an option. Every child does matter and they have a right to be kept healthy, safe and cared for.

Q.

I have a son and daughter in primary school. In a debate like this there are always going to be facts and opinions, however all the comments made here tonight are facts. The school is successful etc. It is also a fact that the population is not declining and this proposal is about what suits the City

Council financially and not the pupils. Does the BSF programme require the sale of land in order to make it financially viable?

A.

In terms of the capital value of the land, there is a figure which was included when submitting the bid to central government. Any money raised from the sale of land will be put back into the BSF programme. The City

Council have already agreed to underwrite any shortfall from the sale of land.

Q.

Due to the current economic climate you may not get as much money as originally expected and it is likely that this economic downfall could last for another 12-18 months . How many sites are you talking about and at what value?

A . Stephen Bradbury - We have something like 12 sites and the value of these sites have been assessed by independent valuers. In the current economic climate receipts from sales of land will undoubtedly be depressed.

However the earliest that any land will be sold as part of the BSF programme will be 2012, which is 4 years from now. Therefore although we cannot say what the economic state will be by then what we can say is that the land would not be sold until it is appropriate. I do not have any figures to hand as to what the sale of land may raise, however this figure is in the public domain and we will forward these details to the school for you to view should you so request.

Comment - You keep referring to other RC schools but what works for one area of a community does not work for another.

Q.

As part of the Justice 4 Georges group we forwarded a letter for which we wanted a response, but all that was received was a standard acknowledgement stating that comments raised would be taken into consideration, However, this does not seem to be the case. There is no educational reason as to why you should close St George’s and in fact there are other schools that are not as good as St Georges but are not facing closure.

A.

It can be very difficult to answer letters as some of the issues that are raised are actual comments and personal points of view and it is not my job to argue with people’s points of view. We have never said that we are proposing to close St George’s because it is not a good school but what we have made clear is that we only have enough money to build 3 new RC High Schools.

BSF is not just about looking at schools at present but about looking into the future and creating schools for the 21 st century. Therefore it is not a question as to why we are closing but how we can make the best provision for the future.

Q.

I am an ex-pupil of St Georges and left in 1966. The City Council have been after this land since then and now you have finally come forward and confirmed this. All of a sudden after 10-15 years of planning you could not get

Harrop Fold open quickly enough. I have always voted Labour however I will not be voting you again. You are letting this community down and giving all the money to other areas of the city. I will not let you draw my son to a non-

Catholic school. Harrop Fold was a failing school and you managed to get a good headteacher to try and turn it around but when the current head leaves,

Harrop Fold will fail again. You ran the Harrop Fold School into the ground and you will run the new RC High School into the ground if we let you.

A. I take on board all your comments but I need to clear that I am not a politician.

Q.

Councillor Warmisham should be here. I feel sorry for you having to stand there and take the stick for the decisions that have been made by a Labour council.

A. My role as Strategic Director is to attend meetings of this nature and report the outcome back to Cabinet. This is how most Authorities work.

Q.

Is it fair to say that if St George’s closes then the sale of the land will go back into BSF to fund other school proposals?

A. Any monies generated from the sale of sites will be put into the whole BSF pot.

Q.

Without using the words “linked proposal”, can you explain why the funding allocated is re liant upon the closure of St George’s?

A. If the proposal to close St George’s did not go ahead then we would have 4 schools within the RC sector and the funding will only allow the build of 3 new schools.

Q.

But why have you picked St George’s as the school to close?

A. There are a number of reasons one of them being that we want the best geographical cover of schools across the city.

Comment St George’s pupils are a discreet population so why consider removing St George’s from the area.

Q.

I would like to address a couple of issues that you commented on tonight.

Firstly you flippantly said that St Patrick’s is a 900 place school and has good

SEN provision as does St Ambrose Barlow and also St George’s, however the proposed new school would mean extra SEN pupils. Does this mean that you will double the SEN funding allocation? I firmly believe that St George’s is the only place in Salford that will help these pupils succeed. There is nothing in the proposal about pastoral care for the SEN provision or about qualifying for travel and I don’t see why people should have their choice limited if St

George’s closes.

A. If you are talking about statemented children then the procedure is for the needs of the child to be assessed and funding is then based on those needs.

Similar criteria are followed when looking at children qualifying for transport.

Comment I am a year 8 pupil at St George’s and we get along very well with the staff and have a laugh. The school is updating the building and we have recently had new toilets, a new art room and a science lab. We are the best school in Salford and should not close.

Comment We have listened to what you have had to say, but please tell

Councillor Warmisham and Councillor Merry that they have a legal duty when making the decisions to take on board the views of the people. This proposal could end up going to the Adjudicator to make the decision or even judicial review. When making decisions members need to be aware that it is vital that they don’t dismiss the issues that are important. What I would say to Council is that they cannot understand the full situation by just reading a summary of the outcome of the consultation, they should be experiencing the feeling and views of the community, and in this case both RC and non RC parents have expressed their opinions on the proposal.

Chris Wells informed the group that the meeting had overrun and therefore suggested that we draw the meeting to an end. Chris handed back over to Jill so she could again reiterate the time scale for the statutory process.

Jill confirmed that consultation closes on 19 December 2008. All views received from the consultation, including minutes from the meetings will be fed back to Cabinet in January.

Jill thanked people for attending and informed them that anyone wishing to ask any further questions can do so by e-mailing Jill direct or by forwarding letters by post. Chris Wells thanked people again and also thanked the young people in attendance for their input.

Phil Harte thanked Jill and Cannon McBride for their time and reiterated that a parents drop-in meeting will take place on Tuesday 25 November at the school.

The meeting ended at 8.00pm.

Building Schools for the future consultation

St Georges RC School Council Meeting, Tuesday 9 December 2008,

10.30am

Children’s Services Representatives:

Bob McInytre Assistant Director, Resources

Paula Flynn Asset Planning Officer (minute taking)

Also in attendance were the School Council Representatives.

Bob thanked the group for attending and explained that the purpose of today’s meetings was to discuss the alternative proposal in respect of Roman

Catholic High Schools in the City as part of the building schools for the future programme.

The alternative proposal is as follows:

 To close St George’s Roman Catholic High School from September

2012.



To enlarge St Ambrose Barlow Roman Catholic High School from 750 to 1050 pupils, by creating a new building on the former Wardley High

School site from September 2012. Also to change the school’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth form by September 2011, before the main new building opens.



To rebuild All Hallows Roman Catholic High School on part of the site currently occupied by Oasis Academy (ex Hope High School), at its existing size from September 2012.

 To rebuild St Patrick’s Roman Catholic High School on its exiting site, at its existing size from September 2012.

Bob went onto explain to the group that it is the City Council’s Cabinet which is made up of elected members who makes the decision as to whether they wish to go ahead with this particular proposal. They will do this by taking into consideration the comments/concerns raised during the consultation meetings, including this meeting.

Q . Why are you building new schools for the other 3 RC High Schools but closing St Georges?

A.

The proposal is a joint proposal with the RC Diocese and the City Council.

The decision for the proposed closure of St Georges was based on various factors including the location of other RC High schools in the City and pupil numbers. It was decided that All Hallows should remain in the Pendleton area to serve pupils from the central part of the City, St Patricks would remain to serve the pupils from the Eccles/Irlam part of the City and St Ambrose to relocate to Wardley and increase the building capacity to accommodate pupils from the Swinton/Walkden and Little Hulton part of the City. In addition St

Ambrose Barlow had recently recived approval for the creation of a 6 th form and if the school closed then the funding would cease and the Diocese did not want this. Therefore based on pupil numbers and funding it was identified that there was only a requirement for 3 RC High schools in the City.

Q.

All the St Ambrose pupils will get a place at the new school and only 300 from St Georges, this is unfair.

A. All pupils currently attending St Georges will automatically get a place at St

Ambrose should St Georges close. From 2012 the governing body from St

Ambrose who will responsible for the admissions policy. They will also have to work with the Diocese regarding the realignment of parishes in order not to disadvantage those pupils that live in the Walkden and Little Hulton part of the

City.

Q.

What will happen to those pupils who are not successful in getting a place at St Ambrose?

A.

As stated previously current pupils will automatically receive a place.

Admission for new pupils from 2012 will have to be determined by St Ambrose governing body. There will be enough places within the RC secondary estate to ensure that all baptised RC pupils can attend if they wish and there will also be a further 450 places for those non baptised RC pupils who would also like to attend a RC school. We are also increasing the pupil capacity at Walkden

High school by a further 300 places and there will also be places available at

Harrop Fold.

Q.

Surely there are other schools across the City whose buildings are in better condition than St Georges but you agreeing to build them a new school. Why are you only closing St Georges?

A.

As outlined earlier factors such as projected pupil numbers and the location of the other schools play a factor and we have to look at the City as a whole and not individual areas or schools. We are also proposing to close The

Swinton High and Moorside High which are both schools in the community sector.

