Opening hymn: “The old rugged
Cross.”
Opening prayer:
ELDER BILL MILLS IS
•
•
•
•
The husband of one.
The father of 16 (including in-laws).
The grandfather of 8 so far.
A Christian Priest, Ecumenist, Theologian
& Apologist. A Physicist, and an
International Attorney.
•
1
MERE CHRISTIANITY
ARE LDS CHRISTIANS?
THE BELIEFS COMMON TO ALL
CHRISTIANS ARE SO
DIFFERENT FROM OTHER
BELIEFS, THAT DIFFERENCES
WITHIN CHRISTIANITY ARE NOT
COMPARABLE!
2
MERE CHRISTIANITY
ARE LDS CHRISTIANS?
ARE THE BELIEFS COMMON TO
ALL CHRISTIANS SO
DIFFERENT FROM OTHER
BELIEFS, THAT DIFFERENCES
WITHIN CHRISTIANITY ARE NOT
COMPARABLE?
3
The texts for this course are:
1. Handbook of Christian Apologetics, Kreeft
& Tacelli 1994, Intervarsity Press.
2. Mere Christianity, C.S. Lewis 1943, 1945,
1952, Macmillan Pub. 1996 Touchstone
edition.
3. HOW WIDE THE DIVIDE, Stephen Robinson
& ? Intervarsity press. ?
4. THE ARTICLES OF FAITH: A NEW
WITNESS OF JESUS CHRIST, Bruce
McConkie. Bookcraft. ?
4
DR. BILL MILLS IS
•
•
•
•
The husband of one.
The father of eight.
The grandfather of 7 so far.
A Christian Priest, Ecumenist,
Theologian & Apologist. A
Physicist, and an International
Attorney.
5
I am not
• An official representative of the
LDS church.
• Inerrant, infallible, nor immune
from mere Scribner error.
6
I Am
• Humble & grateful!
• An LDS theologian & minister.
• The worlds foremost, undisputed expert &
authority in two fields:
• What I believe, (whether or not I believe
something) and Why I believe it.
• Confident That there is no distance
between my beliefs and those of the LDS
world-wide leadership.
• Sharing our common LDS beliefs
differently.
7
• A life long LDS-Christian.
I am
• A born again Biblical Christian who is LDS.
• Saved By Christ through Faith in Him.
• A ransomed, adopted member of Christ’s
universal & invisible Church¹, which is both
larger and older than the LDS community
within her.
Christ’s universal &
invisible Church
LDS
Christians
Non-LDS 8
Christians
LDS-Christians are Christians in
the centre of “Mere Christianity.”
LDS
CHRISTIANS
“ARMINIAN”
CHRISTIANS
Biblical
“MERE”
CHRISTIANITY
9
Are LDS-Christians, Christians in
the centre of “Mere Christianity”?
LDS
CHRISTIANS
“ARMINIAN”
CHRISTIANS
Biblical
“MERE”
CHRISTIANITY
10
My remarks are
Intended to Explain that:
• LDS-Christian theology is completely
within common, agreed, “orthodox” or
central Christianity, what Baxter calls
“Mere Christianity” as taught by C.S.
Lewis in his book by that title¹.
• The LDS occupy one centrally located
room within that larger Building or Hall
that is Christendom as analogized by
Lewis.
11
This class is intended
to Explore whether:
• LDS-Christian theology is completely
within common, agreed, “orthodox” or
central Christianity, what Baxter calls
“Mere Christianity” as taught by C.S.
Lewis in his book by that title¹.
• The LDS occupy one centrally located
room within that larger Building or Hall
that is Christendom as analogized by
Lewis.
12
This class is not
• Intended to explore, explain or defend
LDS distinctives¹ beyond exploring the
Biblical authority for some, to see if
they fit within “Mere Christianity”.
• It is helpful to focus on the present
beliefs and practices of any
Communion, because we are not there,
in history, and they are not here, to
explain, defend, or even to speak for
themselves².
13
I have several reasons for not
doing More:
• The questions that divide Christians
often involve very complicated and
finely nuanced points of high theology
and ecclesiastical history which cannot
be appropriately addressed here.
• Exact, highly nuanced positions on
these complex questions often differ
within Communions, as well as
between them. This is often true for
LDS.
14
For examples
• Many LDS world leaders may not yet be familiar
with nuances of “T.U.L.I.P.*” Calvinism or Catholic
“Eucharistic presence*” that may make these
doctrines acceptable to LDS. It may be that we
agree!
• Many LDS, myself included, simply don’t
understand some “Orthodox” non-LDS doctrines
such as: Some of the finest points of
“Trinitarianism*” and “Ongoing dialogic
revelation”. It may be that we agree!
• Many disputed subjects, such as Evolution, the
age of the earth, & Contraception, are not settled
by LDS doctrine, but left to the individual member.
15
• Some of us do agree, on some, or all of these!
Finally
I agree with C.S. Lewis that discussions
of these disputed points have no
tendency at all to bring outsiders into
the Christian fold. Our disagreements
are best discussed in private, only in the
presence of those firmly committed to
“Mere Christianity”.Complementary
Functional &
Arminianism
Calvinism
Ontological
Trinitarianism
Non-Complementary
Functional &
Ontological16
Trinitarianism
We are here to clarify our
understanding of LDS theology
and to see whether it fits, & if so,
where it fits, within “Mere Christianity.”
As Lewis observed*, I also find it very
consoling that at the centre of every
Communion, where her truest children
dwell, we are closest to every other in
spirit, if not in doctrine. I believe that
Christ is at the centre of every
Communion, speaking with one
voice to all of His children.
17
I love to have
Long deep conversations about highly
complex and finely nuanced points of
theology with a few sincere Christians.
