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1
SECRETARY.
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is
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8
OF HIS
BHI'J?ABI-;IC L I A J S S £ Y S sovapita a i ? ) .
(m
C A B I Ji iS I
20 (82).
C G a O B U S I O U S of a b a t i n g of ths Cabinet
held at 1 0 , Downing Street, S.w.1, on
Wednesday, 82na March, 1S2£, at 11.30.a.m.
P R S 3 E BJ2 .:­
£he Right Hon. A. Chamberlain
, il. P . ,
(In tha Chair).
Lord Privy Seal, [$ha Right Eon. The Viscount Birfcenhead, Lord Chancellor­
She Right Hon. Sir Robert Borne, 0,3.15. , K.C., K.P., Chancailor o f the Kxchequa r. lUba
Right Ron. B. Shortt, [I.C., &UF., Secretary of State I for Home it fa irs. £be Right Hon. . S . Churchill, , Secretary of Stats for the Colonies. IThs Right ion. She Viaoouht
jPesl, 3.3.E., Secretary of
1 Stats for India.
£he Right hon. Sir L. orthington Evans, Bart. , H.P., Sac rotary of State for war. [Tho Right hon. Lord Las of ]?arahara, G.B.,E. , K.C.8., first for! of the Admiralty, £he Right Ken. S. Baldwin, M.P., President of the Board of Srads. llha Right Hon. Sir 4.1 frod Mond, Bart., M.P., Minis tsr of Health. £he Right Ron. H.A.B. Wisher, i4. President of the Board of frade. '5h9 Right Ron. sir "Arthur Griffith-
IBoaoawen, M . P . , Minister of [Agriculture and fisheries. £he Right Hon. £.1. Macnamara, M.P., Minister of labour­
film Hight
£he Right Hon. Sir Bamar Greenwood, Bart., K.G., M.P., Chief Secretary for Ireland. ,;
,:
:
Hon. R. Munro, L..G., Secretary for Scotland. £BK FOLLOWINQ 'VERS A S Q PRRSKRT.­
a
Qaptain the Right hon. 8usst C.B.E. , B.S.O., M.P., Jscrstary of Stats for Air, 'or 0 one 1 us ion 4-, / 3.
9
Lt. Commander S.Hilton Young, u.3.0.,, 1J.S.C., M.P., financial Sacra tars Treasury. (For Conclusion p. ?
Sir A. Watson, K.C.8., Coverument Actuary. (For Conclusion / ^ J Coi
-- Sir &1.P.A. Kankey, G.0.B
Jr
' *
i
Jonas
Secretary.
Principal Assistant Secretary. 9 1 9 Cll Sitfc reference to Cabinet 16 (221 Conclusion 2, the Cabinet ana before them the following - documents on thsf subject of unemployment Inwma.ee.-
Tbe Soport of the Unemployment-Committee Appendix i, She Draft o f e Bill giving effect to the Committee^ Boport, which was circulated during the discussion, (Ch
M m )
(ca^sssij)
lt.T
OF LABOUR gave the Cabinet a summary
of the Commit tee'a proposals, namely, that the proposed
legislation should provide for weekly benefits of
17/­
for a married man plus l/* for each child, 18/- for a
single man and 10/- lor a single woraanm these f$gores corn­
paring with 22/-, lb/-, and 12/- under the existing legis­
latiom
these reduced rates of benefit to become operative
as from Thursday, April 13th.
Kmphasis was laid on two
considerations; first, that the rate of benefit was to be
reduced, and secondly, that there would be & hiatus of a week
and a half in April during which B O unemployment benefit
would be paid.
The coat of this scheme would Involve an
additional burden to the £xohc^uer of u troutfcd,00o,000, and
would involve an extension of the maximum borrowing powers
of tho Minister of Lab our by £5,000,'.)GO.
TEH LOiu) K-iIVY SEAL, as Chairman of the Committee, explain
ed thai the Committee were continuing the assistance to wives-'
and children at the same rate of - benefit, and in view of the
fact that the State was giving an uncovenanted benefit to people who had exhausted their right they were justified in reducing the - rates of benefit to the other beneficiaries, TB'3 S::QKHlAaY ,:01i ScOTLLUP pointed out the difficulty
which the adoption of this -scheme would cause in Scotland
owing, first, to the small areas o f administration- in that
part of the United itingdom, and secondly, to the fact that
Parliament had recently agreed that in Scotland the burden
of
should be laid on the pariah counciIs/providing poor relief
9 1 O
wit) to destitute able-bodied persons out of employment.
Poor Law Emergency Provisions (Scotland) A c t ) .
(The
If further burdens were laid on these small authorities their machinery would break down.
They were already pressing the Chancellor of the Exchequer for additional grants.
In his view either the benefits ought not to be reduced or the waiting periods should be shorter. This aspect of the question gave rise to a general discuss­
ion as to whether in the existing unemployment situation it was wise to cut down, the amount of the benefit at all.
iVarn­
ings were given of the risk of grave disturbance if this course was adopted.
In this connection the Government Actuary
was invited into the room and informed the Cabinet that the cost of maintaining.the existing rates of benefit would involve additional borrowing powers of £9,000,000, making £28f millions which, however, would probably be materially Increased as the result of the present disturbances in the engineering and shipbuilding-trade, perhaps to £252 millions. If so large a deficit were reached it would umke very problem­
atic its repayment because the contributors would refuse to bear the high rates necessary for a long enough period. THE CHAUCELLOB OF THE EXCHEQUES pointed out that there was a widespread hope and anticipation that some reduction, would be made in taxation in the forthcoming Budget.