Q . Why has the City Council sold the school playing fields to a local farmer for his sheep to graze on?

A . The City Council has not sold the playing fields. They still belong to the school and in fact the school still receives a repair and maintenance budget for the ongoing maintenance of the field.

Q.

Why lose St Georges when we are one in the top five schools for GCSE’s results? Harrop Fold’s results are poor why did you build them a new school?

A.

The City Council has never said that St Georges is a failing school. Harrop

Fold is not part of the BSF programme and approval for the building of Harrop

Fold was given well before the introduction of BSF.

Q.

There are 4 RC High schools, why close St Georges?

A.

As outlined previously the proposal to close St Georges is based on location of other schools and pupil numbers.

Q.

What about those pupils that currently walk to school, they won’t be able to if they have to travel to Wardley?

A.

I accept that we need to explore issues surrounding transport. It will also be necessary as part of the planning process to have a travel plan in place.

Q.

Has it been noted that St Georges have done various things to keep the school open .i.e. marches, petitions letters etc.

A.

Yes, the City Council are fully aware of the measures taken by the school, pupils and community objecting to the closure. During the consultation process officers form the City Council have met with parents, staff, governing bodies, members of the community and pupils and have documented all views and issues raised. All these issues alongside any further letters/record of views forms recived will be summarised and submitted to Cabinet in

January. On a personal note you may wish to contact Councillor Merry

(Leader of City Council) ,Councillor Warmisham (Lead Member of Children’s

Services) or your local Ward Councillor and raise your objections to the proposal.

Q.

One of your points for the proposed closure is that nearly half of the pupils attending St Georges are non baptised Roman Catholics. Why should this make a difference?

A.

One of the admissions criteria for RC schools are pupils must be baptised

Roman Catholics, therefore if St Georges was already full to capacity with baptised RC pupils ,then those non baptised RC pupils would not get a place at St Georges.

Q.

There are loads of year 6 pupils who want to go to St Georges and but now they will have to go to a rubbish school.

A.

Just to reiterate again, pupils can continue to be admitted in the school until 2012. There are also some very good and successful schools in the City.

Comment - St Georges has a good reputation, Harrop Fold does not. We have a good football team and choir and I think it’s unfair that St Georges is being considered for closure.

Comment - Parents, pupils, staff and community think St Georges is a good school.

Q.

Will all the things we are doing to stop the school from closing make a difference or will the school still close?

A.

The decision on whether the school closes will be determined by Cabinet.

It is important that any views, comments and objections you have regarding the proposal are submitted as part of the consultation process.

Q.

Do you want St Georges to close?

A.

I can’t answer that and it’s not my job to give any personal views. My purpose here today and during all the other consultation meetings undertaken is to ensure that your views on the proposal are fed back to Cabinet.

Q.

Part of the proposal is to rebuild St Ambrose on a greenbelt site; the City

Council might not get permission to proceed?

A . That is true, although permission can be granted to build on a green belt site. The City Council will need to demonstrate to the planning bodies responsible that there is no other suitable or alternative land available.

Q.

I can’t understand why the City Council want to go ahead with the closure; we should be able to have our say. We are not being listened too.

A.

The whole purpose of consultation is so that people can have their say and put forward their views/comments etc. Equally if you feel that you are not being heard then you may wish to write to Councillor Merry (Leader of the

Council), Councillor Warmisham (Lead Member of Children’s Services) or your Local Ward Councillor.

Bob thanked the students for attending and reiterated that all issues raised at today’s meeting has been documented and will be relayed back to cabinet.

The meeting ended at 11.05pm



9.30am.


Bob McIntyre Assistant Director, Resources






 To close St George’s Roman catholic High School from September

2012.




Sch ool site from September 2012. Also to change the school’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth form by September 2011, before the main new building opens.





Bob went onto explain to the group that it is the City Coun cil’s Cabinet which is made up of elected members who makes the decision as to whether they go ahead with this particular proposal. They will do this by taking into consideration the comments/concerns raised during the consultation meetings, including this meeting.

Q.

If St Georges closes where will the rest of pupils go if the new St Ambrose

Barlow is only being increased by an extra 300 places?

A.

There is a current proposal to increase the pupil capacity at Walkden High by a further 300 places, there will also be places available in Harrop Fold. In terms of those pupils wishing to attend a RC High school, there will enough places within the Roman Catholic sector to accommodate all baptised RC pupils. There will also included a further 400+ places within the RC sector for those non baptised RC pupils who may wish to attend a RC High school.

Q.

But Walkden and Harrop Fold are not Roman Catholic schools.

A.

As stated in previous response, in terms of numbers there will be enough capacity in the RC Sector to accommodate those baptised RC pupils to attend a RC High school. There will be 2550 places within RC High school estate which includes 25% for those non baptised RC pupils who wish to attend a RC faith school.

Q.

Would it not be easier just to leave St Georges as it is and just build the other schools?

A.

The City Council has already explored this option, however based on pupil projections keeping all 4 schools would result in surplus places. BSF is not only about transforming education, but also about the removal of surplus places.

Q.

Why is St Georges the only school being closed?

A.

St Georges is the only school in the RC sector which is proposed for closure, however in the community sector there is a proposal to close both

Moorside and Swinton High Schools and replace with them a 1350 place school.

Q.

Why does the City Council not recognise that St Georges is a good school?

A.

The City Council does recognise that St Georges is a good school and it has never been said that the proposal to close St Georges is because the school is not good. As stated earlier the proposal to close St Georges is based on the number of RC places required throughout the City and also the location of the other RC High schools within the City.

Q.

Why is not possible to keep the St Georges building open and undertake a refurbishment?

A.

The costs for this would be very high and it would also be disruptive for existing pupils. In addition the amounts of money we have available for the

RC sector will only allow the building of 3 new schools and as stated previously we would have too many surplus places.

Q.

Why change any schools?

A.

The BSF programme has been developed and driven by central government. Council’s have been given money through BSF to transform education by either undertaking refurbishments or new builds and in addition to this, the removal of surplus places. There are 17 waves of BSF and Salford is in wave 3 which we are happy about because those Council’s in the later years will have to wait many years.

Q.

What do you aim to get out of BSF?

A.

As stated earlier BSF is about transforming education and Salford’s proposals will mean that all secondary schools will have new buildings.

Q.

Why can’t the City Council use the money to refurbish St Georges, you did this with Harrop Fold.

A.

The funding for Harrop Fold was not part of BSF and was decided many years ago. In addition, as stated earlier there is only a need for 3 RC High schools.

Q.

You made a mistake about the size of Harrop Fold so now you are closing

St Georges to fill up Harrop Fold.

A.

No, this is not the case.

Q.

St Georges is a successful school; why not make the school bigger?

A.

Based on pupil numbers we only need 3 schools.

Q.

St Georges is a good school and we are not getting anything out of this proposal?

A.

We accept that St Georges is a good school but the City Council has to make tough decisions and 4 RC High schools is too many based on the actual number of RC pupils in the City.

Q.

Why did you build a school for Harrop Fold when its exam results are lower than ours?

A.

As stated earlier the Harrop Fold build is not part of the BSF programme.

Q.

If you closed St Georges it would be harder to get to school?

A.

That depends on where you live, however as part of the planning process the City Council is required to look at how pupils will be able to get to school.

It will be necessary for the City Council to raise these issues with Greater

Manchester Transport (GMT) and if necessary create new bus route(s)

Q.

Surely that could prove expensive

A.

Potentially yes, but if it is something that is required then GMT will have to fund this.

Q .

If the congestion charges are introduced bus fares will increase.

A . The congestion charge would be charged to motorists and not people travelling on public transport, therefore there should be no increase in fares.

Q.

Harrop Fold does not have a good reputation, people will travel further to educate their children which will mean additional travelling costs.

A.

That will depend on the reputation of Harrop Fold in 4 years times and also on parental preference.

Q.

Why did the City Council sell St Georges playing fields to a local farmer to use for grazing of his sheep.

A . The City Council has not sold the playing fields. They still belong to the school and in fact the school still receives a repair and maintenance budget for the ongoing maintenance of the field.

Q.

If St Georges closes what will happen to the school building?

A.

In time the plan would be to demolish the building and sell the site.

Q.

Do you want to see a decline in Catholicism in this area?

A.

That’s not a question I can answer, Whatever faith a person follows will be their own preference/decision and nothing to do with this proposal.

Q.

Why are you closing St Georges, our school is oversubscribed and Harrop

Fold is half empty.

A.

As stated earlier future projections show that we only require 3 RC High schools.

Q . The City Council have said that this year 7 intake will be the last.

A.

This is not the case and the City Council have never stated this. Pupils will continue to be admitted to the school until 2012, when it is proposed for closure. In terms of admissions into St Ambrose Barlow, it will be the responsibility of the governing body to set the admissions criteria.