I especially appreciate opportunities to
share with those of other Communions,
who often share with me sacred truths in
ways new to me.
I believe that we have much to teach each
other, and to learn from each other.
18
Different or more?
• Peter Kreft observed that Catholics
believe everything that Protestants
do, and more.
• The same is often true for LDS.
• Often on the same subjects, such
as priesthood, authority, & canon.
19
It is very helpful to distinguish
between differing biblical beliefs,
additional biblical beliefs, extrabiblical beliefs, and unbiblical
beliefs. The LDS do have some
differing, additional, and/or
extra-biblical beliefs, as all
communions do. The LDS do not
have any unbiblical beliefs!
20
It is also very helpful to avoid
“disputing about words.” 2 Tim.
2:14, 1 Tim. 6:4-5. Because LDSChristian theology is restorative and
not traditional nor reformative, and
because it developed in relative
isolation, it is absolutely necessary
to “translate” LDS words & phrases
into various Christian “dialects” and
Vice versa.
21
The Father,
The Son,
The Holy
Spirit
“Mere
Christianity”
Beliefs
unique to
each
communion
22
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis¹ about:
The Bible as the Word of God, Jesus as the
Son of God and salvation as the gift of God.
1. The reality of absolute right &
wrong: What God has placed in
our hearts² & in the Bible.
2. Our universal failure to do what
we know to be right and to not do
what we know to be wrong: Our
need to be saved.
23
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis about:
1. The right understanding of God.
2. The Invasion of evil into His
creation.
3. The Shocking Alternative: Jesus!
4. The Perfect Penitent: Jesus!
5. The Practical Conclusion:
Allowing Him to Save us, including
all that this entails*!
24
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis about:
1.
2.
3.
4.
The Three Parts of Morality¹:
The “Cardinal Virtues”²:
Social Morality:
Morality & Psychoanalysis³:
25
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis about:
5.
6.
7.
8.
Sexual Morality:
Christian Marriage¹:
Forgiveness²:
The Great Sin: Pride.
26
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis about:
9. Love, (Charity):
10.Hope:
11.Faith, (In the primary sense¹):
12. Faith, (In the secondary sense²):
27
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis about:
1.
2.
3.
4.
Making & Begetting:
The Three-Personal God¹:
Time & Beyond Time:
The Good Infection:
28
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis about:
5.
6.
7.
8.
The Obstinate Toy Soldiers:
The Worth of a Single Soul:
“Let’s Pretend”:
Christianity being both Hard &
Easy:
29
All Christians agree with C.S. Lewis about:
9. The Importance of Counting the
Cost¹:
10.Nice People or New Men:
11. The New Men.
This is what we mean by
“Mere Christianity”!
30
All Christians
agree about:
1. The authority of God: Natural &
Special revelation.
2. The Bible: Inerrant & Infallible.
Reason & Inspiration¹.
3. God².
4. Jesus Christ³.
5. Christ’s Death.
6. Christ’s Resurrection.
31
All Christians
agree about:
7. The Holy Spirit.
8. Man¹ & sin.
9. Salvation.
10.The Church².
11.Angels, Satan, & Demons.
12.Things to Come.
32
All Christians agree
about: The 7 Ordinances,
Rites or Sacraments:
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
Baptism.
Confirmation.
The Lord’s Supper.
Marriage.
Anointing/Administrating to the
ill/Afflicted.
6. Forgiveness of sins.
7. Ministerial Callings/Holy Orders.
33
All Christians
agree with Spurgeon that:
“Justification without sanctification is not true
salvation at all. It would call the leper clean,
but leave him to die of his disease. It would
pardon the traitor, but leave him forever an
enemy of our King. This would leave an
endless and hopeless task before us …
34
All Christians
agree with Spurgeon that:
We must remember that Our dear Lord
came to save us in at least three ways:
First, from the penalty of sin. Next, from
the power of sin. And finally from the
presence of sin in our lives. And He will,
great miracle that it would be! If we will let
Him!”
¹“For we are not merely saved
From sin; we are saved for sonship.”
35
The Father,
The Son,
The Holy Spirit
Beliefs unique to
each communion
“Mere
Christianity”
36
Members of the Church of
Jesus Christ of Latter-Day
Saints are Christians!
One can look at this in different ways, but
everyway one looks at it, All Christians,
including LDS Share all of the beliefs
common to “Mere Christianity”, and All
Christians have some differing or
additional beliefs.
37
Are members of the Church of
Jesus Christ of Latter-Day
Saints Christians?
One can look at this in different ways, but
everyway one looks at it, do All Christians,
including LDS Share all of the beliefs
common to “Mere Christianity,” and do
All Christians have some differing or
additional beliefs?
38
The LDS have many beliefs
• In areas where the Bible is unclear or nearly
silent, such as the “soul”, and which day to
keep Sabbath, as all communions do. (The
LDS stand with the vast majority of
Christians on both of these questions.)
• None of us seem happy to admit that the
Bible is unclear or largely silent on points
that we insist on affirming or negating
anyway.
• Additional LDS scriptures sometimes
address these areas. They never contradict
39
the bible!
I believe what I do because
the Bible says it.
• “The Bible says it, I believe it, that settles
it.”
• This is often true of LDS distinctives¹.
• I consider additional LDS scriptures to be
supportive of, and subordinate to, the
Bible.
• I interpret other scriptures within a biblical
context.
• Therefore, for me, there can never be a
40
contradiction between them.
Several Examples:
• The Book of Mormon: Another Testament
of Jesus Christ, (B. of M.) clearly teaches
the immortality of the soul. Some
Christians dispute this doctrine. LDS are
grateful that the B. of M. strengthens and
clarifies this Biblical doctrine. Alma
40:7,11-14 etc.
