PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
Attendees:
Leo Sidebotham, Chair, BLM
Bill Lafferty, ODF
Cory Winnie, BIA
Pam Ensley, USFWS
Ron Wells, NPS
Mark Kahley, WADNR
Randy Simpson, OSFM Deputy Chief
Bob Anderson, WA Fire Chiefs
Bonnie Wood, Ex. Dir/Note taker
Guests:
Terry Burgess, SORO
Roy Montgomery, Blue Ribbon Panel
Lori Hammer, SORO
Gerry Day, NWCC
Introductions, Agenda Modification
Added discussion topics, no time zone, to the agenda. Fire Use& Fuels Working Team revision of task orders,
PNWCG Organization & Communication. Use of Aviation Resources and Lead Plane Support to State
contracted Air Tankers.
June minutes and action items were reviewed. Minutes were approved as written.
Aviation Working Team has not completed their assignment. Bonnie will follow-up with Clay and John to find
out when we can expect their assignment to be completed.
Fire Planning Analysis Update (FPA) – Terry Burgess
Handouts: Northwest FPA Group Briefing.
The three geographic areas in the NW did make the due dates with their submittals, although in Terry’s words
the units would have liked more time to ensure the forms were complete.
Central Oregon, SW Oregon, NE Washington are the three units.
Still bugs in the program. Several questions unique to the NW, such as contract crews and engines, have been
asked how we are to handle in the models.
There is a Line Officer briefing packet soon to be available. The National Core team continues to remind us
FPA is a “Strategic Model” yet they are not able to tell us how to apply it to the ground; actually use it.
Bottom line, field units are not happy with the results from the modeling as they don’t believe it will produce
the results on the ground that we are able to achieve now.
Discussed the concern for the continued pressure to meet deadlines when the models do not appear to be
working and are time costly to run. Both Oregon and Washington State have concerns about the ability of the
models to produce results needed for pre-suppression funding and planning.
Discussion about what “official body” the Steering Committee should express their concerns to.
PNWCG supports the concept of FPA and believe the program has been pushed too fast for there to be time for
the models to be adequately developed and tested to produce real results that are usable for adequate wildfire
pre-suppression.
Agreed to send a letter to National Fire & Aviation Executive Board (NFAEB) with our support for FPA and
concerns for the lack of time to develop sound working models.
ACTION: Terry Burgess, Pam Ensley, and Bonnie Wood will work together to craft a letter for
PNWCG approval outlining the Steering Committee’s concerns for the FPA model. Letter to be send to
NFAEB and NWCG. The States will share the letter with NASF so the talking points need to be clear
and concise.
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PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
PNWCG Organization and Support: Bob Anderson
This Steering Committee is the focal point for interagency communication and decisions for fire suppression,
share information, ensure correspondence is sent to the right places, especially the field. This group does good
work and makes good interagency decisions, but it is not well documented or communicated. Need web-site
that is current and anyone can find information on. The situation has been with us for a long time, but it’s
gotten worse this past year.
There are some things being worked on that cannot be disclosed at this time. Good discussion about what is
needed to support PNWCG, agreement that more time is now needed due to the press of business of each
PNWCG Steering Committee member. The intra Steering Committee communication and communication with
the working teams is weak.
Leo requested this discussion come back at the August meeting.
ACTION: SUPPORT FOR THE PNWCG STEERING COMMITTEE-Leo.
Fire Use and Fuels Working Team Update-Pam Ensley
Handout of revised new WT Charter. WT spent the day looking at Task Order XXX and responding to the
Task Order with what is doable for them pending FPA and LANDFIRE getting done.
Motion to approve the offered Charter.
Discussion: Charter as written does not directly address National Fire Plan. Do we want it to? How do we do
that? Should we approve the Charter now and revise it later just to get them under a Charter.
Use Task Orders to clarify the role of this team.
Motion Seconded. Approved!
ACTION: Sign the Charter and deliver to the Working Team Chair, John Holcomb is the Chair.
Blue Ribbon Panel Update – Roy Montgomery.
Three topics today1. Procurement of Strike Teams of Crews and Engines for 2006.
a. The Blue Ribbon Task Group as discussed with the OPS WT.
b. Reviewed the unable to fill orders. A significant number of resource orders at NIFC
were UTF. In the NW the data is incomplete. ICs indicate they have had to stage
resource to pending arrival of STL.
CONCERNS:
 The contract ST would replace agency ST.