Q.

Walkden High was recently refused planning permission to build on the

Warldey site as its classed as greenbelt, so how can the City Council build a school there?

A . I am not aware of any details about Walkden High being refused planning permission. The land is classed as green belt, but that does not mean that you cannot build on it. The City Council for example would have to prove that there is no other suitable land available.

Q.

We have done marches, petitions and wrote letters objecting to the closure, what else can we do to keep the school open?

A . Consultation is a vital part of the statutory process. We have met with parents, staff, governing body and members of the public and now we are meeting with pupils. The purpose of all these meetings is to document the

views of people and report back to cabinet and this includes the meetings held with yourselves today.

Q

. Why can’t we just vote on whether the school closes?

A . The decision on the proposal will be decided by Cabinet who is made up of elected members. All elected members are people who have been voted into to Cabinet by the residents of Salford.

Q . You state that St Georges will close in 2012; this would be disruptive to those pupils who will be in their final year.

A . This is something that City Council will need to look at. In previous cases where we have closed schools, year 11 pupils have remained on the old site, whilst the other students have located to the new school. This might be something that is considered if the proposal to close St Georges goes ahead.

Q.

If St Georges closes then pupils will be forced to go to other schools and we will be split up from their friends.

A . All existing pupils will remain at St Georges until 2012. As from 2012 the governing body of St Ambrose Barlow will decide on the admissions criteria of the school.

Q.

Why have you chosen St Georges out of all 4 RC High Schools?

A.

As stated earlier the location of the other schools in the city had to be taken into consideration. It was decided that All Hallows should remain in the

Pendleton area to serve pupils from the central part of the City; St Patricks would remain to serve the pupils from the Eccles/Irlam part of the City and St

Ambrose to relocate to Wardley to accommodate pupils from the

Swinton/Walkden and Little Hulton part of the City. The reason as to why the

Diocese made the decision to keep St Ambrose Barlow open was based on the act that they had recently recived approval for the creation of a 6 th form. If the decision to close St Ambrose was taken then the funding for the 6 th form would cease and the Diocese did not want this.

Q.

The Council decision to close St Georges is not what the community want.

A.

It is elected members who will make the decision and as stated earlier all views and comments received during consultation will be gathered and fed back to elected members. Equally you may want to contact either Councillor

Merry (Leader of the City Council) or Councillor Warmisham (Lead Member of

Children Services) or in fact any of your local ward councillors to raise your comments/objections to the proposal.

Bob thanked the students for attending and reiterated that all issues raised at today’s meeting have been documented and will be reported to Cabinet in

January. The meeting ended at 10.00pm



10.00am


Bob McIntyre Assistant Director, Resources






 To close St George’s Roman catholic High School from September

2012.




School site from September 2012. Also to change the school’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth form by September 2011, before the main new building opens.





Bob went onto explain to the group that it is the City Council’s Cabinet which is made up of elected members who makes the decision as to whether they wish to go ahead with this particular proposal. They will do this by taking into consideration the comments/concerns raised during the consultation meetings, including this meeting.

Q.

Why is the proposal just for the closure of St Georges?

A.

It was decided that All Hallows should remain in the Pendleton area to serve pupils from the central part of the City; St Patricks would remain to serve the pupils from the Eccles/Irlam part of the City and St Ambrose to relocate to Wardley to accommodate pupils from the Swinton/Walkden and

Little Hulton part of the City. The reason as to why the Diocese made the decision to keep St Ambrose Barlow open was based on the act that they had recently recived approval for the creation of a 6 th form and if the school closed then the funding would cease and the Diocese did not want this. In addition

both The Swinton and Moorside High school will close within the community sector.

Q . If St Ambrose Barlow is only being increased by 300 pupils where are you expecting the other 300 pupils to go?

A.

All pupils currently in this school will finish their education at the new school. From 2012, which is the year proposed for the closure of St Georges, there will be fewer pupils admitted in into year 7. It will be the governing body of St Ambrose Barlow who will be responsible for the admission criteria and I would presume that the Diocese will also have to look at realigning parishes.

Q.

The previous school on the Wardley site sunk due to subsidence, how will you get planning to build on the land.

A.

We have been assured by the experts that necessary measures can be put in place to address any subsidence issues.

Q.

What will happen to the 300 pupils from St Georges that won’t get a place at St Ambrose?

A . There will be sufficient places across the RC sector for those pupils who wish to attend a RC school. In addition we are also increasing the pupil capacity at Walkden High by an extra 300 places and projections are show that there will be places available at Harrop Fold High school.

Q.

Why can’t the City Council just leave the 4 RC High schools as they are or build new schools for all 4?

A . There is not enough pupils to fill all 4 schools and the funding only allows for the build of 3 new high schools.

Q.

St Georges is oversubscribed yet Harrop Fold is only half full, why did you build a new school for Harrop Fold?

A.

Harrop Fold is not part of the BSF programme and was approved well in advance of BSF being introduced. Under BSF we have to look at both transforming education and demonstrate the removal surplus places. As explained earlier, across the RC sector, St Georges is the proposed for closure and in the community sector we are proposing the closure of both The

Swinton and Moorside High Schools. However even with the closure of these schools there will still be a small surplus across the city to ensure parental choice.

Q.

But we still don’t understand why you have chosen to close an oversubscribed school.

A.

As stated earlier the proposal is based on pupil numbers and the locality of other schools in the area. It will be elected members who will make the final decision and one of the things they will consider will be the findings from the

consultation undertaken. Therefore you may want to consider forwarding a letter outlining your concerns/objections to Councillor Merry (Leader of the

Council), Councillor Warmisham (Lead Member of Children’s Services) or one of your local Ward Councillors.

Q.

But why close St Georges, you are affecting the pupils from the Little

Hulton and Walkden areas?

A.

To reiterate, we have to look at the whole area and the whole secondary estate not just individual areas or schools. The proposal for the closure of St

Georges has been based on the location of the other RC High schools across the City and the fact that St Ambrose Barlow has been awarded funding for a

6th form.

Q.

How much money is Harrop Fold losing due to the fact that the school is only half full?

A.

School budgets are based on the number of pupils at the school, therefore the school will only receive a budget based on the number of pupils that actually attend. This is the case for all schools.

Q.

Why close a successful school, exam results will start to suffer.

A.

You are a successful school but there are also other successful schools across the City.

Q.

Why should we be forced to travel out of the area to attend a RC school when there is a suitable and successful RC school already in the community?

A.

As stated earlier there is only a need based on pupil numbers for 3 RC

High schools and we have to look at the location of the other schools in the

City.

Q.

Are you against bullying? you are bullying St Georges to close which is a small school.

A.

I am against bullying but I don’t think the City Council or the Diocese is bullying St Georges. The decision on the closure will be made by elected members, who have been voted in by people who live in the City, including probably some of your parents.

Q.

If pupils from St Georges have to go to Harrop Fold then Harrop will get more money and this is what the City Council want.

A.

As explained earlier schools budgets are based on the number of pupils who attend so the more pupils admitted, the more budget schools receive. We have never said that pupils from St Georges will have to attend Harrop Fold if

St Georges closes. There will be enough places across the secondary RC estate to accommodate those RC pupils that wish to attend a RC High

School. There will also be a further 25% places available in the RC sector to

accommodate those non RC baptised pupils should they wish to attend a RC school. Also as outlined earlier we are increasing pupil numbers by a further

300 places at Walkden High School.

Q.

Those pupils who will be in their final year when St Georges closes will be affected and the disruption could affect their exam results.

A . The closure of Windsor High school meant that pupils would relocate to either the former Hope High School or Bulie Hill High. However to ensure as little disruption to those pupils sitting their GCSE’s remained at Windsor High for their final year. This is something therefore that might be considered if the closure of St Georges was agreed.

Q.

We don’t feel that our views are being taken into consideration. We have had forwarded letters and petitions and even did a march, yet still the proposal is for the closure of the school.

A.

All views recived during the consultation process are taken into consideration and I personally feel that the opinion of the young people is extremely vital as you are the people that will be affected. I can assure you that all comments/views/objections etc gathered during the consultation process will be fed back to Cabinet.

Q.

If St Georges closes then people might decide not to send their children to any other school?

A.

There are laws in place with regards to children having to attend school.

However if you feel that this is something that should be considered then I would suggest then that you raise as an objection and alert Councillors to this.

As stated earlier all issues raised during the consultation period are being reported to Cabinet.

Q.

Why can’t people vote on whether the school closes?

A.

If you spoke with elected members they might say that anyone over 18 years old has the power to vote. In addition those elected members who sit on cabinet have been voted in.

Q.

One of the reasons why you state that St Georges is not suitable is because it has no playing field; however the City Council sold the playing fields to a farmer who uses it for the grazing of his sheep.

A.