• The B. of M. has always clearly condemned
polygamy, including serial monogamy & all
sexual sins. I believe this is also the 41
correct Biblical doctrine. Jacob 2:22-35.
Another Testament of
Jesus Christ
•
The overwhelming central theme of the
B. of M. is salvation & redemption
through faith in Jesus Christ:
• “And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in
Christ, we preach of Christ, we prophesy
of Christ, and we write according to our
prophecies, that our children may know
to what source they may look for a
remission of their sins.” 2 Ne. 25:26.
42
Another Testament of
Jesus Christ
“Wherefore, ye must press forward with
a steadfastness in Christ…feasting upon
the word of Christ…this is the way; and
there is none other way nor name given
under heaven whereby man can be
saved…this is the doctrine of Christ, and
the only and true doctrine of the Father,
and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost,
which is one God, without end. Amen.” 43
2 Ne. 31:20-21.
Another Testament of
Jesus Christ
“I glory in plainness; I glory in truth; I glory in
my Jesus, for He hath redeemed my soul from
hell…I have charity…(&)…great faith in Christ
…But behold, for none of these, (all people) can I
hope except they shall be reconciled unto Christ…
hearken unto these words and believe in Christ;
and if ye believe not in these words believe in
Christ…(Christ’s words) teach all men that they
should do good… Judge ye, (Christ’s words) for
Christ will show unto you, (Christ’s words) with
power and great glory…
44
2 Ne. 33:6-11 (emphasis & parentheticals added).
The Purpose of Another
Testament of Jesus Christ
1. “That ye may know that ye must all
stand before the judgment-seat of Christ”.
(Mormon 3:20)
2. “That ye may believe the Gospel of
Jesus Christ.” (Mormon 3:21; 5:15)
3. To provide another witness “that
Jesus (is) The very Christ and The very
God.”
(Mormon 3:21 ; 5:14)
4. To “Persuade all ye ends of the earth
45
to repent.” (Mormon 3:22)
The Gospel of Jesus Christ
According to the B. of M.
1. Jesus submitted to the will of the
Father & was lifted up upon the cross
that He might draw all men unto Himself.
2. We must accept His Atonement for
our sins in order to be forgiven.
3. Jesus was resurrected from the dead.
4. Jesus Will resurrect & judge all of us.
5. We must repent in order to be
forgiven.
46
The Gospel of Jesus Christ
According to the B. of M.
6. Jesus has commanded us to be
baptized.
7. We are saved from our sins by
our faith in Jesus Christ.
8.The Gift of the Holy Spirit comes to
those who repent and are Baptized.
9.Through Faith in Christ, those who
are saved will endure to the end.
47
Another Testament of
Jesus Christ
“Yea, come unto Christ, and be perfected
in Him, and deny yourselves of all
ungodliness; and if ye shall deny
yourselves of all ungodliness and love God
with all your might, mind and strength,
then is His grace sufficient for you, that by
His grace ye may be perfect in Christ; and
if by the grace of God ye are perfect in
Christ, ye can in nowise deny the power 48of
God.” Moroni 10:32.
Another Testament of
Jesus Christ
“And again, if ye by the grace of God are
perfect in Christ, and deny not His power, then
are ye sanctified in Christ by the grace of God,
through the shedding of the blood of Christ,
which is the covenant of the Father unto the
remission of your sins, that ye become holy,
without spot. And now I bid unto all, farewell.
I soon go to rest in the paradise of God, until
my spirit and body shall again reunite, and I
am brought forth triumphant…Amen.”
49
Moroni 10:33-34.
C. H. Spurgeon
Threefold Salvation
“Justification without sanctification is
not true salvation at all. It would call the
leper clean, but leave him to die of his
disease. It would pardon the traitor, but
leave him forever an enemy of our King.
This would leave an endless and
hopeless task before us …
50
C. H. Spurgeon
Threefold Salvation
We must remember that Our dear Lord
came to save us in at least three ways:
First, from the penalty of sin. Next,
from the power of sin. And finally from
the presence of sin in our lives. And He
will, great miracle that it would be! If we
will let Him!”
¹“For we are not merely saved
From sin; we are saved for sonship.”
51
The LDS do not claim
infallibility for their leaders.
• Our prophets are prophets because they are
called of God to: Live Biblical Christianity,
teach it, and apply it in modern times,
pastoring a world–wide communion.
• They are politically neutral and would never
tell anyone how to govern. They do not tell
Senators Harry Reed, Orin Hatch, or their
other LDS colleagues how to govern.
• They would never be sustained in, nor
excused for, unbiblical teachings, nor for 52an
unbiblical lifestyle. Gal. 2:11.
Our cannon is open.
His Gospel is closed.
• Christ’s Gospel, Doctrine, and Standards
are Biblical & eternal. They are biblically
and eternally established, and therefore
not subject to change or revision.
• God has promised to continually
increase our understanding of these
things.
• We have promised God to continually
increase our obedience to these things.
53
Our cannon is open.
His Gospel is closed.
This is largely semantic. We include our
“Catechism,” or “Confession, ” (called “DOCTRINE
& COVENANTS”) in our canon. In the last 175 years
our canon, “Catechism” has been enlarged three
times, to: Prohibit polygamy. Prohibit racial
discrimination in ministerial ordination, and to
dispel the exclusivity heresy, partially through
clarifying the temporary state of the dead in Christ.
One can biblically regret the necessity to do so, but
not the (righteousness) rectitude of doing so. One
might even wish other Communions would do so to
54
remove various persisting heresies.
Our cannon is open.
His Gospel Doctrine is closed.