 Concern that it would be unfair to the small contractors that there would no longer be a place for the
small contractors with only a couple single resources.
 OPS WT not overly enthusiastic to go with contractor ST. But would support it if Steering Committee
decides to go forward with it.
ISSUES: (Handout)
 PNWCG would have to provide the red carding and training for the Leaders as currently the contracted
training is only single resource boss.
 See Roy’s handout for the rest of the concerns.
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PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
Discussion about dispatch processes, leadership for the crews, positive support for offering the 300 level
training, preferences may be for agency resources but reality is these resources are no longer available so this is
a proactive route to proceed.
DECISION: Steering Committee supports all three recommendations.
2. Fair Share Funding for Participation in crew/engine tender programs. Two handout; Briefing
Paper and background from previous decision. Presentation for information and background data only.
Should the PNWCG decide to make a change is Crew support, the information would be useful. Roy
discussed the proposal. Discussion. The Cheetah program that Roy used does not calculate the out of
NW use of these crews. BIA has a concern of equity regarding SW crews that are fully BIA funded and
used in the NW by all agencies.
3. Dispatch work group (under the Blue Ribbon panel) leader to fill behind Bruce Keleman who has
retired. (Develop dispatch system/procedures for contract resources achieving best value).
 Roy proposes a revised due date June 2006.
 This will take an individual with unique skills.
 There is a lot of work remaining, although there won’t be much work done in July/August.
 The Blue Ribbon Panel is working on some dispatch proposal (contractors) for the interim.
 Discussion-propose to re-visit the make up of the group that was given the task, it is currently all
dispatcher, with Bruce for the lead and Jim Furlong representing the OPS WT. Propose to
broaden the make up of the group, add some non-dispatcher types. Recommend and agency
administrator. Clarify the expectation of the team. Clearly state the importance of this team and
this work. Proposed a contractor to lead the group so they can focus on getting this task done.
Propose Gordon Foster as Team Leader and Roy Montgomery for support. Due date is June
2006. Review the process that was crafted by the Blue Ribbon panel for
implementation summer 2005. Need to focus on ensuring the Dispatchers can be
successful. Bill Lafferty will approach Gordon Foster on his leading this working
group.
ROUND ROBINBill Lafferty-ODF-Legislature is still in session. Fundamental differences between House and Senate,
large differences in agency funding between the two. Suspect ODF budget will be one of
the last that is approved, and the bills proposed. Budget notes for ODF, agreed to set
aside $4 million for severity and fire suppression for the two years controlled by the eboard. Emphasis on partnering well with the federal assets in fire suppression or when
the set aside funds are used/requested.
Talked about focusing on IA resources and partnering well on movement of resources.
Hope we recognize when one aviation resource is moved for national assignments that
creates a hole for IA when assigned to large fires.
Pam Ensley-FWS-Order in for a SEAT at Richland should arrive on Friday. Coming in under local
severity. Joint severity request in to Terry Burgess who consolidates NW severity
requests.
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PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
Interior House Appropriates Sub-Committee. Concerns about CWPPs once developed,
being supported by federal funds for implementation. Concerns that both DOI and USFS
are not funding the “right” states. Questions about merging the DOI and USFS fire
departments.
Randy Simpson-OSFM-Last week the Fire Marshal’s budget was passed by the legislature along with
OSPs budget. HB2101 which recognizes Home Land Security budget is still in the
legislature may cause some slight shifts.
OSFM Incident Management Teams are ready to go, anytime.
Ron Wells- NPS-Do not have a lot of significant activity yet, nor have there been any. All Parks are
staffed except Crater Lake, lost fuels crew and short staffed at this time. New aviation
officer in August, stationed in Vancouver. Working half time for Park Rangers and half
time for Fire. Reviewing annual budget allocations for 2006 in August. Next year is
grime like other federal agencies; don’t think there will be any more staff cuts it will be
mostly in project areas.
Cory Winnie-BIA-local severity request, lots of requests for helicopter and modules. BIA had several
fires. DOI is discussing re-programming funds later in the year, not in time to hire fire
fighters. Appears all the fires of any size so far this year have been human caused.
Mark Kahley-DNR-Final JLARC hearings last month. JLARC has asked DNR to re-compute how they
request their budget; concerns with the suppression costs DNR has. Similar questions
and issues to what the federal agencies frequently are asked. Administered the light Pack
Test to the Governor and other high level executives. Also administered the fire shelter
training to them. This may be a first.