The City Council has not sold the playing fields. They still belong to the school and in fact the school still receives a repair and maintenance budget for the ongoing maintenance of the field. Not sure as to why field is being used for grazing.

Bob thanked the students for attending and reiterated that all issues raised at today’s meeting has been documented and will be relayed back to cabinet.

The meeting ended at 10.30pm.

Part One open to the Public

ITEM NO A2

REPORT OF THE STRATEGIC DIRECTOR FOR CHILDREN’S

SERVICES

TO CABINET ON 27 th January 2009

TITLE: PROPOSALS FOR THE REORGANISATION OF ROMAN CATHOLIC

HIGH SCHOOLS WITHIN THE BUILDING SCHOOLS FOR THE

FUTURE PROGRAMME

RECOMMENDATIONS:

Cabinet are recommended

(1) To consider the responses to the consultation process.

(2)

(3)

To determine if they wish to proceed with the proposals for

RC High school reorganisation.

To agree the publication of Statutory notices

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY:

The report outlines the responses to the consultation in respect of the proposals:

 To close St George’s RC High School by September 2012



To enlarge St Ambrose Barlow RC High School from 750 to

1050 pupil capacity, by constructing a replacement building on the former Wardley High School site by September 2012, also changing the school’s upper age limit to add a 250 place sixth form by September 2011.



To rebuild All Hallows RC High School on the lower part of the site currently occupied by Oasis Academy, at its existing size, by September 2012

 To rebuild St Patrick’s RC High School on its existing site, at its existing size, by September 2012.

The report suggests that the pupil numbers for each of the Roman Catholic

High Schools should remain as outlined in the previous report to Cabinet but that regard should be paid to the need for possible future expansion in respect of All Hallows Roman Catholic High School.

BACKGROUND DOCUMENTS:

(Available for public inspection)

Salford BSF Documents are available on www.salford.gov.uk/learning/bsf/bsfdocuments.htm

Responses to the consultation proposals

Minutes of consultation meetings

ASSESSMENT OF RISK:

Building Schools for the Future is a key Council risk. A master risk register and several sub risk registers have been compiled for the programme. These are included within the OBC and are updated on a regular basis by the Building Schools for the Future delivery team.

SOURCE OF FUNDING:

Funding for the Roman Catholic High School proposals is included within the overall resources identified for the BSF programme agreed by Cabinet on the

27 February 2007 and approved by Partnership for Schools and the Treasury at the end of June 2007.

COMMENTS OF THE STRATEGIC DIRECTOR OF CUSTOMER AND SUPPORT

SERVICES (or his representative):

1. LEGAL IMPLICATIONS :

Developed with Customer & Support Services

– Law & Administration

Section input and with input from Addleshaw Goddard, external legal advisers to the BSF programme.

2. FINANCIAL IMPLICATIONS Provided by : Chris

Mee

Developed with Customer & Support Services

– PFI accountant input and with input from Ernst & Young, external financial advisers to the BSF programme.

CONTACT OFFICER: Robert McIntyre

– Assistant Director Children’s Services

0161 778 0196

WARD(S) TO WHICH REPORT RELATE(S):

All

KEY COUNCIL POLICIES: Every Child Matters, Community Plan, Green Space

Strategy and Unitary Development Plan.

DETAILS

1. Background

At the Cabinet meeting on 28 th October 2008 Cabinet approved in principle the following proposals:

(1) To close St George’s RC High School by September 2012.

(2) To enlarge St Ambrose Barlow RC High School from 750 to

1050 pupil capacity, by constructing a replacement building on the former Wardley High School site by September 2012, also changing the school’s upper age limit to add a 250 place sixth form by September 2011.

(3)

To rebuild, rather than refurbish, St Patrick’s RC High School on its existing site, at its existing size, by September 2012.

(4) To rebuild All Hallows RC High School on the lower part of the site currently occupied by Oasis Academy (ex Hope High

School), at its existing size, by September 2012.

Cabinet also approved the formal six week consultation process which ran from 10 th November to the 19 th December 2008

2. Consultation process

2.1 Letters explaining the proposals and the consultation process were sent to all parents/carers of pupils, staff and governors of all R.C. high schools and associated primaries, together with details of how they could take part in the consultation process and make their views known.

2.2 At its meeting on the 28 th October 2008 the Cabinet approved that the consultation meetings for individual schools would be agreed with the respective Headteachers. Following discussions with Headteachers the following timetable of consultation meetings was agreed:



November 11 th meetings with the staff, governing body and drop in session for parents of St Ambrose Barlow RC High School.



November 12 th meetings with staff and governing body of All Hallows

RC High School.



November 20 th meetings with staff, governing body and public meeting with parents of St George’s RC High School.



November 25 th Drop in session for parents of St George’s RC High

School.



November 26 th Community drop in session for parents/ members of the community in respect of all four schools



December 12 th meetings with pupils at St George’s RC High School.



December 15 th meeting with pupils at St Ambrose Barlow RC High

School.

2.3

The Headteacher of St Patrick’s RC High School did not feel it necessary to hold any meetings, but letters were sent to parents, staff and the

Governing Body of the school informing them of the proposal and inviting them to the community drop-in if they wished. Pupil consultation was carried out by the school; the directorate are still awaiting notes from the meeting.

2.4 The Headteacher of All Hallows RC High School did not feel it was necessary to hold parents meeting, although all parents were sent copies of the Question and Answer document and were informed of the community drop-in event. All Hallows RC High School undertook their own pupil consultation.

2.5 Cabinet may wish to be reassured that with the exception of the pupil consultations at St Patrick’s and All Hallows all consultation activities were minuted by officers of the council and are available for public inspection.

3 Responses to the consultation

3.1 Following the consultation process, officers have collated the responses received in respect of the proposals. The majority of the responses related to the closure of St George’s, with 417 individual responses being received, plus letters from the Head teacher and the trade union. As mentioned above, discussions were also held with the pupils from St

George’s and a 550 signature petition opposed to the closure was received from the pupils. In addition a signature petition was received from the parents and friends of St. George’s. The main issues raised in the responses are summarised below:

 All St. George’s respondees do not want St George’s to close.

The school is regarded as a good school with good exam results and is oversubscribed.



174 respondents were concerned about the travel impact of having to go to the new St Ambrose Barlow on the former

Wardley High School site. This included concerns about the lack of sufficient bus services and the additional financial impact on families.



Some felt that the local authority wants to restrict access to

Roman Catholic schools to Roman Catholic families only. The new St Ambrose Barlow will not have sufficient places for all the children who currently attend both schools.



The new St Ambrose Barlow school will be too large. St

George’s is a small caring community school with very little bullying. There is strong leadership, good caring teaching, strong faith and good discipline at the school; with excellent

Special Educational Needs provision.



These proposals are seen as removing parental preference and choice and that children at St George’s matter less.



The BSF money should be distributed more fairly and St

George’s should be offered its share and included in the programme.

St George’s has invested in its existing building and many improvements have been made.

 The pupils enjoy their education at St George’s and do not want the school to close. The school recognises the full potential of pupils and helps them to achieve it.



The impact of the proposals could be detrimental to staff with staff losing jobs and pupils being disrupted especially in key stage 4. There was a feeling that staff at St George’s were being discriminated against.

3.2 A more limited number of responses have been received from St

Ambrose Barlow RC High School with 34 respondents supporting the proposal and 14 expressing issues of concern about the proposal.

The main issues raised are summarised below:



Concern about the additional travel time, distance and cost of the proposed relocation to the Wardley site.



Concern about the upheaval caused by the new school being built, its enlargement and the influx of pupils from St George’s, which could all impact educational standards.



Opposition to the proposed increase in the size of St Ambrose

Barlow, with some respondents preferring a smaller school.



Questions regarding the admission process for the new school.

3.3 A letter of response has been received from the Headteacher and Chair of Governors of All Hallow’s RC High School which, whilst it supports the rebuilding of the school on the current Oasis site, argues that the school is currently oversubscribed and that the proposed housing redevelopment in the area will increase demand for places in the school.

The letter argues that as a result of this demand the new school should have a capacity for 750 pupils rather than the 600 as planned.

3.4 A letter of support has been received from the Head teacher of St

Patrick’s RC High School which raises some concerns about the practicalities of building a new school whilst pupils are in the existing building.

3.5 A more detailed analysis of all the responses is attached at Appendix 1.

4 Comments regarding the Consultation Response

The Local Authority has considered the responses to gauge to what extent objectives can be met in relation to the RC High School reorganistion and at the same time respond to concerns raised by consultees.



It is accepted that all the RC high schools in Salford are regarded as good or better by Ofsted but the BSF proposals are about transforming education not maintaining the existing buildings. Based on existing pupil numbers within the RC primary sector there will not be sufficient RC pupils in future to require four high schools. These proposals would provide 2550 places which allows for an estimated 20%-25% noncatholic pupils across the three schools. In consultation with the RC

Diocese it was agreed that a catholic estate of three high schools would be best served by one school in the inner city, one in the Eccles area and one for Swinton/Worsley/Little Hulton.