This heavy additional burden would militate against this desideratum. He demurred to the proposal that the cost should be met by increasing the capital liabilities of the country.
Such a course would involve borrowing which would be contrary to the financial policy we had hitherto pursued, of reducing rather than increasing debt, and would result in lowering the credit of the country to an extent which would entail losses far beyond the addition to the debt. In the course of further discussion it was pointed out that the scheme did not apply to Ireland, since the British
Government]
responsibilities in Sorthern Ireland had already ceased and would cease in southern Ireland on 31st March 1922. After considerable discussion the Cabinet agreed (a) That the rates of Unemployment Insurance benefi 17should remain as at present. The phanoellor of the gxcheguer asked that
his dissent from this conclusion should F e
recorded.
*
(b) That the Bill should be redrafted to give effect to this conclusion. (c) That the Minister of Labour and the Minister of Health should be responsible for seeing- that the Bill conforms to the decision of the Cabinet. (d) That the Minister of Labour should have authority to introduce the Bill on Friday next. K^TMBFRI?^
fRADP. BIS­
pijoiJ!,
C s ) With reference to Cabinet 18 (22)*
the Cabinet had before them Memoranda
by
Cone Ins 1 on 8,
the rinister of
Labour (Papers CP,-380? and CP.-5864) dealing with the
present position of the dispute in the engineering trade.
The Minister of Labour stated that the view he had
put forward to the Cabinet as to the inexpediency of
appointing a Court of ftnquiry while' the ballots of the
other Unions were being taken, had been endorsed In the
Debate in the House of Coiaiaona.
Since that Debate the two
parties- had again approached each other.
If the results'
of the ballots were adverse to the employers, he did not
think there would be an liamadiate lock-out, hut that dis­
cu a a ions would centime.
On the other' hand, he thought it
unlikely that the look-out notices row in force would he
withdrawn.
SHIPBUILDING
TRADE DISPUTE. (8) With reference to Cabinet 15 ( 8 8 ) , Oonclnsion 3, the Cabinet had before them Memoranda by the Minister of Labour (Papers' G.F.-3810, C P . - 3 8 5 6 and 0.P.-3866) dealing with the present position of the diepite in regard' to wages in the shipbuilding
trader The Minister of labour informed the Cabinet that the employers had posted u p notices intimating a reduction o f wages of 10s.6d. p^r week from March 39th, and a further reduction of 6/- at the end of April,.
The representatives of the men were to meet in conference tomorrow, and they would probably recommend that a ballot bo taken on these notices, and perhaps ask for a postponement of their operation beyond March 39th. The Cabinet agreed —-
That the Lord Privy Seal; the Chancellor of the Exchequer, the Secretary for Scotland, should'be associated wit? the Minister o f Labour in watehing closely the course of the disputes in the Engineering and Shipbuilding industries. i
i
kpsiWP COM-
(4)
in view of the. potential risks of a situation in LiTTft^ OTI THE disputes Ip^FGjpV^^lOIJ
which there are two million unemployed ani serious
JORD^R.
in the Engineering and Shipbuilding trades, the Cabinet agreed
—
That a Cabinet Committee, composed as follows — Home Secretary (In the C h a i r ) , First Lord of the Admiralty, Secretary of State for War, Secretary of State for Air, ' Minister O f Labour, Secretary for Scotland, Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Transport,
The ?-11 o m a y - O e m ral,
The
The
The
The
The
The
The
Mr T. S t . 0 . Hill (Secretary)
should b e formed and summoned by the "oire Secretary as require'' to assist him in any special emergency which might arise in connection with the maintenance of law and order. —
SUPPLY
-"XTTFFa
(5) In connection with the foremoinpt Conclusion, the Secretary of State for Feme Affairs Informed the' Cabinet that the Report on the re-constitution of the Supply and Transport organisation had been prepared in accordance with Conclusion 5
of Home Affaire Committee Meeting 1 0 1 , and would shortly be considered by that Committee 'Paper T . S . C - 1 S 9 ) . -7­
CAH.ING.XJF OF
(6) With reference to Cabinet 22 (si). Appendix 8 ( S ) t
flgRS OP Olfix the Cabinet had before then:, and took note of, the follow­
ing Memoranda dealing with the calling tip of reserves in times of civil unrest.-
A Memorandum by the First Lord of the -
Admiralty (Paper C.P*-3471), A Memorandum by the Secretary of State for War tPaper C .?.-3646), A Memorandum by the Secretary of State for Air (Favor C.P.-5805) . PARLIAMENTARY
(7) The ecnsiderati.cn o f the Memorandum by the Chancellor
;CAN!)IDATURfi gfATE
of the Exchequer on the Parliamentary candidature o f State SERVANTS. servants (Paper G,P,-S8G7), was postponed until" the Prime Minister could h e present. If 1
50VBRWMFW?'
inVEBTISlRfptTTP.
IH
(B) With reference to Cabinet 58 (20), Conclusion 4,
;rrT
'"'"
the Cabinet had before there a
V
mm ran dn in by the Chancellor
of the Exchequer proposing to re rove the present embargo
I
on Government advertisements in the "Pally Herald% inasraeh
as it was a good medium for furthering the sale of Savings
Certificates and that there had been a change in the- personnel
f
of the "card of Directors Paper D.P.-5808),.
