Operations Committee Meeting
October 19-20, 2011
Helena, Montana
Introductions
Chairman Greg Archie reviewed the agenda and introductions were done.
Agenda: Update Ops Committee membership and representation
Lessons learned – Fire Season 2011
Team Assignment Reviews – I.C.’s please come prepared to discuss your team assignments from a lessons learned
standpoint
Team Mobilizations – NRCC and Team Zones please review mobilizations (lessons learned)
NRCG Zones review and lessons learned
NRCG Committee updates, issues, concerns
Aviation
Business – Please discuss IC cost summary (request from Poncin)
Equipment
Fire Use/Fire Management
FPA
NAC
Prevention
Training
Recap of fire season safety – WW/Zachry
Planning for spring Team Meetings
Team Management – Re-apply? Recruitment, Other issues?
Hosting of Wildland Fire Management Teams
Update from Smokejumpers
Update from NR IHC’s
Operations Committee Chair
Update Ops Committee membership and representation
Zone Reps: South Central Zone-Bob Fry; Central Zone-Greg Archie; Eastern Zone-? ;North ID Zone-Mike Almas; NW Zone-Alan
Osborn; North Dakota Zone-Doug Downs; Southwest Zone-Louis Hartjes
Committee Reps: listed below under reports
Greg Archie- Will be posting information on the NRCG website for the Operations committee.
Lessons learned – Fire Season 2011
Team Assignments:
Eastern MT Heintz team – 2 assignments – Pre-order a generator and the equipment to have power and phones in order
to establish camp immediately; order a portable cell tower if possible-Communications is essential; Wisdom assignment
was as a semi-short team, prefer to go long and then demob personnel as soon as possible this allows the ICP to get set
up in a more timely manner; lag time in the cache management in getting supplies.
NR Type 1 Turman team- Wally Bennett – 2 assignments – both national; Liaison officers are key for national
assignments; spike camps with several hundred people require logistics being beefed up; Logistics are critical in the
boundary waters assignments and also get some local folks for sections; information is critical also; be prepared for
working with local resources and the issues in the boundary waters areas.
NR Type 1 Poncin team- 2 assignments – Rust will be an issue if you don’t get out regularly – Make sure you have
several communications solutions for phones and internet; challenge of 3 different delegations from different agencies;
had some issues with basic resource ordering; needed more liaisons to deal with issues nationally; public information
was high and needs to be ramped up immediately; treated the border patrol and other law agencies as a branch;
negotiated from a short team up to a long team with a few others and it worked with the exception of the people not
being ordered although they do understand the issues; need to discuss team length; don’t sign your name to a crew
extension until you check with the geographic area.
Western MT Fry team – Negotiated team size with the understanding we would demob ASAP and team was very good
with that mental adjustment; Developed an Assignment Specific Medical Emergency Action Plan and will have it posted
to the Lessons Learned website; Rust is a challenge when we are not ordered for 3 years in keeping up with
qualifications.
Operations Committee meeting minutes – NRCG
October 19th & 20th, 2011
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Eastern MT Benes team-John Thompson – 3 assignments – passed out a 2 page lessons learned – Struggled getting
personnel to the assignment when they aren’t on the initial order; finance packages were an issue when taking over an
incident from a transition, need to beef up finance to deal with it; Team staging was a challenge and we used it as a
training opportunity to learn; Follow up on all initial ordering with multiple dispatches; Supply ordering was an issue
and Logistics needs to engaged quicker; Team trailers were staged in various locations and worked well; Large phone
companies are not as responsive as small rural companies, utilize cell phones more; Facilities utilized a single potable
water tender for both showers and kitchen and had a good cost savings; Other complex incidents (all hazards) can affect
supplies; people and personalities make or break a team; challenge team members to higher standards.
Northern ID teams- Rick Kusicko – talked about both North ID teams lessons learned; Needed to fill assignments by
utilizing both team rosters to staff one team; communication issues similar to other lessons from other teams; team
review of accident procedures did help with an actual incident.
Wildland Fire teams- Diane Hutton – 4 assignments – Really went out to write long term plans on a couple of
assignments; fire policy was an issue for deciding the best process to manage wildland fires; challenge of going to a fire
assignment that didn’t really fit the capability of a wildland fire team; communications issues are major and may need to
be looked at by a committee in the off season to deal with the mobilization issue; utilized Google briefings to brief
multiple agencies and worked well; fire behavior models are not accurate for bug kill; National caterer numbers were an
issue.