There will continue to be a choice of high schools within the RC sector and also in the Worsley/Walkden/Little Hulton area. For example the enlargement of Walkden High school is part of the provision of greater choice and diversity of schools across the City.



The proposed new St Ambrose Barlow RC High School will be situated on existing bus routes. Salford City Council will consider how best to support pupils currently attending St.

George’s and St. Ambrose Barlow for whom the distance between home and the new St Ambrose Barlow is greater than the distance between home and the current school sites.

Further detailed work will be undertaken on this and the directorate is considering the introduction of free travel passes where appropriate. The

Local Authority are also developing a travel plan which will include a range of practical measures to increase the number of staff and pupils who walk, cycle or use public transport to get to school.



It will be necessary to discuss with the governors of St Ambrose Barlow and the RC Diocese how the admissions arrangements for the new school will work. Both the RC Diocese and the City Council are committed to ensuring that pupils attending St. Georg e’s RC High School when it closes will be guaranteed a place in the new St Ambrose Barlow

RC High School. Further work will need to be undertaken to ensure that the education of pupils at both schools is not disrupted during the period of change.



It is anticipated, based on current and projected pupil numbers, that there will be sufficient places within Salford high schools to accommodate population increases from redevelopments. If a decision were taken to increase the size of all Hallows by 150 places, a similar number of places would need to be removed from another school under the BSF proposals.



The Local Authority has experience of building new high schools (Buile

Hill High and Harrop Fold School) on the playing fields of existing schools whilst the pupils are in their existing school. Whilst this process can cause some problems they can be managed safely.

 The Local Authority will provide St George’s and St Ambrose Barlow

High Schools with additional support during the transitional period, with pupi ls’ needs firmly at the heart of any arrangements.

5 Statutory Process and Timescale

Process Timescale

1. Report to Cabinet to consider outcome of consultation and authorisation to publish notices

2. Cabinet decision and call in.

Cabinet Briefing

Cabinet Meeting

4 February 2009

– 13 January 2009

– 27 January 2009

3. Publication of statutory notices for closure of St George’s and enlargement of St Ambrose

Barlow.

12 February 2009

4. 6 week representation period ends 27 March 2009

By 27 May 2009 5. The LA is the decision maker and will consider any objections and comments received and will determine the proposal within 2 months of the end of the representation period.

6. The RC and CE Diocese, the LSC and school governing body have the right to appeal t he LA’s decision to school’s adjudicator

(within 4 weeks).

26 June 2009

7. In the case of appeal, the LA sends proposals, comments and objections received plus details of

‘related’ proposals to the school adjudicator (within 1 week).

3 July 2009

8. School Adjudicator decision on proposals.

6. Conclusion

By end of August 2009

During the consultation process there was a general view (other than from St.

Georges respondents) that the revised proposals outlined above were an improvement on previous proposals and that they would provide good secondary schools for Salford’s Roman Catholic community in the future.

Cabinet now needs to determine if it wishes to approve the publication of the linked public notice to close St George’s RC High School and enlarge St

Ambrose Barlow RC High School to 1050 on the Wardley site.

Summary of Responses from Record of Views, Letters, E-mails and

Petitions

All Hallows RC

Total Number of Responses

The following response was submitted by the Headteacher of All

Hallows RC High School:

On behalf of the staff at All Hallows, I write in response to the most recent BSF consultation. Firstly, I want to say that we are delighted that the new proposals offer us a new build on a site near the existing school. We also appreciate that you have listened to our views on our preference for the location of the new building to be in this area.

However, I also wish to state that we want for our children the same basic standards, facilities and space as all the other children in

Salford. We feel it is vital that the rebuilding of All Hallows caters for the needs of all students both now and in the future.

Regarding pupil numbers:

We want a school to accommodate 750 pupils as specified in the original proposal which also specified a 900 place school for St

Ambrose Barlow and the closure of St George’s. For some reason

150 places have been removed from All Hallows and added to St

Ambrose Barlow in the new proposal. All Hallows is already oversubscribed from the current standard number of 120.

Moreover, the factors which will influence the future size of All Hallows are as follows:



The natural growth in numbers is based on the greatly improved perception of the school. The fact that the school is rated

‘ outstanding’ by Ofsted is an important factor as is the school’s consistently improving results .



As St Ambrose Barlow RCHS is moving further away from this side of the city, pupils from our seven partner primary schools, presently travelling to St Ambrose Barlow, may decide to attend All Hallows.



All Hallows will gain

‘high performing’ specialist school’s status in January 2009 and will acquire a second specialism which we hope will be in sport or sport related. This, together with its current

Business and Enterprise specialism, will be attractive to both students and parents.

 The closure of St George’s RC High School will bring a ‘knock on’ effect to the Catholic sector leading to increased applications to All

Hallows from Catholic primary pupils in the vicinity.

 When ‘Salford Reds’ move to the new stadium and All Hallows

3

moves to the current Hope High School site, the area of Weaste

Lane will be developed for housing bringing more families into the area and potentially providing more students for All Hallows in the future (providing this is the whole of the Hope High site).



The Diocese has specifically stated that 750 is the best number for All Hallows.



DCSF recommends that schools should be built to accommodate 750 pupils .

Regarding the Locality Support Unit:

As there is no intention for there to be a Catholic Locality Support

Unit, the staff at All Hallows do not wish to have a Locality Support

Unit either on their premises or on their site.

A response was received from the Chair of Governors at All

Hallows RC High School which echoed the Headteachers view.

The following response was submitted by Emma Worsley

(Connexions):

A request for Careers Education Guidance (CEG) provision at the new school to include a classroom, library and area for confidential meetings.

St Ambrose Barlow RC High School


Support for the Proposal

46

34

The following response was received from the Headteacher of St

Ambrose Barlow RC High School:

Revised Proposals under BSF

I am writing to confirm that I fully support the revised proposals for the

Catholic sector in Salford as outlined in the consultation meeting on 11

November 2008 and believe this will be in the best interests of Catholic education in this Authority.

In particular, I support the relocation of St Ambrose Barlow to the Wardley site.

1) Objection to St Ambrose Barlow being rebuilt on the

Wardley site due to access issues.

2) Objection to St Ambrose Barlow being rebuilt on the

Number of

Comments

2

3

Wardley site due to proximity of high voltage cables/green belt land/motorway/saturated ground

3) There are many sites more suitable for the new school.

4) Concerns regarding travel, increased travel times, health and safety of pupils, financial impact on families and impact on length of pupil day.

5) The feeling that

St George’s RC

is a good school and serves the local community well and should not be closed.

6) The feeling that St Ambrose RC should remain on and be developed on its current site.

7) Would a reliable school bus service be provided?

8) Opposition to the school numbers being increased to

1050

– preference for small school, less bullying, pupils and teachers know each other.

9) Children with special needs would be lost in the system at a large school.

10) Concerns regarding the upheaval to education caused by the school being rebuilt/merged with St George’s and the fact that the new school may not attain the same educational standards as St Ambrose Barlow currently has.

11) Concerns that children attending St Mark’s RC Primary

School may not get a place at the new school

12) Concerns regarding the admissions criteria for children attending St Luke’s RC Primary School.

13) Are children that live out of the LA area but attend a linked school (St Charles’ RC) to be guaranteed a place at the new school?

14) What are the admissions criteria for the new school?

15) Concerns that the funds already spent on improvements to the existing building are now wasted.

16) Concerns regarding transitional arrangements for pupils, future staffing and ensuring the performance of St

Ambrose Barlow.

17) Concerns regarding the decision making process for the

RC proposals.

18) Are the processes on target to achieve the September

2012 opening?

19) Would the new larger school be able to achieve a wider curriculum?

20) What is the travel expense policy for relocating the new school?

21) The Diocese should consider reorganising associated primary schools.

22) A request that the new school will have a Careers

Education and Guidance (CEG) area to include a classroom, library and area for confidential meetings.

23) Support for the proposal relating to the sixth form for St

Ambrose Barlow.

1

5

2

4

4

1

5

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

1

St George’s RC High School


Parents and friends of St George’s petition

Pupil petition

417

278 signatures

550 signatures

The following response was submitted by the Headteacher of St

George’s RC High School:

Re: Closure of St George’s

I again wish to object most strongly to the current proposals to close St

George’s RC High School. Quite simply, this school is successful, popular and serves its local community well. The Government has stated many times that ‘good’ schools should be encouraged and built upon and not destroyed.

From the very beginning of the BSF programme this school has faced sustained pressure for its closure and a variety of reasons has been given for its closure and yet there is no consistent Educational reason for the closure of this school.