"lie fab 1 net agreed -­
^o adhere to the present policy.
O
ii\
AJ
iftth rafarsnoa to Cabinet IS ("&&) Conclusion 4, the Cabinet had before them mi. extract from the draft Minutes of a mooting of the Home Affairs Committee held oa karoh £1st
(0.^,3870) dealing with, a national Health Ixjaar­
aaee Hill prepared by tho Minister of Health (CP.3838) * SEE MIHISflhiH OP HEALTH explained that as a result of a conference with the Consultative Council of Approved Societies it bad been agreed that any increase at present in the rates of contribution would asset with strong: oaposit . ion-
la v l w
4
however, of the need for eeoncaayand the proposals of the Committee on JIatioxial Expenditure, Whioh had been endorsed by the Cabinet, the Societies had agreed to accept a scheme whioh. would secure the economies desired by drawing on the surplus of the Societies instead of levy­
ing additional contributions,,
This was a departure from the precise me thee approved by the Cabinet,
At the meet­
lag of the Home Affairs Committee on the previous day, the financial Secretary of the Treasury bad objected that on the termination of the Minister of Health's scheme in Baa, 19S3- there would probably bo recourse to the Treasury for fresh grants and he asked the Committee to embody in the present Hill the principle that further grants from the Treasury would be barred.
This he suggested could be done by repealing Section I of fee nations! Health insurance Act 1913, THE cHAllCELLGH OP THE S&CHH^UPIK Stated that the object­
ion of the Treasury was that the schema simply postponed trouble to December IS23 and was a short sighted arrangement because after that period the approved Soeiefci.es would again look to the Treasury to make good the deficits. THE &LBIS2SB OP HEALTH stated that it was impossible at present to increase the Health insurance contributions owing to the high rate of unemployment Insurance contribute ions, but if the lattor are reduced by December 1983 It -11­
9 9 9 I.
would be 'easier to advance the former.
To remove all State assistance above the statutory two-ninths would be to surrender the weapon which the State can use in dealing with the doctors and to hand them over to the Approved Societies.
To do this would raise a storm of opposition' in the medical profession and gravely endanger tho structure of medical benefit now embodied in the Health Insurance Act. The PBESXDK8T Of THS BOARD OF EDUCATION as Chairman
of the Home Affairs Committee, stated that except for the
F i n a n c i a l secretary to the -Treasury the Committoe were
unanimously in favour of the proposals of the Minister of
Health.
The Cabinet agreed -
To approve the- proposals of the Minister of Health and authorised the introduction of tho National Health Insurance Bill. -12­
(10) The Secretary of state for the Colonies asked that the Cabinet should b e afforded an opportunity in good time to discuss the financial situation of the country in relation
to the forthcoming Budget. The Chancellor of the Exchequer stated that it was proposed to introduce the Budget on fay 1 s t . TTie Cabinet instructed the Secretary to brin* the request o f the Secretary o f State for the Colonies to the notice of the Prime Minister. IRRIAT-m,
(11)
With reference to Cabinet
1 6 ( 3 2 ) , Conclusion i
%
nitration
on the the Lord Chancellor stated that the prospects of the Irish Boundary .
Treaty Bill going through the House of Lords were extremely good if no grave untoward event took place on the border between Northern and Southern Ireland, and he wished to bo assured, that everything possible was being done to grapple with, the situation on the border. The Secretary of State for the Colonies said that members o f the Irish Republican Army and of the Special s
Constabulary had been allowed to core dangerously near each ether on the boundary. - lie himself had wished to follow the Silesian precedent and draw a cordon by means of British troops, but his proposal had been resisted b y the late Chief of the Imperial General Staff.
He still thought it would h e possible to place troops at critical points, and understood that the Secretary of State for War vras prepared to do this, and that such action would meet with the assent of the Governments of the Worth and South.
He very much, dreaded a collision.
If we took the ao.tion suggested. It would then be possible for him to press Sir James Craig to meet Mr Collins in ccnferor.ee and. to obtain from "r Collins a repudiation, of the revolts on the part of the Irish Republican Army. The Secretary o f State for War said that the question
of semiring something equivalent to a neutral belt was being examined by the General staff, "lie Cabinet agreed
—
""hat the whole question should be considered, immediately by the Provisional Government of Ireland Committee, and that the Lord Chancellor should be invited, to attend.. The Cabinet took note that Viscount Peel had taken the place of Mr Montagu as a member o f the Committee. t ijflR SITOATIOW
INDIA.
(12) With reference to Cabinet 19 ( 3 8 ) , Conclusion 2 .[ix),
the Secretary o f state for India, who was congratulated on ­
his first attendance at the Cabinet, called attention to the decision of the Indian Legislative Assembly to reject the proposal to raise the Customs Duties, thereby increasing
the deficit t o about twelve crores.
The Cabinet agreed
-
That a special meeting of the Cabinet
should b e etimmoned at an early date to
consider t h e general Indian situation.