In one sense LDS doctrine is exactly equal to our
Cannon¹. In another larger sense, LDS doctrine is
equal to all truth. We agree with Thomas Aquinas
That “St. Thomas was willing to allow the one truth
to be approached by two paths, precisely because
he was sure there was only one truth. Because the
Faith was the one truth, nothing discovered in nature
could ultimately contradict the Faith. Because the
Faith was the one truth, nothing really deduced from
the Faith could ultimately contradict the facts. It was
in truth a curiously daring confidence in the reality of
his religion; and though some may linger to dispute
55
it, it has been justified…” ²
Our cannon is open.
His Gospel Doctrine is closed.
“…The scientific facts, which were supposed to
contradict the Faith in the nineteenth century, are nearly
all of them regarded as unscientific fictions in the 20th
century. Even the materialists have fled from materialism; and those who lectured us about determinism in
psychology are already talking about indeterminism in
matter.” G.K Chesterton, Saint Thomas Aquinas 1956.
pg. 70. We also agree With Scott Hahn² that something
is true not because it is doctrine, it is doctrine because
it is true. Even if our Cannon does not specifically
affirm that 𝟐 + 𝟐 = 𝟒, or negate that 𝟒 + 𝟒 = 𝟗, one can
say in an epistemologically responsible way that LDS
56
doctrine affirms the former & negates the later.
This leads us to Biblical
Sufficiency and Inerrancy
• I believe in the absolute Sufficiency¹ of
the Holy Bible.
• I believe in the absolute Inerrancy of
the Holy Bible.
• This is an excellent example of LDS
and non-LDS Christians talking past
each other, misunderstanding each
other.
57
• LDS are generally unaware of:
The 1977 Chicago Evangelical
Convention on Biblical Inerrancy, and
what the C.C.C. states on these matters.
What non-LDS Christians mean by
“Inerrancy” and “Sufficiency” generally.
• The LDS use the KJV Bible and
recognize it’s limitations in text and
translation.
• We are grateful for/to the U.B.S. and
others who labor to mitigate these
limitations.
58
My Bible is the U.B.S. G.N.T.
& the B.H.S., which is mostly
free of these limitations.
• The LDS also see Christian Communions
who do not understand clear Biblical
teachings.
• We are grateful for the B. of M. which
supports and clarifies the Bible and helps
to save us from these errors.
• The essential, central, & Eternal nature of
Christ, the reality of sin, & Hell, A literal
resurrection, & the absolute Oneness of59
The Bible, being
Inerrant and Sufficient:
• Has led billions into Salvation &
Everlasting Life through faith in Christ.
• The LDS are grateful for additional
inspired testimonies of Jesus Christ,
which we also believe to be scripture,
(such as the B. of M.) that have also led
tens of millions to Christ, and helped
tens of millions to become better
Christians.
60
Biblical exegesis or
interpretation:
• The LDS tend to be more literal, (concretefundamental) when interpreting the Bible
than are many other Christians.
• It is ironic that this more literal tendency
often leads LDS to distinctives¹ that other
Christians consider not just wrong, but
unbiblical.
• These distinctives¹ are likely to be
“concrete”, & therefore unplatonic or 61
unaristotilian, rather than unbiblical.
LDS are not
always literal:
• We are not, for the most part, “Young
earth creationists.¹”
• Benny Hill Joke: “Cast your bread upon
the waters and they will return 100
fold!” Who wants 100 loves of wet,
salty bread?”
• But the default position, absent
compelling evidence, such as
metaphor, parable & hyperbole, is for a
62
We believe:
• In a world wide flood. I don’t know
when it occurred.
• That all of the people and miracles in
the Bible are historically true. We
believe that Adam, Noah, Jonah¹ and
Job were historical people whose real
lives typified Christ and serve as an
example for our own lives. I don’t
know when they lived.
63
Two additional rules:
• Read with ”new eyes”: Imagine you
are an “E.T.”, or an agnostic with no
prior theological, ethical, or
philosophical bias. What does the text
actually say?
• If I am inclined to understand anything
other than that, I must first answer this
question: “If the author meant
something else, why didn’t he say
something else?
64
The Bible determines doctrine,
which determines behavior!
Bible
Doctrine
Behavior
Not
Behavior determines doctrine, which
determines how he interpret the Bible!
Behavior
Doctrine
Bible
65
Two additional thoughts:
• “Who can learn anything new
and not find it a shock?” John
Wheeler
• It is helpful to regularly review
even our most fundamental
understandings in light of our
most recent discoveries.
66
What vs. exactly how &
how best described:
• C.S. Lewis observed that Christians
agree on what happens and what is,
but often disagree on exactly how
things happen or how best to
describe what is.
• Lewis uses the Atonement as one
example.
• This is often true for the LDS and
other Christians.
67
Six blind men & an elephant:
• Each Christian Communion tends
to focus more on some aspects of
“Mere Christianity” than others.
• The LDS are no different
• Individually & collectively, God is
not finished with us yet.
68
Silly nonsense!
Statements that LDS don’t believe in
“Mere Christianity”, often called
“Orthodoxy” because we describe it
differently, and have a different “exactly
how” is Silly Nonsense!
Are we to judge exactly which “bad
theology” God’s Grace, through Christ’s
Atonement can not compensate for? That
would make others, “an offender for a
word.” Is. 29:21, 2 Tim. 2:14, 1 Tim. 6:4-5.
69
Silly nonsense!
One can be a Born again Biblical Christian,
and yet not agree with every word of one or
more of the extra-biblical creeds, (Especially
with English words, when the creeds were
originally written in Latin!) even when most of
traditional Christianity has adopted them.