Mobilization issues – Discussion about the process of ordering Wildland Fire teams and Type 2 teams. Clarification was
provided that the closest team in the 2 hour slots will be ordered for assignments within their areas, e.g. Eastern teams for
eastern fires, Western team for WMT fires, North ID teams for North ID fires. Also discussed the issue of Long Term
Planning issues. NRCC – Bob Gilman & Judy Heintz – Mobilization was discussed; 209s were discussed and the issues
creating by monitoring vs limited suppression; let NRCC know about roster issues before you get into 2 hour call; Judy
is working on the percentage of ADs on each team. Mark talked about the pre-orders being planned for both short and
long assignments and reviewed for the current fire policy; cache system had some issues for ordering and tracking, had
nothing to do with the ROSS; NRCG had Agency Reps utilized out of the GACC and it was well utilized.
Wally showed a powerpoint of the Boundary water fire dispatch to Ely, MN and discussed the lessons learned. Greg
shared one from the AZ dispatch.
End of Day 1
Start of Day 2
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Brad McBratney talked about the SW wildland management team – The team will be hosted by the Northern Rockies in
the future – Will need another NRs IC as Brad is not available during the fire season up here. Both Brad and Diane
would like to share a trainee IC.
NRCG Committee updates, issues, concerns
Aviation – No Update due to time limitations – Greg Poncin is the Operations committee rep to the Aviation committee
Business – Pam Okon – Discussed the Finance Chief situation – Business committee meeting in Helena Nov 1st and 2nd –
Discussed courses being held and will continue with finance piece during operations courses – Discussed preference for
the 260/261 courses and the format for holding them – Discussed the daily cost summary and how the questions and
information is utilized – Doug Turman is the Operations committee rep but Greg Archie will attend the November
meeting to cover for Doug
Equipment – Tim Murphy – Updated Equipment meeting from this week meeting – Dozer boss is changing to Heavy
Equipment bosses and ROSS recognizes it , quite a few HE boss trainees were trained recently – new 310-1 has a
position called an ICPI Incident Contract Project Inspector tied to the Procurement Unit Leader – ICPI trainings April
24th-26 and May 2nd-4th and will be listed in the NRTC calendar – handed out contractor solicitation information and
discussed it – need to get good performance evaluations especially on the good and bad performers - the contractor
issues with local FDs still exist - Rick Seidlitz is the Operations committee rep to the Equipment committee, Brett
Waters will be Rick’s backup
Fire Use/Fire Management – Brad McBratney discussed whether the committee needs to be listed, proposed dropping
the committee from the Operations committee – Committee has been dropped
FPA – No Update
NAC – Robert LaPlant discussed issues with Type 2 crews and Type 2 IA crews and is meeting with FMOs from
November 29th – Dec 1st and looking for IC support at the meeting.
Prevention – No current Operations rep identified to the Prevention committee
Training – Paul Fieldhouse – Travel costs are an issue for courses – 310-1 has been updated and one significant change
is taskbook experience from expired taskbooks can be utilized for new taskbooks – new currency criteria – National
Geographic training group is looking into resurrecting some wildland fire on-line training modules & how that relates to
Operations Committee meeting minutes – NRCG
October 19th & 20th, 2011
the taskbooks – Succession planning was discussed – Type 3 simulation evaluations for Federal USFS is being
discontinued – Training committee meeting in Mammoth next week – Will be a new outreach for Paul’s position as he
will be retiring soon – Training center’s mission is being discussed along the lines of having USFS training being a
major part of the mission and it was recommended that the Ops committee needs to be engaged in that discussion – S420 spreadsheet passed out and courses discussed – Passed out information sheet about a course which covers both S420 and L-480 and discussed it, the course will likely be held in the spring and sponsored by the Washington office – S520/620 candidates were discussed - Greg Archie is the Operations committee rep to the training committee
Recap of fire season safety – Wayne Williams
Wayne discussed work rest guidelines and driving guidelines which were updated in 2004 and reviewed them – weren’t
good briefings about the border safety issues Planning for spring Team Meetings
Team meeting dates are set for March 20th and 21st in Missoula for C&GS – If you are going to have your team meeting
in conjunction contact Judy Heintz at NRCC and let her know for logistical purposes.
Team Management – Re-apply – Recruitment - Other issues
Discussion about teams and the use of them, 2 Wildland Fire teams will be maintained to utilize the unique capabilities
and a white paper will be put together by Brad McBratney, Jess Secrest, and Diane Hutton to outline those characteristics
to the NRCG Board and Agency Administrators.
Poncin team discussed reapplying for the team and what strengths and weaknesses will likely look like. His team will be
reapplying this year
All ICs prior to December 1st will need to get Judy Heintz their weaknesses so they can be included in the application
process letter.