There have been very obvious attempts to isolate this school from the rest of the schools in the BSF programme, for example it was stated quite clearly that unless St George’s closes the whole BSF programme would close. It was also stated that there could be no alterations to the BSF programme and now more recently, the fate of all the other Catholic High Schools is dependent upon the closure of St George’s.

I cannot believe that it was so essential for St George’s and only St George’s to close. What was the overriding imperative for this school to close? Public opinion believes that an earlier decision to build a larger school in the area which is currently well undersubscribed has meant that actions need to be taken to attempt to fill that school. Indeed the current proposals for St

George’s prohibits half the current 600 pupils from gaining an automatic place at the enlarged St Ambrose Barlow because of its proposed size of 1050.

The consultation information sheet then further promotes this local school, as an alternative place for their children’s education. This completely ignores the fact that they have already chosen St George’s as the school for their children, it also denies the right for future parents to be able to choose a faith education for their children.

In an attempt to justify the current proposals there have been numerous spurious arguments put forward. Namely:



The state of the building: The reduced capacity of Harrop Fold School and therefore the possibility of sharing school playing fields, the possibility of using their old buildings temporarily to relocate St

George’s in the case of a rebuild could all have been used creatively to save St George’s if there was a will to do so. It is absolutely certain that a new school could be built upon its existing site and indeed the

Diocese commissioned an Architect to ascertain its feasibility.



The number of Catholic children: Other Faith Schools in Salford have a smaller number of children belonging to the faith of that school. At a time when social cohesion is being promoted, the current practice a t St

George’s of welcoming children of all faiths and of no faith should be applauded. In creating the extended St Ambrose Barlow, non Catholic children will effectively be denied a place in that school. It must be remembered that a requirement of all new school building s is to guarantee a percentage of places to non faith pupils. St George’s

Governors have already agreed to do this and it is current practice.



The limited amount of BSF monies: In a meeting which was minuted,

Jill Baker said, in reply to a question, that even if there were considerably more funds available under BSF, she would still be recommending the closure of St George’s. There has always been a subtle threat to all the other BSF schools that their futures were dependent upon the closure of St George’s. This has now been focussed upon the Catholic schools where their futures will be seriously threatened if St George’s does not close. Such a negotiating position has been described as nothing less than blackmail.

It is clear however, that unlike the extraordinary efforts that Salford City

Council has made to save some schools from closing, for example in terms of ongoing financial support, there has been a complete lack of effort to look at ways of keeping St George’s open. This is despite the massive support it has received both from within and from outside its community.

Councillor Warmisham refers to the ‘amalgamation’ of St George’s and St

Ambrose Barlow High Schools. It was reported in the press in a similar manner. In order to soften the decision it was compared to the proposed

‘amalgamation’ of The Swinton and Moorside High Schools despite the comparison being totally invalid. I believe this was quite a deliberate strategy in an attempt to disguise the fact that St George’s was being assimilated by St

Ambrose Barlow. It hid the fact that staff at St George’s would be made redundant and it attempted to hide the fact that not all the pupils at St

George’s would be guaranteed a place at the new school. The reality however is that despite all the support for the school to stay open, it has been ignored.

The Diocese has been offered three brand new schools which is a deal much better that was originally being offered. It disguises the fact that new builds are in fact, in the long term, better value for money. It also highlights the weaknesses of the original proposals, because, it has now been shown how

technically difficult, if not impossible it would be to , for example rebuild St

Ambrose Barlow on its existing site and this is without consideration of a sixth form. Its current site is poor and it would have to have been rebuilt on a new site. The lack of accuracy of these original plans can now be seen more clearly with all schools now being rebuilt, further downward adjustments with regards to pupil numbers in the schools and revised timelines.

I believe that the current proposal with regards to the future of St George’s is not in the best interests of the pupils. The scheme is a high risk due to its location in greenbelt, the details of the sixth form provision are as yet completely unknown to us and of course, for many of our pupils, there will be an increase in travelling as well as future congestion charges. The needs of our pupils are best served by a school on this existing site built/remodelled to the same specifications as all the other schools.

Number of

Comments

1) All respondees do not wish St George’s to close

2) An oversubscribed, excellent popular school should not be

3) closed.

St George’s has good examination results, good OfSTED

417

256

221

4) and there is no need for a community police officer.

St George’s is held in very high esteem by all in the local

5) community.

St George’s has an excellent SEN provision; the help and support given are second to none. Concerns that support at any other school would be inferior to that provided at St

George’s and that a large school will not be suitable for children with SEN.

6) The Prime Minister wanted to close failing schools not excellent ones

7) The feeling that success should be rewarded rather than

8) failure.

Salford City Council do not care about children. ‘Thought every child matters’.

9) Option of local RC high school education removed

28

26

9

2

13

9

50 school has been taken away.

180 health and safety of pupils, financial impact on families and impact on length of pupil day. What transport will be provided?

36 taking their children to alternative schools. school should St George’s close – new school uniform

4

1 places for all the pupils at both schools and should have a completely new name and uniform.

should not have to travel to matter enough. has provided an excellent education for many pupils and set them up for a good future. Now the LA want to take this away for future generations.

Parents want younger siblings of their children attending

St George’s to be given the opportunity to attend St

George’s. surplus places at Harrop Fold, which is seen to be an inferior school going to Harrop Fold which is seen to be an inferior school.

20) guaranteed a place at the new school. been built on the Longshaw Drive site and the current site utilised for a new build St George’s school. Any surplus land being sold.

22) linked to the proposals for the other RC high schools, yet proposals for other state schools are not linked.

23) that Harrop Fold achieves capacity. Criticism of the LA’s planning of Harrop Fold. there are surplus places at Harrop Fold? but where are the student places within Salford?

27) – St

George’s is seen to be a small caring community with very little bullying and one where everyone, pupils and teachers, know each other

Why not capitalise on the brilliant education that St

George’s provides and extend the school and do a refurbishment?

Catholic pupils should be entitled to a Catholic education in their local area.

RC primary in the area now the LA propose to close the only RC high school in the area. Little Hulton and

Walkden children are abandoned at age 11.

Concerns regarding the local authority management of closure of St George’s and eventual transfer of pupils/transport arrangements. St Edmund’s cited as an example of cou ncil’s incompetence (pupil numbers).

2

48

2

25

1

1

9

142

1

16

59

8

6

31

32

32

1

Harrop Fold even though the proposal has not yet been passed. towards the Catholic sector during recent proposals and that the subsequent deal struck with the Diocese to rebuild

3 Catholic high schools on the understanding that St

George’s closes is a disgrace.

George’s was that small schools don’t work. All Hallows was cited as an example by consultees which proved this theory to be incorrect. be destroyed. closure will take away the heart of their community local community

38) land can be sold to fund improvements at other schools/build houses etc.

39) pupils means that there is no need for security on site as at Harrop Fold.

40) community and that the excellent teaching staff are very supportive.

Pupil response that they enjoy their education at St

George’s and do not want it to close. pupils and enables them to reach their full potential. distance. the politicians voted in by their parents. Salford Council has let down the children of Walkden and Little Hulton. for the new school?

46) the current site with shared playing fields with Harrop Fold

47) local farmer?

George’s is the poor state of the building, however many building improvements have been made and quality of education is seen to be of more importance than the state of the building.

The BSF fund is not being distributed fairly, the money should be distributed fairly and St George’s should be included in the distribution – all other schools are being

1

51

1

1

25

75

16

44

3

1

15

4

43

19

18

38

12

47

offered rebuild. of the BSF money than the Catholic high schools. local community or staff, parents and children.

Cabinet did not attend the consultation meetings for St

George’s. part in the consultation process. the consultation meeting shown towards Strategic Director of Children’s Services

55) erge St George’s and Harrop Fold and re-designate as an RC faith and community school schools amalgamate e.g. Little Hulton and Joseph

Eastham. Seen to be very disruptive to education.

There is strong leadership, good caring teachers, strong faith and good discipline at the school

– ‘Every Child

Matters at St George’s’. of its pupils, and in particular Year 11 pupils. yet close more schools? is an attempt to unofficially merge the school with St

George’s capacity to take all the pupils that wish to go from St

George’s linked to the proposals for the other RC high schools

64)

’s pupils regularly gain media recognition for their educational achievements.

The closure of St George’s will affect every child’s education in St George’s, St Ambrose Barlow, All Hallows and St Patrick’s.

The view that Catholic children will go to schools outside the authority if St George’s closes e.g. St Mary’s, Astley guaranteed jobs at the new school, therefore adding to pupil disruption. that questions asked are not being answered but are being countered by reference to the proposals. Criticism also that Salford City Council charged St George’s for undertaking the peaceful protest demonstration.

1

9

1

3

38

29

1

1

35

2

34

3

1

1

1

1

9

118

2

31

backgrounds living in a deprived area. To close St

George’s would remove the main positive educational provision in the area.