LpOC^OH OF
pF CAVALRY,
MS)
With reference tc Cabinet is
( 2 8 ) , Conclusion 6 ,
the Cabinet had before then: a Memorandum by the Secretary
of State for War dealing with the reduction of the number
of Gavalry Regiments contemplated by the decision of the
Cabinet on the recommendation of the
Committee
oh national
Expenditure. (Paper G.P.-3868).
The Secretary o f State for War explained the proposals
set forth in detail in his Memorandum, the chief of which
provided that the First and Second Life Cuards should he
amalgamated to form one Regiment of four Squadrons, each
-r the existing regiments providing two squadrons, and the 0
composite regiment to b e called "The Life Guards".
A similar
policy of amalgamation was to be followed in the ease o f the Line Regiments.
He also informed the Cabinet that the pro­
posals had been submitted'to His Majesty the King, and had the approval of the Chief of the Imperial General Staff and of Field Marshal Lord Raig. ;.' The Cabinet approved the recommenda­
, tlons o f the Secretary of State for War. (14) Tiift Secretary of State for War - stated that he wished
to correct a statement he had made at a recent meeting o f the Cabinet.
The number o f batteries o f artillery which it was proposed to disband was 4 7 , and this would leave 170 and not 162, as ho had stated.
affect ed. The Estimates were not (15) The Cabinet took note of the following Conclusions T
of the Committee of *ome Affairs?-
Committee of Home Affairs 107, meeting held on Kerch 9, 1022, at 4-15
CD Valuation and Rating Reform. (2) Rating Machinery. (S) Road Conveyance of Goods by Railway Companies. (4) Harbours, Docks and Piers ' Terporary Increase of Charges) Pill. (5) Tramways Control of Charging Powers. (6) Foot and Mouth Disease, Diseases of Animals Pill, 1 9 2 2 . p.nut-
(Appendix,.) 2, Whitehall Gardens,- 3.W.1, Karch 2 2 , 1022. . U ^ M ^ . .
330
[This Document is the Property of His Britannic Majestys Goxejg Printed
for the Cabinet.
March
1922.
SECRET.
H.A.C. 107th Conclusions. 8! CABINET. COMMITTEE
Conclusions
of
Boom,
a Meeting
House
OF
of the above
of Commons,
S.W.,
HOME
AFFAIRS.
Committee,
held
on Thursday,
in
March
107.
the Ministers'
Conference
9, 1922, at 4/15 P.M.
Present :
T h e E i g h t H o n . H . A. L. FISHER, M . P . , P r e s i d e n t o f t h e B o a r d of E d u c a t i o n
(in the
Chair).
T h e R i g h t H o n . E. SHORTT, K.C., M . P . ,
S e c r e t a r y of S t a t e for H o m e A f f a i r s .
The Right
H o n , S. B A L D W I N ,
P r e s i d e n t of t h e B o a r d of T r a d e .
The R i g h t H o n . Sir A. M O N D ,
M . P . , M i n i s t e r of H e a l t h .
The
Right
Hon.
S i r A.
GRIFFITHB O S C A W E N , M.P., M i n i s t e r o f A g r i ­
culture a n d Fisheries.
Bart.,
T h e R i g h t H o n . R . M U N R O , K.C.," M . P . ,
S e c r e t a r y for S c o t l a n d .
T h e R i g h t H o n . t h e E A R L OF C R A W F O R D
A N D BALCARRES, K . T . , F i r s t C o m m i s sioner of W o r k s .
M.P.,
T h e R i g h t H o n . S i r E . M . POLLOCK,
K . B . E . , K.C., M . P . , A t t o r n e y - G e n e r a l .
-The R i g h t H o n . F . G. K E L L A W A Y , M . P . ,
Postmaster-General.
M r . E. HILTON Y O U N G , D . S . O . , M.P., F i n a n c i a l S e c r e t a r y , T r e a s u r y .
T h e following w e r e also p r e s e n t
Mr. ARTHUR NEAL, M . P . , Parliamentary
S e c r e t a r y , M i n i s t r y of T r a n s p o r t ( f o r
C o n c l u s i o n s 3, 4 a n d 5).
S i r M O N T A G U E B A R L O W , K.B.E., M . P . ,
P a r l i a m e n t a r y Secretary, Ministry of
Labour.
S i r FRANCIS F L O U D , K . C . B . , P e r m a n e n t
S e c r e t a r y , M i n i s t r y of A g r i c u l t u r e a n d
F i s h e r i e s (for C o n c l u s i o n 6).
Sir
A. V.
SYMONDS,
K.C.B.
S e c r e t a r y , M i n i s t r y of H e a l t h .
S i r W I L L I A M F. M A R W O O D , K . C . B . , M i n i s t r y
of T r a n s p o r t ( f o r C o n c l u s i o n s 3, 4 a n d 5).
M r . C A R S O N ROBERTS, M i n i s t r y o f H e a l t h
(for C o n c l u s i o n s 1 a n d 2).
M r . P E M B R O K E WICKS, Secretary
M r . R . B. H O W O R T H , Assistant
[B021]
to the
Committee.
Secretary,
Cabinet.
Second
:
B
1. W i t h r e f e r e n c e t o H . A . C . 8 5 , C o n c l u s i o n 3, t h e C o m m i t t e e
h a d Tinder c o n s i d e r a t i o n t h e R e p o r t o f t h e V a l u a t i o n a n d R a t i n g
R e f o r m C o m m i t t e e ( C P . 3544) a n d M e m o r a n d a t h e r e o n b y t h e
Minister of A g r i c u l t u r e a n d Fisheries a n d t h e M i n i s t e r of H e a l t h
( C P . 3770 a n d C P . 3819).