One should be very humble & cautious
about dissenting minority opinions, but these
are very complicated, finely nuanced points of
high theology, having nothing to do with
Salvational doctrines, and sincere Christians
70
do sometimes disagree.
The LDS Creed:
“The fundamental principles of our religion
are the (Biblical) testimony of the Apostles and
Prophets, concerning Jesus Christ; that He died,
was buried, and rose again the third day, and
ascended into heaven; and all other things which
pertain to our religion are only appendages to it.
But in connection with these, we believe in the
gift of the Holy Ghost, the power of faith, the
enjoyment of the spiritual gifts according to the
will of God, the restoration of the house of Israel,
and the final triumph of truth. “Joseph Smith Jr.
71
May 8, 1838.
We believe:
• We believe in God, The Eternal Father,
God, His only Son, Jesus Christ, and in
God, The Holy Spirit.
• We believe that They are eternally One
God.
• We are not Arians, Pelagians, Tri-theists,
Modalists, Polytheists, nor anything else
outside of “Mere Christianity.”
• We believe that Jesus is Eternally
72
Begotten of the Father.
We believe:
• We believe that, “In the beginning,” Jesus
was God, One with the Father, through Him,
all things were created.
• We believe in His Virgin birth, His sinless
life, His Ransom, Vicarious, Propitious,
Expiatory, Atoning, Sacrificial Death, and His
Literal, Physical, Historical, Resurrection.
• We do not find the extra-biblical term,
“Trinity” particularly helpful. We prefer the
73
biblical term, “Godhead” Col. 2:9.
We believe:
• We believe that Every Word in the Bible is the
inspired word of God, scripture, (B.H.S., G.N.T.).
• We believe in the Finished, Saving, Sufficient
Atonement of Jesus Christ: “Teleste!”
• I know that He suffered & died for me personally, not
corporally. Through faith in Him, I have been forgiven
of my sins and I have the assurance of eternal life!¹
• We believe in Salvation by grace through faith in
Christ, as described in “Mere Christianity”.
• We do have specific and sometimes distinctive views
of exactly how we are saved, within “Mere
74
Christianity”, as do all Communions².
We believe:
• We also have specific and sometimes
distinctive views on exactly how God is
both three and One, based upon what
the Bible, (not Plato or Aristotle)
actually says: John. 14:28; 17:21; Matt.
3:16-17; Mk.13:32; etc.
• All of our views are completely
within “Mere Christianity”.
75
We believe in
13 Articles of Faith:
1. We believe in God, The Eternal Father,
and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the
Holy Ghost.
2. We believe that men will be punished for
their own sins, and not for Adam’s
transgression.*
3. We believe that through the atonement of
Christ, all mankind may be saved, by
obedience to the laws and ordinances of
76
the Gospel.
We believe in
13 Articles of Faith:
4.
We believe that the first principles and
ordinances of the Gospel are: First, Faith
in the Lord Jesus Christ; second,
Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion
for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying
on of hands for the Gift of the Holy Ghost.
5. We believe that a man must be called of
God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of
hands by those who are in authority, to
preach the Gospel and administer in the77
We believe in
13 Articles of Faith:
6. We believe in the same organization that
existed in the primitive church, namely,
Apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers,
evangelists, and so forth.
7. We believe in the gift of tongues,
prophecy, revelation, visions, healing,
interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
8. We believe the Bible to be the Word of
God as far as it is translated correctly. We
also believe the Book of Mormon to be the
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Word of God.
We believe in
13 Articles of Faith:
9.
We believe all that God has revealed, all that
He does now reveal, and we believe that He
will yet reveal many great and important
things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
10. We believe in the literal gathering of Israel
and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that
Zion (the new Jerusalem) will be built upon
the American continent; that Christ will reign
personally upon the earth; and, that the earth
will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal
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glory.
We believe in
13 Articles of Faith:
11. We claim the privilege of worshiping
Almighty God according to the dictates of
our won conscience, and allow all men the
same privilege, let them worship how,
where, or what they may.
12. We believe in being subject to kings’
presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in
obeying, honoring, and sustaining the
law.
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We believe in
13 Articles of Faith:
13. We believe in being honest, true, chaste,
benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to
all men; indeed, we may say that we
follow the admonition of Paul- We believe
all things, we hope all things, we have
endured many things, and hope to endure
all things. If there is anything virtuous,
lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy,
we seek after these things.”
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Orthodoxy
beyond C.S. Lewis:
• Each time I re-read Christian Apologists from
diverse Communions I am amazed at how much
we agree, and how often we say the same things
in completely different ways.
• I see an “Inverse Mandelbrot’s Fractal effect.”
The closer I look at the theological differences
between Communions, the less difference I find.
• When I claim doing “A” results in “C” and you
claim doing “B” results in “C”, both without
exclusivity, we are not disagreeing, especially
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when “A” and “B” are more than 99% the same!
LDS are mostly “Arminian:”
We stand with the majority of Christians
now & historically on the “T.U.L.I.P.”
distinctives, but if Calvinists & others
agree with Lewis’s “Mere
Christianity”,(esp. pgs. 130-132, Book IV,
etc.) Bruce Milne’s “KNOW THE TRUTH”,
(esp. Pgs. 182-204 etc.) we have simply
talked past each other again, and in fact,
and in truth, we all stand together!
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SALVATION
PAST
PRESENT
REDEMPTION
REDEMPTION
FUTUR
REDEMPTION
FORGIVENESS
FORGIVENESS
FORGIVENES
JUSTIFICATION
JUSTIFICATION
JUSTIFICATIO
SANCTIFICATION
SANCTIFICATION
SANCTIFICATIO
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LDS are mostly “Arminian:”
• TOTAL DEPRAVITY: LDS agree that
from start to finish God deserves all of
the credit & glory For all of man’s good
works & salvation.