70) the Catholic ethos helps to produce remarkably successful, responsible and caring citizens in a district where opportunities to succeed are scarce. the impression has been given that other Catholic schools will not get funding unless St G eorge’s agrees to the proposals. the people of Salford have. The council’s proposals are divisive and will force schools to be more selective. How is that inclusive? as an alternative place for their children’s education. This completely ignores the fact that they have already chosen

St George’s as the school for their children, it also denies the right for future parents to be able to choose a faith education for their children.

74) and Worsley are among the only districts reporting increased populations and higher baptism rates. Why therefore rebuild and enlarge other RC high schools that even have intersecting catchment areas?

One of the points made by the LA for closure of St

George’s was that there were insufficient funds to incorporate all high schools in BSF. However when further funds were offered they were immediately directed at other RC high schools thus ‘purchasing’ their support.

George’s was insufficient Catholic population, yet baptism rates in Walkden are increasing and the Bishop advocates an ideal faith school to have no single faith represented by more than 40%. educational standards, behaviour of pupils and running of

Harrop Fold (i.e. overspending, building far too large, has large debt, fails educationally, building is regularly set on fire and covered in graffiti and an on site community policeman is required). diocese is not the preferred option of the majority; it is fundamentally a conduit for cost reduction to the council.

79) financial gain have failed non Catholic children.

12

2

4

1

2

11

2

19

1

1

2

2

their current numbers, yet 7 other schools have a lower intake than St George’s.

82) – advice from the Learning and Skills

Council (LSC) states that if St Ambrose Barlow closed funding will cease, however the LSC confirm that this will not be the case.

2 apartheid across the city.

St Patrick’s RC

Total number of responses 4

The following response was received from the Headteacher of St

Patrick’s RC High School:

St Patrick’s has not needed to be part of the statutory process of consultation in relation to proposals for the RC estate within Salford’s BSF plans.

However, we did consider it important to consult with various stakeholders in the school community to gauge opinion and consider the implications of the amended proposals for St Patrick’s. As the Headteacher of a Catholic school, it was appropriate to seek guidance from the Bishop. I noted support of the

Diocese before proceeding with consultation.

The original proposals were unsatisfactory to us for reasons cited earlier in the process. As a school, we appreciate that our views were listened to and amendments made reflect that.

St Patrick’s would welcome the investment proposed in the most recent plans.

A new build would significantly impact on educational provision into the future and have considerable advantages over a re-model, causing less disruption in the process. It remains important to us to get investment as soon as possible because our current provision does not support the pace of our school improvement work.

As a school we remain optimistic about the future. We are immensely proud of our young people and we recognise the responsibility as educators to seize every opportunity which will positively impact on life chances. We know that the young people of Salford and St Patrick’s are special and they deserve the best.

1) Number of responses in support of the proposal,

2) Concerns surrounding the possible disruption to pupils the building of the new school may have. Request for further information as to how this process will be undertaken.

3) A request for Careers Education and Guidance (CEG)

Number of

Comments

2

1

1

provision at the new school to include classroom, library and area where confidential meetings can be held.

The NUT Response

The NUT made a comprehensive response to the November 2007 BSF consultation on Roman Catholic education provision. That response remains extant but there are some points on which the NUT wishes to respond on the latest proposals.

The NUT has made careful consideration of the consultation proposals but is particularly concerned with those aspects of the proposals which impinge on the current of=r future employment and professional development prospects of our members. The closure of St George’s will severely disadvantage NUT members in that their status and tenure will not be secure. Even if the

Governing Body of St Ambrose Barlow were to ring-fence posts for St

George’s teachers which would be created by virtue of having an enlarged St

Ambrose Barlow, the number of additional places does not add up to the combined numbers of pupils at St George’s and St Ambrose Barlow, therefore putting at risk several teaching posts at least in the Catholic sector. As unions are all too well aware, individual schools Governing Bodies are the employers and cannot be directed to take on teachers who have been made redundant as a result of a school closure.

It would appear that the main reason for the closure of St Ge orge’s now lies in the granting of sixth form provision to St Ambrose Barlow. The NUT believes that it is not in the best interests of teachers and children to be moving towards an ad hoc arrangement of sixth form provision without consideration of the implications for the whole of Salford. Following a very long consultation and debate on the provision of post 16 education Salford City Council decided to organise its secondary school to provide for 11-16 year old students and that the post 16 provision would be provided by the two sixth form colleges and the Salford Tertiary College to cater for many technical and craft skills.

Considerable public investment has been made in these three institutions.

Additional post 16 educational provisions will duplicate courses and consequently put at risk jobs and current investment. Already we have a situation whereby Salford’s two Academies will have sixth forms. The Director herself pointed out that other high achieving secondary schools may themselves be granted a presumption of a sixth form. It seems that the local authority is sleep walking towards a change of secondary provision without due and proper consideration. The complexities of a reduction of pupil numbers and the probable merger of Salford College, Pendleton and Eccles

Sixth Form Colleges appears not to have been properly debated in the

Council Chamber, our schools and in the communities.

The consultation document makes clear that indeed the whole of the wider reorganisation of Catholic provision actually hinges on the closure of St

George’s thus facing our members with an intolerable dilemma, if they fight for their successful school to remain open they will be seen as putting in jeopardy

the future provision of Catholic education in Salford; a dilemma which is not of their making and which they should not have to bear.

BUILDING SCHOOLS FOR THE FUTURE

IN SALFORD

ALTERNATIVE PROPOSALS FOR THE

ROMAN CATHOLIC HIGH SCHOOLS

Consultation on the proposal for the closure of

St George’s Roman Catholic High School

Please take a few moments to read this leaflet and then tell us what you think about the proposal.

Thank you

Jill Baker

Strategic Director of Children’s Services

WHAT IS THIS PROPOSAL?

The proposal is to close St. George’s Roman Catholic High School from September

2012 as part of the wider re-organisation of Roman Catholic High Schools in Salford.

This leaflet explains the proposals to parents and others and gives answers to some of the questions which are likely to be raised.

Further details about the proposal and how your views may be submitted can be found at www.salford.gov.uk/schoolconsultation

If you would like to hear more about the proposals and make your views known you can come to one of the parents’/carers’ consultation meetings. The first event for parents/carers of St George’s pupils will be held in the school hall at St George’s RC

High School on Thursday 20 November, 6.00pm-7.30pm.

The second event is in the form of a drop-in consultation meeting which is also being held in the school hall at St George’s High School on Tuesday 25 November, 6.00pm-8.30pm

. Officers from Children’s Services will be there to explain the proposal, listen and record what you have to say and answer your questions.

In order to ensure that we can accommodate everyone who wishes to take part in the above events it will be necessary for you to contact Paula Flynn on 0161 778 0447, between the hours of 8.30am - 4.30pm, Monday to Friday, by Monday 17 November to confirm your attendance at either meeting. For the drop-in meeting you will be allocated a 15 minute appointment with officers. You are welcome to attend alone or in a small group.

We are also holding a community drop-in consultation event on Wednesday 26

November, 5.00pm-7.30pm

at Fletcher Hall, Vicarage Road, Swinton, M27 OWA. At this event we would be happy to explain the proposals to individuals or small groups and listen to any questions or concerns you have. Officers will also ensure that any issues raised will be recorded. Should you wish to attend the community drop-in event please contact Paula Flynn on 0161 778 0447, between the hours of 8.30am –

4.30pm, Monday to Friday, by Friday 21 November to book a 15 minute appointment with officers that is convenient to you.

Should you wish to comment on these proposals please submit your views, in writing to:

Kathryn Mildenstein

Minerva House

Pendlebury Road

Salford

M27 4EQ

Or fax 0161 728 6098 by 19 th December 2008.

Or visit the Salford City Council website at: www.salford.gov.uk/schoolconsultation

QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS

St George’s Roman Catholic High School

As part of the wider re-organisation of Roman Catholic High Schools in Salford a report was made to the Council’s Cabinet in October 2008 summarising a set of alternative linked proposals to reorganise the Roman Catholic school estate for the

Building Schools for the Future programme (BSF). The Cabinet has now agreed to consult on the following linked proposals:



To rebuild All Hallows Roman Catholic High School on part of the site currently occupied by Oasis Academy (ex Hope High School), at its existing size from September 2012.

 To close St George’s Roman Catholic High School from September 2012



To enlarge St Ambrose Barlow Roman Catholic High School from 750 to

1050 pupils, by creating a new building on the former Wardley High

School site from September 2012. Also to change the school’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth form by September 2011, before the main new building opens.

 To rebuild St Patrick’s Roman Catholic High School on its existing site, at its existing size from September 2012.