T h e C o m m i t t e e w e r e r e m i n d e d of t h e n a t u r e of t h e p r i n c i p l e s
embodied in the Report, and it w a s suggested t h a t , assuming
a c c e p t a n c e o f t h o s e p r i n c i p l e s , t h e q u e s t i o n w o u l d a r i s e w h e t h e r in
all t h e c i r c t u n s t a n c e s a B i l l s h o u l d b e d r a f t e d .
T h e d r a f t i n g of s u c h
a Bill w o u l d m e a n h e a v y w o r k f o r t h e P a r l i a m e n t a r y C o u n s e l , a n d i t
w o u l d b e m o s t u n d e s i r a b l e t o p u b l i s h a d r a f t Bill u n l e s s t h e G o v e r n ­
rnent were resolved to proceed with t h e measure.
On t h e other
h a n d , i t w a s p o i n t e d o u t t h a t i t w a s v e r y difficult t o e s t i m a t e t h e
effect of t h e C o m m i t t e e ' s p r o p o s a l s w i t h o u t s e e i n g t h e m in l e g i s l a t i v e
form.
of Agriculture
informed t h e Committee that,
The Minister
while h e w a s in g e n e r a l s y m p a t h y w i t h m u c h of t h e R e p o r t , h e w a s
c o n v i n c e d t h a t t h e p r o p o s a l s , if a d o p t e d , w o u l d h a v e t h e effect of
increasing t h e present heavy burdens on agricultural land, a n d would
accordingly m e e t w i t h s t r o n g opposition b o t h in P a r l i a m e n t a n d in
the country.
H e would like t o have more time t o consider t h e
p r o p o s a l s c o n t a i n e d in t h e M i n i s t e r of H e a l t h s
Memorandum
( C P . 3819) a s i t s e e m e d t o h i m t h a t h i s o b j e c t i o n s t o t h e R e p o r t
could p r o b a b l y b e o v e r c o m e e i t h e r in t h e d i r e c t i o n s i n d i c a t e d in t h e
M e m o r a n d u m o r in o t h e r w a y s .
H e did n o t object t o t h e proposals
in t h e R e p o r t relative t o t h e p a r t t o b e p l a y e d by t h e Crown as
regards valuation.
- The Secretary
for Scotland
urged t h a t t h e Committee should
d e f e r c o m i n g t o a n y final d e c i s i o n u n t i l a f t e r t h e r e c e i p t of t h e
P t e p o r t of L o r d D u n e d i n ' s C o m m i t t e e , w h i c h m i g h t be e x p e c t e d
shortly.
The Committee agreed —
(1.) To d e f e r f u r t h e r c o n s i d e r a t i o n of t h e R e p o r t of t h e V a l u a t i o n
a n d R a t i n g R e f o r m C o m m i t t e e ( C P . 3544) w i t h a v i e w
t o t h e e x a m i n a t i o n b y t h e M i n i s t r y of A g r i c u l t u r e a n d
F i s h e r i e s , t h e M i n i s t r y of H e a l t h a n d t h e T r e a s u r y of
t h e question whether, and, il so, t o w h a t extent, t h e
a g r i c u l t u r a l o b j e c t i o n s t o t h e R e p o r t c o u l d be met.
(2.) T o r e q u e s t t h e C h a i r m a n t o c o n s u l t w i t h t h e L o r d P r i v y
S e a l a s t o t h e p r a c t i c a b i l i t y o f i n t r o d u c i n g l e g i s l a t i o n on
t h i s subject in t h e p r e s e n t Session.
2. T h e C o m m i t t e e h a d u n d e r c o n s i d e r a t i o n M e m o r a n d a C P . 3563
a n d C P . 3583 b y t h e M i n i s t e r o f H e a l t h a n d t h e M i n i s t e r of
A g r i c u l t u r e a n d F i s h e r i e s o n t h e q u e s t i o n o f t h e r a t i n g of m a c h i n e r y .
T h e C o m m i t t e e w e r e r e m i n d e d of t h e d e s i r a b i l i t y of r e m o v i n g
t h e u n c e r t a i n t y a s t o t h e l a w on t h i s s u b j e c t a n d of p l a c i n g E n g l i s h
m a n u f a c t u r e r s on t h e same basis as r e g a r d s t h e r a t i n g of their
m a c h i n e r y as t h e i r Scottish a n d Irish c o m p e t i t o r s .
On t h e o t h e r h a n d , e m p h a s i s w a s l a i d o n t h e oppositiozi w h i c h
w o u l d b e r a i s e d t o p r o p o s a l s s u c h a s t h o s e i n t h e B i l l a n n e x e d to
C P . 3563 b y o r d i n a r y r a t e p a y e r s i n b o t h r u r a l a n d u r b a n a r e a s a n d
o n t h e o b j e c t i o n s t o d e a l i n g p i e c e m e a l w i t h i t e m s of r a t i n g r e f o r m .
The Committee agreed—
T h a t it w a s undesirable t h a t t h e G o v e r n m e n t should introduce
l e g i s l a t i o n o n t h e s u b j e c t of t h e r a t i n g o f m a c h i n e r y a t t h e
present time.