• “For the natural man is an enemy to
God, and has been from the fall of
Adam, and will be, forever and ever,
unless he yields to the enticings of the
Holy Spirit,…” B. of M. Mosiah 3: 19.
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LDS are mostly “Arminian:”
• UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION: This is a
very complex and highly nuanced
doctrine for the LDS, (see slides #73 &
77). We agree with Milne that it must be
received with humility, never allowed to
interfere with universal evangelism,
repentance, or zeal, & understood in
relationship with the Bible’s clear
insistence on individual human
responsibility to love & obey God.
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LDS are mostly “Arminian:”
• LIMITED ATONEMENT: LDS agree with
Aquinas that Christ’s Atonement was not
only sufficient but superabundant for all of
the sins of the entire human race. We agree
with Luther that Christ’s Atonement was
sufficient for all but efficient, (effective) only
for those accepting it and exercising Faith
into Him. While we recognize that the
Atonement is efficacious only for the elect,
it was made for and is available to
“whosoever” is “believing into Him” John
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3:16 et. al. etc.
LDS are mostly “Arminian:”
• Irresistible Grace: It is an existential fact
known in the heart of all Christians that we
do in fact resist God’s Grace, (some of us
rejecting it altogether¹) rebelliously sinning
even as God accomplishes His great
redeeming and sanctifying work within us.
• It is a definitional fact that God’s Grace will
ultimately prove irresistible to God’s elect.
• LDS agree with Akin* “that, though God may
give efficacious Grace only to some, He 88
gives sufficient Grace to all.”
LDS are mostly “Arminian:”
• Perseverance of the Saints: It is definitionally
true that the elect of God are persevered by Him
to become such.
• It is an existential fact known in the heart of all
Christians that we do in fact resist God’s Grace,
retaining not only the ability but often the desire
to rebelliously sin and reject God¹ even as God
accomplishes His great redeeming and
sanctifying work within us.
• For LDS this is very much a matter of tense as
Christians do not start out this way, but may in
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this life have their calling & election made sure*.
The final occupation
of the saved in Christ:
• A fine point of high theology
having absolutely nothing to do
with: Salvation, 1st Gospel
principles, Christian behavior, The
Authority of Scripture, etc.
• Yet of significant interest to many
LDS and others concerned with
LDS theology.
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We believe:
• We believe what Paul said at Ro. 8:14-19, etc
• We believe what Peter said at 2 Pet. 1: 4, etc
• We believe what Jesus said at Matt. 5:9, 45,
48, 6:9, Lu. 15: 11-32, 22: 28-30, etc. He is
our Father & we are His children!
• We believe that it is very Biblical and reasonable that adopted Sons & Daughters, jointheirs, within the biblical culture & paradigm,
will in some sense receive a divine inherit91
ance & share in their Father’s occupation:
Working:
•
•
•
•
•
In His Vineyard
Harvesting His crops
Feeding His sheep
Building His Kingdom
Working together in His Eternal
Family.
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We do not believe
that we will ever be:
• Equal to God in any way.
• Independent of God in any way, (not
dependent on God in every way.)
• Saved apart from God’s grace through
Christ’s Atonement, shed blood, sacrificial
death, and ongoing ministry.
• We do not claim to know exactly what is
meant by “joint-heir,” but, typically, we
understand this central Biblical teaching 93
more literally than other Christians do.
Exclusivity claims
universalistic accusations:
• Tour of heaven joke…”we must be
quite here, these are the “___,” and
they think they are the only ones here!”
Many Communions tell this joke about
others, few fully rid themselves of this
heresy.
• Ironically, LDS are accused of being
Universalistic, as well as exclusivist.
• D&C 137 & 2 Ne. 9:27-41
disproves both.
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Qualities of LDS doctrines:
•
•
•
•
Biblical
Reasonable
Nuanced
Usually they are moderate,
meaning not the most extreme
example in modern Christianity.
• We rarely if ever occupy an outside
wall on the questions that divide
Christians.
95
Where do LDS fit within
Biblical Christianity?
Catholicism
Calvinists
Christianity
Armenians
Restorationists
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It is often hard to know where to
locate the LDS in Lewis’ “Hall of
Christendom”. We are:
• Fundamental in: Believing the Bible, chastity,
modesty, sobriety, charity, fidelity, industry,
frugality, etc. but we are not, for the most
part, “Young earth creationists”¹. We dance,
embrace modern science, medicine &
technology, celebrate cultural & national
holidays, educate, etc.
• Theologically Conservative, but we dissent
from some parts of some synods and
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Councils.
It is often hard to know where to
locate the LDS in Lewis’ “Hall of
Christendom”. We are:
• Born Again, but we believe this requires
renewal through repentance and sincere
participation in the Biblical Sacramental
Ordinances of Grace.
• Evangelical, but not toward a single
moment in time or a single act of belief.
We agree with McDonald, Lewis, &
Spurgeon that Christianity only offers a
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totally “new creation” in Christ.
It is often hard to know where to
locate the LDS in Lewis’ “Hall of
Christendom”. We are:
• Pentecostal, but these gifts, (healing
language, inspiration, etc.) usually
come to us, in addition to, & in
conjunction with, all that we can do.
• Restorationist, but not exclusive.
We differ from other Restorationists
in that we believe sincere Christians
from every Communion are jointheirs with Christ!
99
We have:
• Living Apostles & Prophets, but they
are not infallible: Eph 4:11-12, Gal.
2:11, etc.
• An open Cannon, but a closed
Doctrine.
• I honestly can’t think of a single
commonly disputed doctrine that ours
is the most extreme example of.