Last week had a table top exercise for mobilization; Mark was in attendance as an
observer and was asked a multitude of questions although it was not sponsored by the
DNR. The Governor was present and responded to press questions later very
successfully.
PBY-came on last week. Currently have 1 helicopter at Omak and 1 at Colville, as a
minimum.
Leo Sidebotham-BLM-Handed out safety alert regarding rangeland fires.
Continuing discussion on the Implementation of Fire Quals. (IFPM) that is now required of
federal agencies. There is extensive training required for many of the positions, there are
timelines for people in place etc.
CL 215 coming from Alaska will be stationed at Deer Park Washington. Prefer to have them in
SE Oregon, but there don’t appear to be any water sources that can be scooped out of.
Two vacancies in SORO, VICE Eric Christiansen, will re-advertise as a 12/13. Then the State
Aviation Manager, 12/13 will be advertised soon.
Bob Anderson-WA Fire Chiefs- State Fire Marshal’s office is considering pre-suppression mobilization. Using
Type 3 IMTs in managing fires in light fuels, some concerns for other areas then where its been
tested; distance to logistical support such as communications. Other questions about NWCG
quals on these Type III IMTs.
Bob has a back up for PNWCG and MAC when he’s not available, that will be Dave LaFave.
PNWCG needs to decide what they want to do with Fire District contracts in Washington. DNR
tried to facilitate resolution of the problem/issue and ran into some corners. The NW Type I and
many Type II Teams rely heavily on Fire District staff to be team members. Most of the USFS
Contract/Fiscal personnel have been transferred out of the area. DNR can support the in-state
assignments for liability and payment, but cannot support the out of state assignments.
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PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
NEED TO TASK THE INCIDENT BUSINESS MANAGEMENT WORKING TEAM TO RECOMMEND
SOLUTIONS THAT WILL WORK FOR THE AGENCIES AND THE FIRE SERVICE TO
ENSURE LIABILITY, PAYMENT AND OTHER ISSUES ARE COVERED. DNR HAS
BEEN SUPPORTING THIS SO THEIR PERSON HAS TO BE A PART OF THE WORKING
TEAM FOR THIS ASSIGNMENT.
ACTION: Bob Anderson will draft a Task Order and send to the Steering Committee members.
Grant Media Updates-Lori Hammer, SORO Fire Education Specialist
Three media events related to the NFP Grant program planned. Linking them with other events or celebrations
when possible.
Sept. 16, Leavenworth FWS sponsored events, NFP Grants will be focus. There will be a tour with this event
through the Leavenworth neighborhood projects.
Sept. 21, in Prineville, Rural and Volunteer Fire Service awards.
Sept. 22, in Medford, NFP Community Assistance grants will be the focus.
Inviting the Governor’s of each state, the congressional members, and local commissioners. Target date for all
invitations is August 1.
Prevention Working Team-Lori Hammer, SORO
Curriculum that was developed about 10 years ago for teachers to use high school. Historical teachers go to
Project Learning Tree for the background, and then they get the kits. Teachers have asked the
kits be updated to be more current so the kids can relate to the examples be offered. When
originally developed program cost $100,000. Using internal skills and talents whenever
possible. The Working Team is working with 14 other partners. There is a need for funding and
in-kind support. BLM is putting in $10, 000. The whole program is estimated to cost $100,000.
Bob Anderson encouraged Lori to look at opportunities and resources that fire districts may
have, such as video production and other media production.
Prevention WT, meets next Thursday.
Pam suggested the PWT provide the agencies with contract estimates to support different pieces
of this program there could potentially be some funds available as the year goes on.
NFP Accomplishment Report-Lori Hammer, SORO
Update on the status of the interagency report. Information Working Team was tasked in XXXX to work with
Lori to collect the Success Stories from their respective agencies. The report will only be
success stories this year as the data has not been made available to Lori this year. Bonnie and
Lori will meet on 7/21/05 to finish the FY 04 Report.
DECISION: Do success stories for FY 04 without the numbers data. Re-focus on the 05 report. There is an
interest by the Steering Committee to continue the report with data and success stories. Once the
Task Order is approved, the Steering Committee will communicate with their Information Team
Representatives and facilitate the information exchange with fire and information.
Federal Lead Planes and State contracted air tankers-Bill Lafferty lead
Gerry Day and Steve Dickenson present and Jon Rollins by conference call.