1. What discussions have taken place with the Roman Catholic Diocese since the last proposals were consulted on?

Following the previous consultation officers of the Local Authority have met with the Bishop of Salford and representatives of the Roman Catholic Diocese on a number of occasions. Both the Local Authority and the Roman Catholic Diocese have agreed these proposals which involve all four Roman Catholic High

Schools.

2 . Why not keep all four schools the same size and just refurbish the existing buildings?

BSF is a city wide programme. The government’s intention for the programme is to create ‘transformational change’ leading to inspiring buildings to support the education of our children and their communities for the future. If we spend money just on upgrading current building stock, this will not achieve transformation and will be unacceptable to central government because it would not achieve the central purpose of BSF, therefore funding would not be approved.

3 . Why can’t the current St. George’s School building be refurbished to become a school fit for the twenty first century?

A professional survey has been undertaken by Salford City Council to assess the condition of the building fabric at all high schools. Each element of the school building has been assessed according to its current condition. The assessment for St. George’s R.C. High School concluded that:

 Around £1.2 million would need to be spent just to bring the building up to a good standard of repair, with no transformation. The figure is based upon a technical evaluation of the school buildings.



Far more would have to be spent on the building to make it suitable to deliver education in the long term.



A refurbishment of the existing building would not be value for money.

4. Why is St. George’s R.C. High School site considered too small?



A new school for 550 pupils requires in the region of 45,000 square metres overall including a minimum of 30,000 square metres of team games provision. The school site overall is only 31,590 square metres and could not accommodate the minimum area for team games and buildings.



The restricted site impacts not only on formal provision for sport but also the informal and social space for children.



Ideally a site should be significantly above the minimum requirements.

The revised plan would allow the pupils who live in Little Hulton and Walkden to attend an already outstanding school, newly housed in a state of the art building.

We believe that this plan provides better educational opportunities in the longer term.

5. You are proposing to extend St. Ambrose Barlow by an additional 300 places, yet there are 600 pupils attending St. George’s. What will happen to the additional 300 pupils?

This depends on which other schools parents may choose to send their children to and where those children live. There will be an extra 300 places available at the new St. Ambrose Barlow, 300 places at Walkden High School and there will also be some places at Harrop Fold High School. The governing body of each

Voluntary Aided school determines the school’s admissions policy. We are working with all of the schools and the RC Diocese to minimise disruption to pupils’ education.

6. Will those St. George’s pupils who will be affected by the proposed closure automatically be guaranteed a place at the newly built St. Ambrose Barlow?

Our aim is that every pupil attending St. George’s in 2012 will be able to continue their education at a Roman Catholic School if they wish to. We will work with the

Headteachers and the Governing Bodies of St. Ambrose Barlow and St George’s and the Roman Catholic Diocese to try to ensure that all the pupils who wish to, will be able to transfer to the new school in 2012 .

In addition we will work with St. Geo rge’s and St. Ambrose Barlow so that pupils in Year 11 at that time can continue their GCSE work with minimal disruption.

This may include pupils in Year 11 continuing to attend the St. George’s building until they have completed their exams.

7.

Why is this proposal linked to the proposals for other Roman Catholic High

Schools?

The Roman Catholic sector proposals are all linked financially and in respect of pupil numbers. Therefore if the decision not to close St. George’s R.C. High

School is not approved, all the Roman Catholic High School proposals will require revision.

8.

When would St. George’s RC High School close if this proposal were agreed?

The proposed closure date for St George’s RC High School is September 2012.

Plans would be made to minimise any disruption to the education of young people who will be undertaking their GCSE’s. This could involve allowing year 11 pupils to complete their education at the St George’s building rather than moving school at the end of year 10.

9. How can my views be represented?

When a Council wishes to make major changes to a school, they are required to follow a legally defined process, which includes opportunities for all interested parties to make comments and objections.

You now have an opportunity to c omment on the City Council’s proposals.

Following the consultation, officers from Salford City Council will analyse all responses and report back to the Council’s Cabinet. If the Cabinet decides to continue with the proposal a statutory notice will be published. This will give all interested parties a further 6 weeks to make comments and objections. All responses will then be reported to the City Council’s Cabinet, which is the Local

Decision Maker.

The consultation process runs from 10 November to 19 December 2008.

BUILDING SCHOOLS FOR THE

FUTURE IN SALFORD

Consultation on the Proposal for the Closure of St

George ’s Roman Catholic High School

Background

• In Autumn 2007 we consulted with you about proposals for the development of the Roman Catholic High Schools across the city.

• Following the previous consultation officers of the Local Authority met with the Bishop of Salford and representatives from the

Roman Catholic Diocese and agreed a proposal which involves all four Roman Catholic High Schools.

• A further report was made to the Council’s Cabinet in October

2008 summarising a set of alternative linked proposals to reorganise the Roman Catholic School estate for the Building

Schools for the Future programme (BSF).The City Council now wants to seek your views on an alternative proposal.

What are the proposals for RC high schools in Salford?

• The closure of St George’s Roman Catholic High School by 2012

• To enlarge St Ambrose Barlow Roman Catholic High School from

750 to 1050 pupils, by creating a new building on the former

Wardley High School site by September 2012. Also to change the school ’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth form by

September 2011, before the new building opens.

• To rebuild All Hallows Roman Catholic High School on part of the site currently occupied by Oasis Academy (ex Hope High School), at its existing site by September 2012.

• To rebuild St Patrick’s Roman Catholic High School on its existing site, at its existing size by September 2012.

Why is this proposal linked to the proposals for other RC high schools?

• The Roman Catholic sector proposals are linked financially and in respect of pupil numbers.

• Therefore if the decision to close St George’s Roman Catholic High

School is not approved, all the Roman Catholic High School proposals will require revision.

Our aim is that every pupil attending St George ’s in 2012 will be able to continue their education at a Roman Catholic school if they wish to do so. We will work with the Headteachers and the

Governing Bodies of St Ambrose Barlow and St George ’s and the

RC Diocese to try to ensure that all those pupils who wish to, will be able to transfer to the new school in 2012.

What alternative places will be available if St George ’s were to close?

• St Ambrose Barlow RC High School (completely rebuilt and increased in capacity by 150 places) or

• Walkden High School (completely rebuilt and increased in capacity by 300 places) or

• Harrop Fold School.

Why not close both St Ambrose Barlow and

St George ’s and open a replacement school?

• St Ambrose Barlow RC High School has received funding to create a 6 th form.

• If the proposal were to close both schools then the funding for the

6 th form would be withdrawn by the government.

• This proposal, if approved, would create 3 new RC High Schools and one new Roman Catholic 6 th form.

What is the proposed timescale?

• Public Consultation – from 10 November to 19 December 2008.

• Six weeks representation period for comments/objections – ends

19 December 2008.

• Report to Cabinet to consider outcome of consultation and authorisation to publish linked notice – 27 January 2008.

If Cabinet authorises the publication of the notice

• Publication of a linked statutory notice to close St George’s

Roman Catholic High School and to enlarge St Ambrose Barlow

Roman Catholic High School from 750 to 1050 pupils, by creating a new building on the former Wardley High School site by September 2012. Also to change the school ’s upper age limit to 18 and add a 250 place sixth from by September 2011, before the main new building opens.

• Six week representation period for comments/objections – end of

March 2009.

If Cabinet authorises the publication of the notice

• The Local Authority decision maker will consider any comments and objections received and determine the proposals within 2 months of the end of the representation period – May 2009.

• The Bishop of Salford and the Governing Body of the school have the right to appeal the Local Authority ’s decision to the Schools

Adjudicator.

George’s Governing Body Consultation Meeting St Thursday 20 November 2008, 5.00pm

BUILDING SCHOOLS FOR THE FUTURE

IN SALFORD

ALTERNATIVE PROPOSALS FOR THE

ROMAN CATHOLIC HIGH SCHOOLS

BUILDING SCHOOLS FOR THE

FUTURE IN SALFORD

Background

What are the proposals for RC high schools in Salford?

Why is this proposal linked to the proposals for other RC high schools?

What alternative places will be available if St George ’s were to close?

Why not close both St Ambrose Barlow and

St George ’s and open a replacement school?

What is the proposed timescale?

If Cabinet authorises the publication of the notice

If Cabinet authorises the publication of the notice

Related documents

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George’s Governing Body Consultation Meeting St Thursday 20 November 2008, 5.00pm

BUILDING SCHOOLS FOR THE FUTURE

IN SALFORD

ALTERNATIVE PROPOSALS FOR THE

ROMAN CATHOLIC HIGH SCHOOLS

BUILDING SCHOOLS FOR THE

FUTURE IN SALFORD

Background

What are the proposals for RC high schools in Salford?

Why is this proposal linked to the proposals for other RC high schools?

What alternative places will be available if St George ’s were to close?

Why not close both St Ambrose Barlow and

St George ’s and open a replacement school?

What is the proposed timescale?

If Cabinet authorises the publication of the notice

If Cabinet authorises the publication of the notice

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