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Extra-Biblical-Extra-Doctrinal
Speculation:
• We do sometimes engage in speculation.
• This is normal for theologians and
physicists, but many LDS speculate a lot.
• Extra-biblical speculation is often
Extra-doctrinal speculation.
• Always when it concerns: Before “In the
Beginning", or after the Resurrection
and Final Judgment.
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“Mere Christianity”
by C.S. Lewis
• Lies at the very core of LDS theology,
psychology, philosophy, and culture.
• Either this is “Mere Christianity” or it
isn’t.
• If it is, LDS occupy a central room in
the larger Hall of Christendom.
• A room in which Christianity is at
the core, and a room at the
core of Christianity.
102
Are LDS “Orthodox” Christians?
• If “Mere Christianity” as presented
by C.S. Lewis, is orthodoxy, then
LDS are orthodox. If Orthodoxy is
something else, (Catholicism,
Calvinism, etc,) we are not. It is that
LDS
simple.
CHRISTIANS
“ARMIANIAN”
CHRISTIANS
“MERE”
CHRISTIANITY
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Who is to blame?
• One might ask: “Who is to blame for
inadequately instructing LDS in the
terminology of other Christians and
inadequately explaining LDS theology to
other Christians? We are.
• Partnering with Billy Graham ministries
in 1974 I discovered the need for LDS
ecumenical ministry. They did not know
that LDS are biblical Christians!
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Since then…
We have taught: LDS teachers and those who
teach their teachers. LDS leaders and those who
teach their leaders. In LDS homes, churches,
(meeting houses) seminaries, and Temples. I
have met and spoken with ministers and lay
leaders from many communions. Where I have
failed, the blame is mine alone. When teaching
LDS, frequently my focus is on faith, repentance,
Biblical authority and full salvation through
Christ’s Atoning sacrifice. Other matters often
must wait. Fortunately, we are saved by God’s
work, not by our works, nor by the adequacy of
our instruction. His Grace to us & through us,105
saves us!
The Verdict of the vast
majority everywhere today
& throughout all history!
The vast majority of people in every culture
in every time have believed in the presence of
a God who intervened; A God to whom they
prayed, a God who answered their prayers*.
Has nearly everyone, always, everywhere
been completely wrong about the one thing
that mattered the very most to them?¹ Over
time humanity has changed it’s mind about a
great many things. God is not one of them!
106
Including virtually all of the Most
respected Minds of all Humanity!¹
Abbas, Abelard, Abraham, Anaximander, Archimedes, Amphos
Augustine, Anaximenes, Aristotle, Arminius, Aquinas, Anselm,
Brahms, Barclays, Benedict, Boniface, Bonaventura, Bunyan,
Boethius, Buddha, Bede, Calvin, Columba, Constantine, Cyprian
Cyril, Catherines, Cajetan, Clements, Davids, Drake, Erasmus,
Erigena, Euler, Fechner, Flew¹, Galen, Gray, Gödel, Guttenberg,
Herschel, Hus, Hippocrates, Ignatius, Irenaeus, Jesus² John²,
Jung, Justin, Jerome, Kay, Kepler, Loyola, Lavoisier, Luther,
Maury, Moses, Mendel, Methodius, Nanak, Orosius, Polycarp,
Paul³ Patrick, Pelagius, Plato, Pythagoras, Peter, Quesnay,
Rheticus, Rayleigh, Rousseau, Socrates, Solomon, Sholes, Stoke
Thales, Tyndale, Uthman, Vladimir, von Braun, Waldo, Wycliffe
Vanderbilts, (all of the Bishops, Buddhist Dali Lamas, Caliphs,
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Hindu Sages & Popes) Xavier, Xenophon, Yadin, Zacharias…
Including virtually all of the Most
respected Minds of all Humanity!
Abel, Adams*, Ampe`re, Am tem, Athanasius, Avogadro, Bohr,
Bacon, Berkeley, Bragg, Bernoulli, Blackstone, Brewster, Boyle
Chiefs Joseph & Seattle, Clausius, Coulomb, Copernicus, Cicero
Cooke, Cuvier, Dante, Descartes, da Vinci, Dukes de Broglie,
Euclid, Eudoxos, Fahrenheit, Flemings, Fabriano, Faberge, Fry,
Fulton, Fox, Ford, Gama, Gandhi, Gauss, Koch, Hobbs, Hooke,
Harvard, Hudson Heisenberg, Huygens, Innocents, Jastrow,
Joule, Kierkegaard, Kant, Leibniz, Linnaeus, Locke, Mandela,
Maimondes, Michelangelo, Mill, Marcel, Mores, Newman,
Nostradamus, Newton, Osmund, Priestley, Pasteur, Pascal,
Paley¹, Rubens, Qianlong, Stanfords, Simpson, Sydenham,
Shakespeare, Simon, Smyth, Simons, Thomsons, Udine, Watts,
Wigner, Vancouver, Williams, Websters, Xerxes, Yales, Zazerski
Including virtually all of the Most
respected Minds of all Humanity!
Alcmaeon, Ambrose, Agassiz, Bells, Bruno, Budaeus, Buffon,
Cecil, Carnegie, Chesterton, Churchill, Cousteau, Columbus,
Celsius, Carver, Clovis, Dostoyevsky, Dickens, Dakin, Dirac,
Douglas, Dysons, Dostoyevsky, Edwards Faraday, Galvani, Gist,
Gosse, Higgs, Hamilton, Handel, Humboldt, Hutton, Helmholtz,
Hoyle, Ictinos, Johannsen, Kagawa, Kelvin, King, Knox, Lincoln,
Lin, Orm, Lister, Leeuwenhoek, Laplace, Lewis, Lyell, Milton,
McDonnell, Mendelssohn, Maxwell, Mozart, Nobel, Owen,
Parry, Paganini, Peacocke, Plantinga, Pratt, Qin, Polkinghorne,
Parsons, Ramanujan, Rembrandt, Rockefeller, Ray, Rutherford,
Smoot, Solzhenitsyn, Scotus, Stannard, Spenser, Swift, Spener,
Swinburne, Tolstoy, Tesla, Tertullian, Ussher, Van Dykes, Volta,
York, Washingtons,* Ximenes, Xuanzang, Xuanzong, Zwingli…109
Including virtually all of the Most
respected Minds of all Humanity!