Road Conveyance
of Goods by
Railway
Companies.
3. T h e C o m m i t t e e h a d u n d e r c o n s i d e r a t i o n a M e m o r a n d u m b y
t h e P a r l i a m e n t a r y S e c r e t a r y t o t h e M i n i s t r y of T r a n s p o r t ( C P . 3 7 8 5 )
from which it a p p e a r e d t h a t t h e N o r t h - W e s t e r n a n d M i d l a n d g r o u p
of R a i l w a y C o m p a n i e s w e r e s e e k i n g p o w e r u n d e r a B i l l t o w o r k a
s y s t e m of road vehicles in a n y d i s t r i c t t o w h i c h t h e i r lines g a v e
a c c e s s , f o r t h e c o n v e y a n c e of m e r c h a n d i s e a n d p a s s e n g e r s .
Under
t h e p r e s e n t l a w a p a r t f r o m a n y p a r t i c u l a r p r o v i s i o n s in s p e c i a l A c t s
of P a r l i a m e n t , R a i l w a y C o m p a n i e s c o u l d o n l y d o so i f t h e traffic
o r i g i n a t e d on t h e i r o w n lines.
T h e proposal was very controversial
a n d h a d a r o u s e d o p p o s i t i o n o n t h e p a r t of C a r r y i n g C o m p a n i e s a n d
Local Authorities.
T h e M i n i s t r y o f T r a n s p o r t a s k e d f o r a d e r i s i o n on p o l i c y o n t h e
s e c o n d r e a d i n g of t h e Bill.
T h e v i e w w a s e x p r e s s e d t h a t t h o u g h n o n e of t h e s a f e g u a r d s
p r o v i d e d in t h e B i l l , or u n d e r e x i s t i n g l e g i s l a t i o n , a f f o r d e d c o m p l e t e
p r o t e c t i o n f r o m a b u s e , t h e i r a c c u m u l a t e d effect w o u l d ber-to s a f e g u a r d
t h e i n t e r e s t s of t r a d e r s , r o a d t r a n s p o r t u n d e r t a k i n g s a n d t h e g e n e r a l
public.
I t was recommended t h a t t h e G o v e r n m e n t should s t a t e on
s e c o n d r e a d i n g of t h e B i l l i n t h e H o u s e o f C o m m o n s t h a t t h e y
recognised t h e fears of t r a d e r s , Local A u t h o r i t i e s , a n d o t h e r t r a n s p o r t
u n d e r t a k i n g s : s h o u l d p o i n t o u t t h e d i f f i c u l t y of d e c i d i n g u p o n t h e
p r i n c i p l e of t h e Bill u n t i l t h e s a f e g u a r d s w h i c h c o u l d b e d e v i s e d t o
p r e v e n t t h e g r o w t h of a m o n o p o l y h a d b e e n c o n s i d e r e d in C o m m i t t e e ,
a n d s h o u l d r e s e r v e t h e i r final d e c i s i o n u n t i l t h e t h i r d r e a d i n g .
In reply to a question whether the Government accepted the
g e n e r a l principle t h a t R a i l w a y C o m p a n i e s should c a r r y on r o a d
t r a n s p o r t business, it was pointed out to t h e C o m m i t t e e t h a t some
R a i l w a y C o m p a n i e s a l r e a d y h a d p o w e r t o d o so u n d e r t h e i r s p e c i a l
A c t s of P a r l i a m e n t , t h a t t h e o n l y r e a s o n w h y a n y R a i l w a y C o m p a n y
n e e d c o m e t o P a r l i a m e n t w a s b e c a u s e r o a d traffic b u s i n e s s w a s
outside their charter, a n d t h a t t h e only persons who could bring an
action t o r e s t r a i n t h e m from c a r r y i n g on r o a d t r a n s p o r t w o u l d be
one of t h e i r own s h a r e h o l d e r s .
The Committee agreed—
T h a t d u r i n g t h e d e b a t e on t h e second r e a d i n g of " T h e R a i l w a y s ­
( N o r t h - W e s t e r n a n d M i d l a n d G r o u p ) Bill, 1 9 2 2 , " in t h e
H o u s e of C o m m o n s —
(I.) A
statement should
Government—
be
made
on
behalf
of
the
(i.) T h a t t h e G o v e r n m e n t r e c o g n i s e t h e f e a r s
o f t r a d e r s , of o w n e r s a n d u s e r s
of
m e c h a n i c a l l y - p r o p e l l e d v e h i c l e s , a n d of
Local Authorities ;
(ii.) T h a t i t is difficult t o d e c i d e o n
the
p r i n c i p l e of t h e B i l l u n t i l t h e r e h a s b e e n
d e t a i l e d c o n s i d e r a t i o n i n C o m m i t t e e of
t h e s a f e g u a r d s w h i c h can be d e v i s e d t o
p r e v e n t t h e g r o w t h of a n o p p r e s s i v e
monopoly;
(hi.) T h a t t h e G o v e r n m e n t r e c o m m e n d
the
H o u s e t o s e n d t h e Bill t o C o m m i t t e e ,
t h e final d e c i s i o n of t h e G o v e r n m e n t
being reserved until third reading.
(2.)
[8021]
T h a t t h e G o v e r n m e n t W h i p s s h o u l d b e t a k e n off o n
t h e v o t e f o r t h e s e c o n d r e a d i n g of t h e B i l l .