Turman team – Wally talked for Doug about team status – will go one more year before reapplying for the entire year
Heintz team – Brett talked for Tom about team status – In fairly good shape – right sizing is key
Fry team – Fry talked about team status – Operations has lots of people but no stability for coordination of the section
prior to dispatch and would like to resolve that
Benes team – John Thompson talked for Stan – stable will not need to reapply
Kusicko team – Rick will have the team reapplying – Logistics is the only question
Hutton team – Diane will need a trainee for plans and logistics and her Ops are both retiring
McBratney team – Brad will have his team reapplying – Operations will be short but has a long list of trainees –
everything seems to be ok
Update Ops Committee membership and representation
Zone Reps: South Central Zone-Bob Fry; Central Zone-Greg Archie; Eastern Zone- no one represented; North ID ZoneMike Almas ;NW Zone-Alan Osborn; ND Zone – Doug Downs; SW MT Zone-Louis Hartjes;
Update from Smokejumpers
No Update
Update from NR IHC’s
Fred Thompson – updated us about Hotshot crew status – issues with weight when flying to Alaska and crews need to
meet the weight limits and this issue will be discussed – Hotshots are training to deal with Incidents within Incidents and
are willing to be utilized more – Also interested in being involved in the Planning during an incident and utilized in more
diverse aspects in managing incidents. Brad McBratney will facilitate getting someone to talk at the HS meeting about
managing fires with multiple objectives.
Operations Committee Chair
Greg will continue as the Operations committee chair and Bob Fry will continue as the vice-chair.
NRCG Board meeting
Board would like to meet with the ICs at the November 15th and 16th Board meeting. Greg Poncin will represent the T-1
ICs, Stan Benes will for the Type 2 ICs.
Next meeting date and location
Operations Committee meeting minutes – NRCG
October 19th & 20th, 2011
The meeting will be on February 15th & 16th starting at 12pm. The location will be in the new training room at the Central Land
Office at DNRC Helena.
FOR INFORMATION ON DOCUMENTS CONTACT CHAIRMAN GREG ARCHIE AT garchie@mt.gov.
A SPREADSHEET CONTAINING THE ATTENDEES ACCOMPANIES THESE MINUTES.
Respectfully submitted,
Bob Fry
bob.fry@montanadma.org
Ops committee vice-chair
Operations Committee meeting minutes – NRCG
October 19th & 20th, 2011
NORTHERN ROCKIES COORDINATING GROUP OPERATIONS COMMITTEE
MEETING DATES: October 19TH & 20TH, 2011 MEETING LOCATION: HELENA, MT
ATTENDEES
REPRESENTING
EMAIL
19-Oct
Greg Archie
Chair, Central Zone Rep
garchie@mt.gov
X
Alan Osborn
Northwest Zone Rep
aosborn@fs.fed.us
X
Greg Poncin
NR IC
gponcin@mt.gov
X
Judy Heintz
NRCC
jheintz@blm.gov
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Tom Heintz
EMT IC
theintz@fs.fed.us
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Jess Secrest
EMT IC
jsecrest@fs.fed.us
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Patti Koppenol
NRCG Board
pkoppenol@fs.fed.us
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Bob Fry
SCZ Rep/NR WMT IC
bob.fry@montanadma.org
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Diane Hutton
NR WFMT IC
dhutton@fs.fed.us
X
John Monzie
DNRC
jmonzie@mt.gov
X
Wally Bennett
NR IC
wbennett@mt.gov
X
Bob Gilman
NR Fire Ops
rgilman@blm.gov
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Dave Larsen
MT DES
dlarsen@mt.gov
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Paul Fieldhouse
NR Training Center
pfieldhouse@fs.fed.us
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Rick Kusicko
NID IC
rkusicko@q.com
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Wayne Williams
MT DNRC
wwilliams@mt.gov
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Doug Downs
US FWS
doug_downs@fws.gov
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John Thompson
Benes IMT DIC
J75thomp@blm.gov
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Louis Hartjes
SWZ, FWS
louis_hartjes@fws.gov
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Tim Murphy
NRCG Equip Committee
timurphy@fs.fed.us
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Fred Thompson
USFS hotshot rep
fredthompson@fs.fed.us
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Mark Heppler
East side Dispatch/NR dispatch
mheppler@blm.gov
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Paul Grimstad
MT DES
pgrimstad@mt.gov
X
Mike Almas
North ID Zone rep
malmas@fs.fed.us
X
Brad McBratney
WFIC
bmcbratney@fs.fed.us
Brett Waters
EMT DIC
brettwaters1@gmail.com
X
Pam Okon
Business rep
pokon@mt.gov
X
Robert LaPlant
NRCC
Robert.laplant@blm.gov
X
Cobey Williamson
WMT Zone Dispatch
cowilliamson@mt.gov
X
Operations Committee meeting minutes – NRCG
October 19th & 20th, 2011
20-Oct
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