Question: Can the federal agencies (Forest Service) partner with the State of Oregon and provide the federal
lead plane to support the State Air Tanker, with control of the federal lead plane remaining in the geographic
area. ODF is getting encouragement from the State Legislature to partner more with federal agencies for
severity and wildfire suppression.
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PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
Jon, typically there are two lead planes in the Region. MAFFS are activated tomorrow in Boise, once that is
done; one national lead plane is obligated to that unit.
Nationally there are 10-12 lead planes. BLM has 4 ASM platforms available with crew.
Gerry-In the GACC, the planes are coordinated with the National offices and the aviation staff. Placement is
usually done in collaboration.
ODF’s request is that the NWCC consider the State of Oregon contracted air tankers as part of the mix that
needs Lead Plane support when the planes are moved or pre-positioned in the NW. ODF clearly understands
the lead planes are national assets and will be out of the GACC’s control when there are national priority
incidents.
Steve Dickensen confirmed when positioning a lead plane somewhere within the GACC, he does consider the
need of the State of Oregon for a lead plane before re-positioning the lead plane.
MAC-Update
Gerry offered some proposals for slight modifications to the MAC handbook 11.2 and the Incident Prioritization
Worksheet. Brief explanation. Agreed to alter the wording for 11.2 to bold safety issues, stay the course with
the title wording.
Gerry proposes PNW MAC use these forms this year and critique at the end of the season.
Weather briefing and severity pre-positioning.
ACTION ITEMS
ACTION: Bonnie-Aviation Working Team has follow-up action items, need to identify the status of this work.
ACTION: Terry Burgess, Pam Ensley, and Bonnie Wood will work together to craft a letter for PNWCG
approval outlining the Steering Committee’s concerns for the FPA model. Letter to be send to NFAEB and
NWCG. The States will share the letter with NASF so the talking points need to be clear and concise.
ACTION: Support for the PNWCG Steering Committee-Leo will follow-up.
ACTION: Bill Lafferty will approach Gordon Foster on his leading the blue ribbon panel dispatch working
team.
ACTION: Bob Anderson will draft a Task Order to the Incident Business Management WT, to assess the
contract and fiscal support for “hiring and payment of Washington Fire Service personnel that
are members of Type II and Type III Incident Management Teams.
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PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
PNWCG STEERING COMMITTEE AGENDA
Northwest Coordination Center
5420 NE Marine Drive
0900-0915
Welcome, Lunch, Agenda modifications
Bonnie
0915-0945
June Meeting follow-up & Approval
Bonnie
0945-1030
FPA
Terry Burgess
1030-1045
BREAK
1045-1130
Fair Share Funding and/or Participation
Roy Montgomery
for Crew and Engine/Tender Programs.
Recommendations for procuring strike teams of crews/ engines.
LUNCH-NWCC IS HAVING A NO HOST BBQ WE’RE INVITED
Round Robin IMMEDIATELY following lunch
1130-1300
1300-1330
Update on Media Events & Education
Lori Hammer
1330-1400
Support for PNWCG
Follow Up on Action Items
Bonnie
1400
Adjourn
1401
NWCC Agreements
Gerry Day
PNWCG
Follow Up Items
Action Items relating to the Aviation Resources 2005 Operations Plan:
1. Aviation WT to draft letter for PNWCG signature to NWCG expressing aviation concerns for 2005.
Focus on IHOG requirements and Risk Assessment issues. Tie together cost containment for crash
response vehicles and communications trailers.
2. Aviation WT to draft letter for PNWCG signature to FMOs which emphasizes fire planning.
Recommend identifying water resources which cannot be utilized as well as identifying regional water
sources.
Action Items relating to Workload and Cost Estimate:
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PNWCG Steering Committee
Meeting Notes
July 20, 2005
1. Roy Montgomery work with Terry Burgess, Karen Wood and Leo Sidebotham to draft letter to FPA
steering committee to bring this item to their attention. Cc of letter to National Fire and Aviation
Executive Board (NFAEB). Due June 30, 2005.
Action Items relating to Task Force Update:
Roy Montgomery will redraft the letter with the recommended modifications for PNWCG signature. Cc of the
letter to be sent to the Geographic Area Board Chairs (Gerry Day will provide info to Roy), and the National
Fire & Aviation Executive Board (NFAEB). Due June 30, 2005.
Not all agreements are in place for 2005 for fire service folks on the IMT’s. What is the status of the request
from the OPS WT to fill in behind B. Anderson on the T1 Team when he is on leave this summer? K. Wood
indicated the staff work and correspondence from the OWT was still in progress.
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