B
2
Harbours, Docks
arid Piers
(Temporary
Increase of
Charges) Bill.
4. " W i t h r e f e r e n c e t o H . A . C . 99, C o n c l u s i o n 1, t h e C o m m i t t e e
h a d under consideration a M e m o r a n d u m by t h e P a r l i a m e n t a r y
S e c r e t a r y t o t h e M i n i s t r y o f T r a n s p o r t ( C P . 3755), c o v e r i n g t h e
d r a f t of a B i l l e x t e n d i n g t h e i n c r e a s e d c h a r g i n g p o w e r s of h a r b o u r s ,
docks a n d piers o w n e d b y R a i l w a y C o m p a n i e s until t h e l o t h
F e b r u a r y , 19:25, t o g e t h e r w i t h a r e - d r a f t o f t h e B i l l ( s e e A p p e n d i x ) ,
w h i c h w a s c i r c u l a t e d a t t h e meeting-.
T h e P a r l i a m e n t a r y S e c r e t a r y t o t h e M i n i s t r y of T r a n s p o r t
s t a t e d t h a t h e h a d b e e n i n c o m m u n i c a t i o n w i t h r e p r e s e n t a t i v e s of
s h i p o w n e r s a n d t h e F e d e r a t i o n of B r i t i s h I n d u s t r i e s , a n d a s far a s
he w a s a w a r e t h e r e would be n o opposition t o t h e Bill.
The Committee agreed—
To approve t h e Harbours, Docks a n d Piers (Temporary Increase
of C h a r g e s B i l l ) , a n d t o a u t h o r i s e t h e P a r l i a m e n t a r y
S e c r e t a r y t o t h e M i n i s t r y of T r a n s p o r t t o a r r a n g e f o r i t s
introduction in Parliament.
Tramways Control
of Charging
Powers.
5. W i t h r e f e r e n c e t o H . A . C . 9 9 , C o n c l u s i o n 1, t h e C o m m i t t e e
had under consideration a M e m o r a n d u m b y t h e Parliamentary
S e c r e t a r y t o t h e M i n i s t r y of T r a n s p o r t ( C P . 3756), o n t h e p r o p o s a l
to m a k e p e r m a n e n t t h e p r e s e n t t e m p o r a r y legislation
whereby
c h a r g e s for t r a m w a y u n d e r t a k i n g s a r e f i x e d b y t h e M i n i s t e r of
T r a n s p o r t o n t h e a d v i c e of a C o m m i t t e e .
T h e H o m e Affairs C o m m i t t e e h a d d e c i d e d a t t h e m e e t i n g
a b o v e r e f e r r e d t o t h a t t h e q u e s t i o n s h o u l d b e p o s t p o n e d for f u r t h e r
consideration.
A Bill w a s n o w s u b m i t t e d s h o w i n g t h e e x a c t effect
of t h e p r o p o s a l s m a d e , w h i c h , i t w a s u n d e r s t o o d , w e r e
being
-supported b y a l a r g e m a j o r i t y of t h e m u n i c i p a l t r a m w a y u n d e r ­
takings, to whom enquiries h a d been addressed.
T h e y also received
t h e u n a n i m o u s s u p p o r t of p r i v a t e t r a m w a y u n d e r t a k i n g s .
The Parliamentary
Secretary
to the Ministry
of
Transport
s t a t e d t h a t , a s t h e r e s u l t of f u r t h e r e n q u i r i e s , h e f o u n d t h a t he
-could n o t n o w a d v i s e t h a t a n y f u r t h e r s t e p s s h o u l d b e t a k e n t h a n
t o i n c l u d e " T h e S t a t u t o r y U n d e r t a k i n g s ( T e m p o r a r y I n c r e a s e of
C h a r g e s ) A c t , 1918," a n d " T h e T r a m w a y s ( T e m p o r a r y I n c r e a s e of
C h a r g e s ) A c t , 1920," in t h e E x p i r i n g L a w s C o n t i n u a n c e A c t . I t was
felt t h a t s t r o n g o p p o s i t i o n w o u l d b e m e t w i t h i n P a r l i a m e n t t o a n y
p r o p o s a l p e r m a n e n t l y t o d e p r i v e P a r l i a m e n t of i t s r i g h t t o h e a r
a p p l i c a t i o n s f r o m t r a m w a y u n d e r t a k i n g s , b y w a y o f p r i v a t e Bills or
P r o v i s i o n a l O r d e r s , for p e r m i s s i o n t o i n c r e a s e t h e i r c h a r g e s
The
Poot and Mouth
Disease.
Diseases of Animals
Bill, 1922.
C o m m i t t e e a g r e e d in t h e c o u r s e r e c o m m e n d e d b y t h e
P a r l i a m e n t a r y S e c r e t a r y t o t h e M i n i s t r y of T r a n s p o r t .
6. W i t h r e f e r e n c e t o C a b i n e t 15 (22), M i n u t e 7, t h e C o m m i t t e e
h a d u n d e r c o n s i d e r a t i o n a M e m o r a n d u m b y t h e M i n i s t e r of A g r i ­
c u l t u r e a n d F i s h e r i e s ( C P . 3 8 2 1 ; , c o v e r i n g t h e d r a f t of " T h e
D i s e a s e s of A n i m a l s B i l l , 1922," t o r e m o v e t e m p o r a r i l y t h e l i m i t o n
m o n i e s p r o v i d e d b y P a r l i a m e n t for t h e p u r p o s e s o f t h e D i s e a s e s of
Animals Acts.