Abdullah, Albertus, Alexanders, Aelfric, Armstrong, Antiochus,
Bach, Babbage, Barth, Booth, Becquerel, Collins, Chaucer, Davy
Chadwick, Diesel, Dovorak, Eliot, Ellis, Einthoven, Fleming,
Franklins, Florey, Galileo, Geiger, Graham, Guillaume, Henrys,
Hertz, Hills, Ibns, Hume, Irvings, Iqbal, Johnsons, Jacobi, Jasper
Kusch, Kapila, Kolbes, Kipling, Lawrence, Livingstone, Legendre
Lemaitre, Mohammeds, Moody, Medina, Morse, Nernst, Nible
Niebuhrs, Onions, Origen, Oppenheimers, Pachelbel, Paschal,
Penn, Pregl, Purcell, Quincy, Quesnel, Ramseys, Seuss, Raphael
Riemann, Sabatier, Spurgeon, Stephens, Smiths, Steno, Soddy,
Townsends, Tabari, Thielicke, Tolkein, Ulugh, Ulfilas, Van Gogh,
Virchow, Vivaldi, Wallace, Woolley, Wien, Walkers, Wesleys,
Xenocrates, Xenophanes Yersin, Yongle, Youngs, Zeiss,
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Zemlinsky, Zoroaster, Zworykin, Nearly ad infinitum!
Eph. 4:1-6
• Teaches us that there is one Body and one
Spirit, one Lord, one Faith, one baptism, one
Church & One God.
• It would be very helpful if we all remembered
that the One True Church of Christ, is a
heavenly, eternal organization, and not an
earthly, mortal organization.
Christ’s universal &
invisible Church
LDS
Christians
Non-LDS
Christians
111
Eph.4:11-16
Teaches us more and promises us
that God will continue to work in us
and through us until we all come to
a unity of the Faith…unto the full
measure of the statue of the
fullness of Christ.
112
Doxology:
“Surely there is a way for people of
goodwill who love God and have taken
upon themselves the name of Christ, to
stand together for the cause of Christ,
and against the forces of sin. In this we
have every right to be bold and believing,
for “If God be for us, who can be against
us?”(Romans 8:31)…Elder Jeffery
Holland, An LDS World-wide leader.
113
Doxology
“You (Non LDS Christians) serve and
preach, teach and labor in confidence, and
so do I. And in doing so, I believe we can
trust in the next verse from Romans as well:
“He that spared not his own Son, but
delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not
with Him also freely give us all things?” I
truly believe that if across the world we can
all try harder not to separate each other from
the “Love of Christ,” we will be “more than
conquerors through Him that loved us”
(Romans 8:32, 35, 37). Elder Jeffery
114
Holland, An LDS World-wide leader.
Doxology
“While we may never achieve perfect doctrinal
agreement on all points, shouldn’t we at least make
common cause in defense of our common orthodox
faith in Christ and belief in absolute truth?”¹
Mere Christianity is “The great level viaduct which
stands solidly over the dips and valleys of heresy and
apostasy through the years.”²
“In recent years the major Christian Churches have
taken steps towards reconciliation, but these
measures are fat too slow; the world is perishing a
hundred times more quickly. No one expects the
churches to merge or the revise all their doctrines, but
115
only to present a common front against atheism.”³
Doxology
Immediately after the end of WWII U.S.
Marines were stationed at Nagasaki to begin
the terrible & overwhelming job of burial &
reconstruction. Their duties were long
arduous & horrific. Some longed to be of
greater service. They noticed that the
Christian churches had been destroyed.
Christians from many denominations
volunteered during their off duty time to
rebuild the demolished churches. So great
was the language barrier that none of the GI’s
116
knew the denominations of the churches they
Doxology
were rebuilding. Many of the GI’s were the
only representatives of their denomination in
that city. So focused were they on their task
that often they never learned the affiliation of
the G.I’s who labored beside them. They all
knew the Master who they served. They all
knew the Lord who would be worshiped at the
buildings they were reconstructing from
absolute ruin. As the Marines left to return to
different denominations in different cities
117
across the U.S.,
Doxology
Japanese civilians who would worship in
different denominations gathered and sang,
“ONWARD CHRISTIAN SOLDERS”.
In spite of the barriers of language, culture, &
the horrible ravages of war generally and an
atomic bomb specifically, Christians united as
humble & grateful servants of a single Master.
Shall we do less?
118
Doxology
My dear brothers and sisters in Christ I
would stir up your hearts into a
remembrance of God’s covenants, and
mindful of His Glorious promises, let us
cherish that old rugged Cross, the
central truths of “Mere Christianity”, till
our trophies at last we lay down. Let us
cling to that old rugged Cross, and
exchange it some day for a crown!
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Testimony:
• That we will cling to the sacred
central truths of Christianity that we
all love, and know to be true, in love,
patience and humility, until all of His
promises are fulfilled, is my prayer.
• That He will fulfill them, is my
testimony, in the name of Jesus
Christ Amen.
• Closing hymn: “God be with you”.
• Closing prayer:
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