I t w a s s t a t e d in t h e M e m o r a n d u m t h a t in c o n s e q u e n c e of t h e
a g r e e m e n t sanctioned b y t h e Cabinet, t h a t t h e cost of t h e recent o u t ­
b r e a k of F o o t a n d M o u t h D i s e a s e s h o u l d b e d i v i d e d e q u a l l y b e t w e e n
t h e E x c h e q u e r a n d t h e rates, it would be necessary t o authorise the
p a y m e n t o f 500,000?. i n t o t h e C a t t l e P l e u r o - P n e u m o n i a A c c o u n t .
A t p r e s e n t a l i m i t o f 140,000?.. w a s i m p o s e d b y S e c t i o n 18 of " T h e
D i s e a s e s of A n i m a l s A c t , 1894," o n t h e m o n i e s w h i c h m i g h t b e
provided by P a r l i a m e n t for.this purpose.
The Minister
of Agriculture
s t a t e d t h a t t h e details of t h e Bill
had been agreed with t h e Treasury.
The Committee agreed—
T o a p p r o v e t h e d r a f t of t h e " D i s e a s e s o f A n i m a l s B i l l , 1922,"
a n d t o a u t h o r i s e t h e M i n i s t e r of A g r i c u l t u r e t o a r r a n g e f o r
i t s i n t r o d u c t i o n in P a r l i a m e n t .
2, Whitehall
March
Gardens,
S.W. 1,
10, 1922.
APPENDIX.
H A R B O U R S , D O C K S A N D PIERS (TEMPORARY INCREASE OF CHARGES). Redraft
of a, Bill
to Amend
and Extend
the Duration
of " The Harbours,
Piers (Temporary
Increase
of Charges)
Act, 1 9 2 0 . " Docks
and
Be it enacted b y t h e K i n g ' s Most Excellent Majesty, b y a n d w i t h t h e advice a n d
consent of t h e L o r d s S p i r i t u a l a n d T e m p o r a l a n d C o m m o n s in t h i s p r e s e n t P a r l i a m e n t
a s s e m b l e d , a n d b y t h e a u t h o r i t y of t h e s a m e , a s f o l l o w s : —
1.—(1.) P r o v i s o ' ( / ; ) o f S u b s e c t i o n (1) o f S e c t i o n I of " T h e H a r b o u r s , D o c k s a n d
P i e r s ( T e m p o r a r y I n c r e a s e o f C h a r g e s ) A c t , 1920" ( h e r e i n a f t e r r e f e r r e d t o a s " t h e
p r i n c i p a l A c t " ) , . s h a l l n o t a p p l y t o a n y p o r t , h a r b o u r , d o c k o r p i e r f o r m i n g p a r t of t h e
u n d e r t a k i n g o f a r a i l w a y c o m p a n y , b u t i n c o n s i d e r i n g a n y m o d i f i c a t i o n of t h e s t a t u t o r y
p r o v i s i o n s r e g u l a t i n g t h e c h a r g e s t o b e m a d e by a n y r a i l w a y c o m p a n y i n r e s p e c t o f a n y
such p o r t , h a r b o u r , dock o r pier, r e g a r d shall b e h a d t o t h e c h a r g e s in force a t s i m i l a r
ports, harbours, docks or piers ( w h e t h e r forming p a r t of t h e u n d e r t a k i n g of a railway
c o m p a n y o r not), a n d t o t h e cost of labour a n d m a t e r i a l s , a n d n o modification of such
s t a t u t o r y provisions shall be a u t h o r i s e d which would increase t h e charges b e y o n d such
a m o u n t s a s t h e r a i l w a y c o m p a n y were, a t t h e passing of t h i s A c t , entitled t o c h a r g e b y
v i r t u e of S e c t i o n 3 o f " T h e M i n i s t r y o f T r a n s p o r t A c t , 1919."
[(2.) I n t h i s s e c t i o n t h e e x p r e s s i o n " p i e r " i n c l u d e s a w h a r f , q u a y o r j e t t y . ]
2.—(1.) T h i s A c t m a y b e c i t e d a s " T h e H a r b o u r s , D o c k s a n d P i e r s ( T e m p o r a r y
I n c r e a s e o f C h a i g e s ) A c t , 1922," a n d t h e p r i n c i p a l A c t a n d t h i s A c t m a y b e c i t e d
t o g e t h e r a s " T h e H a r b o u r s , D o c k s a n d P i e r s ( T e m p o r a r y I n c r e a s e of C h a r g e s ) A c t s ,
1920 t o 1922."
(2.) T h e p r i n c i p a l A c t , a s a m e n d e d ' b y t h i s A c t , s h a l l h a v e effect u n t i l t h e l o t h
d a y of- F e b r u a r y , 1925, a n d S u b s e c t i o n (4) o f S e c t i o n 80 o f " T h e R a i l w a y s A c t , 1921 "
(which continues t h e Bates Advisory C o m m i t t e e in existence so long a s it m a y b e
n e c e s s a r y for t h e p u r p o s e s o f r e f e r e n c e s u n d e r t h e p r i n c i p a l A c t ) , s h a l l h a v e effect
accordingly.
o